topic Re: Question About AZEO Limits in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Question About AZEO Limits

elboullee — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 00:19:53 GMT

Last month I let $220 report on a card with a $7K limit and total tradelines of $20K. No other balances of any kind, no lates, no misseds, 2 years of history, FICOs of 755, 765, and 770 [now also 765].

The other day EQ dinged me for 5 points saying that my "debt" went up by $220 as last month I let only $10 on one card report.

3% of one card's limit and 1/10 of 1% of all avaialble credit costs you 5 points? Really?

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jeffster1 — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 01:29:12 GMT

I have been practicing AZEO for almost 3 years. I leave a $3 balance month-to-month on my Savor One card. My total CLs reporting total around $230K. While I always PIF...aside from the $3...there are months where a greater balance reports on an additional card, such as when my $250 AF posts on one of my Amex cards. I have never experienced the month-to-month ding you are reporting.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

elboullee — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 01:40:00 GMT

And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jeffster1 — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 01:45:18 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.

Does the EQ monitoring on their website use Vantage scoring or FICO scoring? Vantage can be quite finicky. I monitor through MyFico and Experian. I haven't really paid attention to the EQ scoring on the EQ website via the free subscription so I can't recall.

The point loss does seem strange.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

elboullee — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 01:53:10 GMT

@Jeffster1 wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.
Does the EQ monitoring on their website use Vantage scoring or FICO scoring? Vantage can be quite finicky. I monitor through MyFico and Experian. I haven't really paid attention to the EQ scoring on the EQ website via the free subscription so I can't recall.

The point loss does seem strange.

Vantage on CK, both on their own site.

Last time I checked, my EQ Vantage was 775. My EQ FICO went from 770 to 765 so no great tragedy, but still weird.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jordan23ww — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 02:07:52 GMT

@Jeffster1 wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.
Does the EQ monitoring on their website use Vantage scoring or FICO scoring? Vantage can be quite finicky. I monitor through MyFico and Experian. I haven't really paid attention to the EQ scoring on the EQ website via the free subscription so I can't recall.

The point loss does seem strange.

@Jeffster1 @elboullee I was just about to say that sounds like some Vantage score shenanigans! I've been doing AZEO since 2020 and I've only seen stuff like this happen on reports with Vantage scores. On MyFico my scores aren't affected by small increases like this.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jordan23ww — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 02:10:08 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
@Jeffster1 wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.
Does the EQ monitoring on their website use Vantage scoring or FICO scoring? Vantage can be quite finicky. I monitor through MyFico and Experian. I haven't really paid attention to the EQ scoring on the EQ website via the free subscription so I can't recall.

The point loss does seem strange.
Vantage on CK, both on their own site.

Last time I checked, my EQ Vantage was 775. My EQ FICO went from 770 to 765 so no great tragedy, but still weird.

@elboullee for some reason the vantage scores seem to be a lot more sensitive than the Fico scores. I bet your Fico's didn't decrease at all. Your utilization is still below 9% and is in a great position. I do AZEO too and usually my scores don't go down when a balance under 9% utilization posts.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jeffster1 — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 04:55:43 GMT

@Jordan23ww wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
@Jeffster1 wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
And it's their reporting/monitoring service telling me that's specifically why it went down 5 points.

The only other thing that changed last month was getting a $5K CLI on my CFF - which I would have thought might actually increase my scores by 5 points or so.

Seems stupid, but there it is.
Does the EQ monitoring on their website use Vantage scoring or FICO scoring? Vantage can be quite finicky. I monitor through MyFico and Experian. I haven't really paid attention to the EQ scoring on the EQ website via the free subscription so I can't recall.

The point loss does seem strange.
Vantage on CK, both on their own site.

Last time I checked, my EQ Vantage was 775. My EQ FICO went from 770 to 765 so no great tragedy, but still weird.
@elboullee for some reason the vantage scores seem to be a lot more sensitive than the Fico scores. I bet your Fico's didn't decrease at all. Your utilization is still below 9% and is in a great position. I do AZEO too and usually my scores don't go down when a balance under 9% utilization posts.

@Jordan23ww 🎯🎯🎯🎯

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

SouthJamaica — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 05:40:14 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
Last month I let $220 report on a card with a $7K limit and total tradelines of $20K. No other balances of any kind, no lates, no misseds, 2 years of history, FICOs of 755, 765, and 770 [now also 765].

The other day EQ dinged me for 5 points saying that my "debt" went up by $220 as last month I let only $10 on one card report.

3% of one card's limit and 1/10 of 1% of all avaialble credit costs you 5 points? Really?

No. You don't know what cost the 5 points.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

elboullee — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 07:18:32 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:

You don't know what cost the 5 points.

Know for a fact - no, probably not.

But when only three things changed, and two of them were positive [total credit +$5K, AAoA/AoOA +1 month], then I think you can reasonably start to make some educated guesses.

And when EQ sends you a change-in-score alert email and says it's because "your total debt incresed from $10 last month to $220 this month", you put all that together and it isn't crazy to come to the conclusion that it's the $220 that did it.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Thomas_Thumb — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 15:41:03 GMT

The score drop smells like an inquiry. The impact of a new inquiry can be delayed 30 days depending on type. An increase in # cards reporting balances can have a similar impact on Fico score.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

SouthJamaica — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 19:35:58 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:

You don't know what cost the 5 points.
Know for a fact - no, probably not.

But when only three things changed, and two of them were positive [total credit +$5K, AAoA/AoOA +1 month], then I think you can reasonably start to make some educated guesses.

And when EQ sends you a change-in-score alert email and says it's because "your total debt incresed from $10 last month to $220 this month", you put all that together and it isn't crazy to come to the conclusion that it's the $220 that did it.

MyFICO alerts don't provide reasons for a score change. There are certain events which trigger MyFICO alerts. If there happens to be any difference between your present score at that particular bureau and the previous score reported to you from that bureau, the score change is tacked on to the alert. There is not necessarily any connection at all between the score change and the alert substance.

MyFICO explains this as follows:

Why did my score go up when I got an alert for something negative (or why did my score go down when I got an alert for something positive)?

The short answer: Your FICO® Score may change because of other events not monitored by an alert.

Whenever we send you a credit alert, we also send an updated FICO Score. To ensure you get the most current score, we calculate it based on your entire credit report at that point in time—not just the new information on the alert. This means your new score may reflect other changes that are outside of the things we watch for (see everything we monitor).

Sometimes you may see your score increase when you think it should’ve decreased, and vice-versa, but you’ll always have your most up-to-date and accurate score.
https://support.myfico.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038084633

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jordan23ww — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 19:46:30 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:

You don't know what cost the 5 points.
Know for a fact - no, probably not.

But when only three things changed, and two of them were positive [total credit +$5K, AAoA/AoOA +1 month], then I think you can reasonably start to make some educated guesses.

And when EQ sends you a change-in-score alert email and says it's because "your total debt incresed from $10 last month to $220 this month", you put all that together and it isn't crazy to come to the conclusion that it's the $220 that did it.
MyFICO alerts don't provide reasons for a score change. There are certain events which trigger MyFICO alerts. If there happens to be any difference between your present score at that particular bureau and the previous score reported to you from that bureau, the score change is tacked on to the alert. There is not necessarily any connection at all between the score change and the alert substance.

MyFICO explains this as follows:

Why did my score go up when I got an alert for something negative (or why did my score go down when I got an alert for something positive)?

The short answer: Your FICO® Score may change because of other events not monitored by an alert.

Whenever we send you a credit alert, we also send an updated FICO Score. To ensure you get the most current score, we calculate it based on your entire credit report at that point in time—not just the new information on the alert. This means your new score may reflect other changes that are outside of the things we watch for (see everything we monitor).

Sometimes you may see your score increase when you think it should’ve decreased, and vice-versa, but you’ll always have your most up-to-date and accurate score.
https://support.myfico.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038084633

@SouthJamaica just in case you missed it, this is a Vantage score the OP is asking about. I really think that's why they got this weird decrease in score. I was telling them in a different comment that the Vantage scores tend to be a lot more volatile at times to fluctuations, Fico scores don't always move in these situations though.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

SouthJamaica — Mon, 12 Feb 2024 19:53:21 GMT

@Jordan23ww wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:

You don't know what cost the 5 points.
Know for a fact - no, probably not.

But when only three things changed, and two of them were positive [total credit +$5K, AAoA/AoOA +1 month], then I think you can reasonably start to make some educated guesses.

And when EQ sends you a change-in-score alert email and says it's because "your total debt incresed from $10 last month to $220 this month", you put all that together and it isn't crazy to come to the conclusion that it's the $220 that did it.
MyFICO alerts don't provide reasons for a score change. There are certain events which trigger MyFICO alerts. If there happens to be any difference between your present score at that particular bureau and the previous score reported to you from that bureau, the score change is tacked on to the alert. There is not necessarily any connection at all between the score change and the alert substance.

MyFICO explains this as follows:

Why did my score go up when I got an alert for something negative (or why did my score go down when I got an alert for something positive)?

The short answer: Your FICO® Score may change because of other events not monitored by an alert.

Whenever we send you a credit alert, we also send an updated FICO Score. To ensure you get the most current score, we calculate it based on your entire credit report at that point in time—not just the new information on the alert. This means your new score may reflect other changes that are outside of the things we watch for (see everything we monitor).

Sometimes you may see your score increase when you think it should’ve decreased, and vice-versa, but you’ll always have your most up-to-date and accurate score.
https://support.myfico.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038084633
@SouthJamaica just in case you missed it, this is a Vantage score the OP is asking about. I really think that's why they got this weird decrease in score. I was telling them in a different comment that the Vantage scores tend to be a lot more volatile at times to fluctuations, Fico scores don't always move in these situations though.

Thanks. OP started out:

The other day EQ dinged me for 5 points saying that my "debt" went up by $220 as last month I let only $10 on one card report.

So the post is basically suggesting that because $220 reported, the EQ FICO went down 5 points. People could be very misled by posts like that, which mix apples and oranges.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

elboullee — Tue, 13 Feb 2024 04:58:28 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
So the post is basically suggesting that because $220 reported, the EQ FICO went down 5 points. People could be very misled by posts like that, which mix apples and oranges.

There was no "mixing of apples and oranges" on my part.

I made it clear that the five point dip was in my EQ FICO score. I don't pay much attention to Vantage - save for the fact that's what Chase shows me every time I open my banking app.

Another poster then suggested that perhaps I was looking at a Vantage score - which I wasn't.

And the alert I got wasn't from "MyFICO" as you claim - as I said, it was from EQ.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

SouthJamaica — Tue, 13 Feb 2024 18:57:47 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
So the post is basically suggesting that because $220 reported, the EQ FICO went down 5 points. People could be very misled by posts like that, which mix apples and oranges.
There was no "mixing of apples and oranges" on my part.

I made it clear that the five point dip was in my EQ FICO score. I don't pay much attention to Vantage - save for the fact that's what Chase shows me every time I open my banking app.

Another poster then suggested that perhaps I was looking at a Vantage score - which I wasn't.

And the alert I got wasn't from "MyFICO" as you claim - as I said, it was from EQ.

Sorry. I stand corrected.

It is highly doubtful that a $220 balance was the cause of the 5-point drop.

BTW I wasn't aware that Equifax sends alerts relating to FICO score changes. How does one get those?

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jordan23ww — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 01:05:18 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@Jordan23ww wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:

You don't know what cost the 5 points.
Know for a fact - no, probably not.

But when only three things changed, and two of them were positive [total credit +$5K, AAoA/AoOA +1 month], then I think you can reasonably start to make some educated guesses.

And when EQ sends you a change-in-score alert email and says it's because "your total debt incresed from $10 last month to $220 this month", you put all that together and it isn't crazy to come to the conclusion that it's the $220 that did it.
MyFICO alerts don't provide reasons for a score change. There are certain events which trigger MyFICO alerts. If there happens to be any difference between your present score at that particular bureau and the previous score reported to you from that bureau, the score change is tacked on to the alert. There is not necessarily any connection at all between the score change and the alert substance.

MyFICO explains this as follows:

Why did my score go up when I got an alert for something negative (or why did my score go down when I got an alert for something positive)?

The short answer: Your FICO® Score may change because of other events not monitored by an alert.

Whenever we send you a credit alert, we also send an updated FICO Score. To ensure you get the most current score, we calculate it based on your entire credit report at that point in time—not just the new information on the alert. This means your new score may reflect other changes that are outside of the things we watch for (see everything we monitor).

Sometimes you may see your score increase when you think it should’ve decreased, and vice-versa, but you’ll always have your most up-to-date and accurate score.
https://support.myfico.com/hc/en-us/articles/360038084633
@SouthJamaica just in case you missed it, this is a Vantage score the OP is asking about. I really think that's why they got this weird decrease in score. I was telling them in a different comment that the Vantage scores tend to be a lot more volatile at times to fluctuations, Fico scores don't always move in these situations though.
Thanks. OP started out:

Last month I let $220 report on a card with a $7K limit and total tradelines of $20K. No other balances of any kind, no lates, no misseds, 2 years of history, FICOs of 755, 765, and 770 [now also 765].
The other day EQ dinged me for 5 points saying that my "debt" went up by $220 as last month I let only $10 on one card report.

So the post is basically suggesting that because $220 reported, the EQ FICO went down 5 points. People could be very misled by posts like that, which mix apples and oranges.

@SouthJamaica you're right! I definitely can see people not realizing this was a Vantage score and not a Fico based on how the post was started.

Re: Question About AZEO Limits

Jordan23ww — Wed, 14 Feb 2024 01:09:28 GMT

@elboullee wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
So the post is basically suggesting that because $220 reported, the EQ FICO went down 5 points. People could be very misled by posts like that, which mix apples and oranges.
There was no "mixing of apples and oranges" on my part.

I made it clear that the five point dip was in my EQ FICO score. I don't pay much attention to Vantage - save for the fact that's what Chase shows me every time I open my banking app.

Another poster then suggested that perhaps I was looking at a Vantage score - which I wasn't.

And the alert I got wasn't from "MyFICO" as you claim - as I said, it was from EQ.

@elboullee my apologies, when I read one of your replies and you mentioned Credit Karma I misinterpreted what you were saying as this was your Vantage score that had dropped. So many times people will call their credit score by Vantage their Fico Score. I thought this was another one of those instances. @SouthJamaica my apologies for the misinformation.