topic Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you? in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Wed, 14 Aug 2024 21:20:28 GMT

I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24

07/17/24

08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

MissLiz — Wed, 14 Aug 2024 22:28:11 GMT

That's the first time I've read a creditor uses FICO10. I don't know about the SP's being used. I think that's just a reason they spit out. At least, I hope.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

Rebuild2019 — Wed, 14 Aug 2024 22:37:08 GMT

How often will US Bank give a CLI?

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Wed, 14 Aug 2024 22:45:53 GMT

@Rebuild2019 wrote:
How often will US Bank give a CLI?

I am under the impression you can ask whenever but I assume its 6 months but no guarantees, since credit did dry up and now its might be longer period.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

pizzadude — Wed, 14 Aug 2024 23:27:13 GMT

@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3

I'm not sure that these denial reasons listed are necessarily from FICO scoring -- lenders frequently add / remove from FICO scoring reasons and insert reasons from their own underwriting engines.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

Thomas_Thumb — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 03:53:17 GMT

@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3

Negative factors affecting your score are listed from highest impact to lowest. A 782 score is plenty high. My guess is you were denied due to the recent CLI and possibly utilization.

Denials typically require the lender to send a letter. The letters are often canned and include Fico info for show. The denial may have nothing to do with your score or the listed reasons.

Fico does not score soft inquiries. That being said your creditor from internal records will know how many soft inquiries they made. They can also see 3rd party hard inquiries. However, soft inquiries on your credit reports should not be visible to 3rd parties.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 13:51:14 GMT

@pizzadude wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3
I'm not sure that these denial reasons listed are necessarily from FICO scoring -- lenders frequently add / remove from FICO scoring reasons and insert reasons from their own underwriting engines.

These are from Fico 10 and they are appear in Fico 8 for reasons as well, expect for the Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

MissLiz — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 13:55:35 GMT

Straight from FICO:

https://www.myfico.com/credit-education/credit-reports/credit-checks-and-inquiries#:~:text=Soft%20inquiries%20such%20as%20viewing,mortgage%20will%20affect%20your%20score.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 13:56:21 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3
Negative factors affecting your score are listed from highest impact to lowest. A 782 score is plenty high. My guess is you were denied due to the recent CLI and possibly utilization.

Denials typically require the lender to send a letter. The letters are often canned and include Fico info for show. The denial may have nothing to do with your score or the listed reasons.

Fico does not score soft inquiries. That being said your creditor from internal records will know how many soft inquiries they made. They can also see 3rd party hard inquiries. However, soft inquiries on your credit reports should not be visible to 3rd parties.

So you understand I am aware of what you are saying. As for SP I am aware of that, but this is suspect Number of recent inquiries on consumer report?

US bank has internal letters that I have agreed to receive online and it is a legit denial letter

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 14:08:41 GMT

@MissLiz wrote:
Straight from FICO:
https://www.myfico.com/credit-education/credit-reports/credit-checks-and-inquiries#:~:text=Soft%20inquiries%20such%20as%20viewing,mortgage%20will%20affect%20your%20score.

Thanks very aware of INQ, but I havent applied or done any INQ for all 3 EX, EQ, TRANS in 5 yrs

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

Thomas_Thumb — Fri, 16 Aug 2024 02:34:36 GMT

@AzCreditGuy wrote:
@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report
Fico does not score soft inquiries. That being said your creditor from internal records will know how many soft inquiries they made. They can also see 3rd party hard inquiries. However, soft inquiries on your credit reports should not be visible to 3rd parties.

So you understand I am aware of what you are saying. As for SP I am aware of that, but this is suspect Number of recent inquiries on consumer report?

US bank has internal letters that I have agreed to receive online and it is a legit denial letter

You were denied because your lender chose to deny you for internal reasons such as a recent CLIs, increased card utilization or moving funds around. The bank has to tell you something. A Fico score with algorithm generated negative reason statements is SOP even if the statements don't tell the true reason.

I am not in a position to analyze your "SP" inquiries associated with CLI requests or fund transfers. Over the years I had 3 CLI requests end up being HPs.

Perhaps you need to get a credit report direct from the CRA. It will show your SPs and HPs. Check for HPs. Then contact Fico to confirm that SPs are not scored in Fico 10. Items that are not scored should not be listed as a negative reason. After all, the reasons list are items negatively impacting your score.

If Fico says soft inquiries hurt score with Fico 10, please let us know. Anyone can SP your file so that would be alarming.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

SouthJamaica — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 15:34:36 GMT

@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3

With all the identity fraud going on these days, if I were you I would be checking my TU report to confirm that there are not any inquiries.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

Rebuild2019 — Thu, 15 Aug 2024 22:49:10 GMT

Thanks @AzCreditGuy

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Fri, 16 Aug 2024 14:51:14 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report
Fico does not score soft inquiries. That being said your creditor from internal records will know how many soft inquiries they made. They can also see 3rd party hard inquiries. However, soft inquiries on your credit reports should not be visible to 3rd parties.

So you understand I am aware of what you are saying. As for SP I am aware of that, but this is suspect Number of recent inquiries on consumer report?

US bank has internal letters that I have agreed to receive online and it is a legit denial letter

You were denied because your lender chose to deny you for internal reasons such as a recent CLIs, increased card utilization or moving funds around. The bank has to tell you something. A Fico score with algorithm generated negative reason statements is SOP even if the statements don't tell the true reason.

I am not in a position to analyze your "SP" inquiries associated with CLI requests or fund transfers. Over the years I had 3 CLI requests end up being HPs.

Perhaps you need to get a credit report direct from the CRA. It will show your SPs and HPs. Check for HPs. Then contact Fico to confirm that SPs are not scored in Fico 10. Items that are not scored should not be listed as a negative reason. After all, the reasons list are items negatively impacting your score.

If Fico says soft inquiries hurt score with Fico 10, please let us know. Anyone can SP your file so that would be alarming.

I have alerts on all 3, trust me when my credit did get pulled I got emails. I also check my Experian every 5 days or so, since they are still allowing free ficos from all 3. I understand why the lender denied me, but I feel they are not the ones that put that suspected "Number of recent inquiries on consumer report" i also find this alarming and thats why I posted it here, to see if others have experienced this with Fico 10

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Fri, 16 Aug 2024 14:52:14 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

Your credit score is a number that reflects the information in your credit report. Your credit score can change,
depending on how the information in your credit report changes. We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report

I have had zero inquires for 5 years on all 3
With all the identity fraud going on these days, if I were you I would be checking my TU report to confirm that there are not any inquiries.

I get it but with all the recent fraud and hacks, I am on several alert systems that will tell me if I get pulls or issues.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

SouthJamaica — Fri, 16 Aug 2024 20:45:18 GMT

@AzCreditGuy wrote:
@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@AzCreditGuy wrote:
I didnt realize that US bank used Fico 10 for CLI? This is how the timeline follows for my CLI requests

04/22/24
07/17/24
08/12/24

Of course I got denied for a CLI since my last CLI was 04/22/24

The reasons:

We used a credit score provided by TransUnion in
this decision: the TransUnion FICO Score 10, which ranges in value from 300 to 850. On 07/24/2024 your credit
score was 782 based on the information in your credit report.
The key factors that impacted your score were:

Lack of recent installment loan information
Ratio of balances to revolve limits on revolving accounts is too high
Length of time revolving accounts have been established
Number of recent inquiries on consumer report
Fico does not score soft inquiries. That being said your creditor from internal records will know how many soft inquiries they made. They can also see 3rd party hard inquiries. However, soft inquiries on your credit reports should not be visible to 3rd parties.

So you understand I am aware of what you are saying. As for SP I am aware of that, but this is suspect Number of recent inquiries on consumer report?

US bank has internal letters that I have agreed to receive online and it is a legit denial letter

You were denied because your lender chose to deny you for internal reasons such as a recent CLIs, increased card utilization or moving funds around. The bank has to tell you something. A Fico score with algorithm generated negative reason statements is SOP even if the statements don't tell the true reason.

I am not in a position to analyze your "SP" inquiries associated with CLI requests or fund transfers. Over the years I had 3 CLI requests end up being HPs.

Perhaps you need to get a credit report direct from the CRA. It will show your SPs and HPs. Check for HPs. Then contact Fico to confirm that SPs are not scored in Fico 10. Items that are not scored should not be listed as a negative reason. After all, the reasons list are items negatively impacting your score.

If Fico says soft inquiries hurt score with Fico 10, please let us know. Anyone can SP your file so that would be alarming.

I have alerts on all 3, trust me when my credit did get pulled I got emails. I also check my Experian every 5 days or so, since they are still allowing free ficos from all 3. I understand why the lender denied me, but I feel they are not the ones that put that suspected "Number of recent inquiries on consumer report" i also find this alarming and thats why I posted it here, to see if others have experienced this with Fico 10

It's got nothing to do with the scoring model or FICO 10. And it has nothing to do with soft pulls. And you cannot rely on alerts.

If you're sincerely alarmed, you should get your full TU report and make sure there aren't any hard inquiries in there.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

IsambardPrince — Sun, 18 Aug 2024 07:22:24 GMT

Some banks just list a bunch of reasons that are utter crap and stick it in the mail.

You can't have too many hard pulls if there are 0 hard pulls, but if they want to deny you anyway I guess 0 can be too many.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

AzCreditGuy — Thu, 22 Aug 2024 00:27:09 GMT

I was able to get a full TU report as I had stated before 0 HP and the only SP from US bank is from 07/24/24. I find this interesting and something else a radiology lab back in 2022, did a SP on me? Even when run through insurance?

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

Thomas_Thumb — Thu, 22 Aug 2024 05:18:34 GMT

A medical SP is not surprising. I'm always reminded and asked to sign forms stating I am responsible for payment even though insured.

BTW - are you going to contact Fico regarding the reason statement relating to recent inquiries? If yes, the CSR you get will not have sufficient knowledge. Ask for a supervisor and say you would like some clarification on negatives listed by TransUnion.

Re: Fico 10 counts SP against you?

flan — Wed, 28 Aug 2024 01:42:43 GMT

The reason is 'number of inquiries', not 'too many'. 0 is a number, and yes that can be a reason to lower your score. scoring is complicated, and people who regularly get new credit and pay it off are, in at least some cases, better credit risks than people who don't. too regularly is bad, of course, but that's a different reason.