topic Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return? in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

HeraC312 — Tue, 02 May 2023 13:08:44 GMT

Clean card. AoOA is 25y, AAoA is 11y 9m and the AoYA is 8m, plus an inquiry of 8m from that new account. I knew I'd drop opening that account - went to 839 immediately, then up to 842 after 90 days and that's where it is now. Aside from the new card that was opened, all other accounts and factors remain consistently the same. Utilization is below 1% and AZEO, I rotate to keep last date of balance activity fresh within 6 months. Still a solid score but wondering when it might return to 850 - at 1y or will it be longer? Thanks! Edit to fix acronym.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

SouthJamaica — Tue, 02 May 2023 13:06:09 GMT

@HeraC312 wrote:
Clean card. AoAA is 25y, AAoA is 11y 9m and the AoYA is 8m, plus an inquiry of 8m from that new account. I knew I'd drop opening that account - went to 839 immediately, then up to 842 after 90 days and that's where it is now. Aside from the new card that was opened, all other accounts and factors remain consistently the same. Utilization is below 1% and AZEO, I rotate to keep last date of balance activity fresh within 6 months. Still a solid score but wondering when it might return to 850 - at 1y or will it be longer? Thanks!

Let me know when you find out.

I've never been in that stratosphere you inhabit.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

GZG — Tue, 02 May 2023 14:17:02 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@HeraC312 wrote:
Clean card. AoAA is 25y, AAoA is 11y 9m and the AoYA is 8m, plus an inquiry of 8m from that new account. I knew I'd drop opening that account - went to 839 immediately, then up to 842 after 90 days and that's where it is now. Aside from the new card that was opened, all other accounts and factors remain consistently the same. Utilization is below 1% and AZEO, I rotate to keep last date of balance activity fresh within 6 months. Still a solid score but wondering when it might return to 850 - at 1y or will it be longer? Thanks!
Let me know when you find out.

I've never been in that stratosphere you inhabit.

I wonder if you can be 850 in the new revolver scorecard

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

OmarR — Tue, 02 May 2023 14:32:47 GMT

Following.

I have pretty much almost the same profile, except its my EQ that is 850. Oldest account about 29yrs. I've always wondered if I would regain all my points back at the one year mark if I were to apply for a new card.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

NoHardLimits — Tue, 02 May 2023 16:34:15 GMT

I have Experian data points going back to when I first hit 850 nine years ago. During that period, I've had 5 different periods at 850. For each of those periods, everytime a new inquiry and/or new account appeared, my score dipped below 850 for roughly 13 months after my most recent new application. I would get all my points back during the 13th month, so that would likely either be due to a switch in scorecards from "new revolver" to "no new revolver" or simply age metrics at the 1 year point. This pattern occurred whether or not I had an open installment loan.

Edit: My biggest drop (not including accidental "all zero" periods) was down to 831 with 3 new accounts during the previous year.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

HeraC312 — Tue, 02 May 2023 23:43:49 GMT

Good info, thanks to everyone. I'll sit tight until October (13 months) and report back.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

Thomas_Thumb — Wed, 03 May 2023 03:40:42 GMT

@HeraC312 wrote:
Clean card. AoOA is 25y, AAoA is 11y 9m and the AoYA is 8m, plus an inquiry of 8m from that new account. I knew I'd drop opening that account - went to 839 immediately, then up to 842 after 90 days and that's where it is now. Still a solid score but wondering when it might return to 850 - at 1y or will it be longer? Thanks! Edit to fix acronym.

Another datapoint showing a score boost when youngest revolving account reaches 90 days. Quite a few posters have reported regaining some points when AOYA passes 3 months.

You are on the new accounts scorecard. Most likely AOYA will need to pass 12 months before you see 850 again.

Curious- what do you have for open installment loans?

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

Thomas_Thumb — Wed, 03 May 2023 03:39:17 GMT

@NoHardLimits wrote:
I have Experian data points going back to when I first hit 850 nine years ago. During that period, I've had 5 different periods at 850. For each of those periods, everytime a new inquiry and/or new account appeared, my score dipped below 850 for roughly 13 months after my most recent new application. I would get all my points back during the 13th month. This pattern occurred whether or not I had an open installment loan.

@NoHardLimits

It looks like you had a EX Fico 8 score of 850 without an open installment loan. Were you able to reach/hold 850 on EQ or TU without an open loan?

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

HeraC312 — Wed, 03 May 2023 12:16:03 GMT

Thanks for the input; here you go. All based on EX but the other CRs are nearly identical with reporting. EQ seems to hang on to closed accounts the longest. Two open installments and three closed: - mortgage that's 10yo and 32% paid off - Nelnet student loan that's 13yo and 50% paid off - two closed auto loans - one closed Nelnet student loan (The mortgage will be with me for another decade or so but Nelnet will be paid off the minute the interest freeze ends so I expect a temporary hit on that, as I experienced with the closing of the auto loans I'd co-signed. I'd received advice on an earlier thread that the mortgage would be enough 'installment' and I didn't need to prep with the NFCU secured installment trick. We'll see!) Revolvers; except for the HELOC the bankcards are AZEO'd on rotation with < 1% utilization on total limit of $106,400 - Chase Prime - $9,600 CL - Chase Freedom Unlimited - $17,900 CL - Chase Sapphire (newest account) - $21,900 CL - NFCU American Express - $30,000 CL - HELOC with $2 balance (so it doesn't get closed by the bank) - $20,000 CL - Home Depot/CBNA - $5,000 CL - Kohl's/Capone - $2,000 CL One HP, from Chase 8 months ago. Score factors: - Payment history 35% - Exceptional - Amount of debt 30% - Exceptional - Length of credit history 15% - Exceptional - Amount of new credit 10% - Good (previously Exceptional) - Credit mix 10% - Very Good (has always been this rating, even with the 850) Most impactful factors: - No missed payments, low revolving usage, recent credit card usage, substantial installment repayment

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

Thomas_Thumb — Wed, 03 May 2023 19:05:11 GMT

Thanks for the info.

Only one open installment loan is required to avoid the "no loan activity penalty". A mortgage works just fine and it buffers against score fluctuations. A mortgage is all I had while maintaining 850s on Fico 8 and Fico 9. Can't speak to Fico 10/10T.

As mentioned up thread 850s are achievable even without an open loan - just harder to maintain if that's important to you. I have been without any open loan for 3 years now. Scores fluctuate between 835 and 850. No real value in adding a SSL at this time.

However, I might add one .. Or something similiar a year before my closed mortgage falls off CRA reports. In the meantime closed loans are counting toward mix with Fico.

BTW - my mix was always very good as well. Never excellent/exceptional. I think you need atleast 11 open accounts of multiple types for an excellent rating. This has been a topic in a number of old threads.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

NoHardLimits — Wed, 03 May 2023 22:05:51 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@NoHardLimits wrote:
I have Experian data points going back to when I first hit 850 nine years ago. During that period, I've had 5 different periods at 850. For each of those periods, everytime a new inquiry and/or new account appeared, my score dipped below 850 for roughly 13 months after my most recent new application. I would get all my points back during the 13th month. This pattern occurred whether or not I had an open installment loan.
@NoHardLimits
It looks like you had a EX Fico 8 score of 850 without an open installment loan. Were you able to reach/hold 850 on EQ or TU without an open loan?

@Thomas_Thumb

My TU Fico8 scores never went back up to 850 after my last installment loan (a mortgage) was paid off. The highest score I've been able to achieve without an open loan is 841. My TU scores also fluctuate a lot more than my EX scores. I haven't identified an absolute pattern, but TU seems to be influenced more strongly by total revolving balance dollars.

My EQ datapoints are very sparse compare to EX and TU. I only regained access to free EQ Fico8 Classic scores a few months ago after a five year gap. I have a lot of version 8 Bankcard history, but that would be comparing apples to oranges. The last set of 850 datapoints I have from EQ Classic is from about seven years ago. At that time, it took 11 months to return to 850 after opening new accounts. I had an open loan during that period.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

Thomas_Thumb — Wed, 03 May 2023 22:59:42 GMT

Thanks for your clarification. TU is sensitive to # cards with balances, EX is not.

I usually report AZE3 or AZE4. Only reported AZE2 a couple times since my mortgage closed. Still, 850 is possible without an open loan. I first regained 850 on EX Fico 9 in 4/2021 after mortgage closed 12/2020. EX Fico 8 was 849. Hit 850 on EX Fico 8 with 2 cards reporting at a later date. Never regained 850 on TU Fico 8. Can't speak to the EQ 8/9 or TU 9 - I don't have access to those scores for free & I stopped buying 3B reports.

Fwiw now in 2023:

AoYA = 13 years

AAoA = 24 years

AoOA = 39 years

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

NoHardLimits — Wed, 03 May 2023 22:52:42 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
Thanks for your clarification. TU is sensitive to # cards with balances, EX is not.

I usually report AZE3 or AZE4. Only reported AZE2 a couple times since my mortgage closed. Still, 850 is possible without an open loan. I first regained 850 on EX Fico 9 in 4/2020 after mortgage closed 12/2019. EX Fico 8 was 849. Hit 850 on EX Fico 8 with 2 cards reporting at a later date. Never regained 850 on TU Fico 8. Can't speak to the EQ 8/9 or TU 9 - I don't have access to those scores for free & I stopped buying 3B reports.

Fwiw now in 2023:
AoYA = 13 years
AAoA = 24 years
AoOA = 39 years

@Thomas_Thumb

The main page for myFICO now includes a link to setup a free membership plan for EQ8 Classic. I signed up a few months ago. At the top of this webpage, click on the big myFICO logo at the top left corner. That should show you the costs for the paid plans. Find the tab that says "Free Plan" to the right of "Premium Plans".

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

HeraC312 — Thu, 04 May 2023 00:02:19 GMT

@NoHardLimits, thanks for the free EQ 8 tip!

Turns out I'm 850 with that one. On the Amount of New Credit metric, I get Very Good (rather than just Good with the EX 8 score.) Same reporting date on the new account, same age of 8m. Also, no HP ding on EQ because Chase only hit TU and EX for that new account.

Re: Was 850 EX 8, opened a new card - how long before I return?

fury1995 — Sun, 07 May 2023 23:27:13 GMT

@HeraC312 wrote:
Clean card. AoOA is 25y, AAoA is 11y 9m and the AoYA is 8m, plus an inquiry of 8m from that new account. I knew I'd drop opening that account - went to 839 immediately, then up to 842 after 90 days and that's where it is now. Aside from the new card that was opened, all other accounts and factors remain consistently the same. Utilization is below 1% and AZEO, I rotate to keep last date of balance activity fresh within 6 months. Still a solid score but wondering when it might return to 850 - at 1y or will it be longer? Thanks! Edit to fix acronym.

Coincidentally, you profile looks nearly identical to mine. I just opened a new account (last new account was July 2021.) FICO 9 has already returned to 850. My FICO 8 is the same as yours at 839. I maxed out at 850 without AZEO. I'm using AZEO after the new account reported to try and manipulate the new account reporting combined with AZEO to see if 850 can be achieved with a new account so recently. So far, it's worked on FICO 9.

Prior to account opening (EX and NOT AZEO, more tha one card reporting):

850 FICO SCORE8

850 FICO SCORE9

899 BankCard SCORE8

882 BankCard SCORE9

AoOA 30 yrs 0 mos

AAoA 9 yrs 1 mos

AoYA 1 yrs 7 mos

After new account reporting (EX, currently AZEO):

839 EX FICO SCORE8

850 FICO SCORE9

882 BankCard SCORE8

881 BankCard SCORE9

AoOA 30 yrs 3 mos

AAoA 9 yrs 4 mos

AoYA 1 mos