topic Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed in Understanding FICO® Scoring

You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Mythic850 — Fri, 23 May 2008 01:52:18 GMT

The other day I pulled my TransUnion FICO score here on myFICO. In the 'What's Hurting Your FICO Score' section it has:

You have too many credit accounts.
Number of your credit accounts currently paid as agreed

Your FICO score takes into account the number of accounts (such as credit cards or installment loans) on your credit report. You have a large number of accounts. In general, people who have a large number of accounts pose more of a risk to lenders than people with a moderate number of accounts.

What to do about this: Avoid opening more credit accounts at this time and as a general rule, if you don't need or plan to use credit, don't apply for it.

In the side bar, it has:

21 accounts
FICO High Achievers [?] have an average of 6 accounts currently paid as agreed.

When I look at the details for my accounts, only 10 of them are open. The other 11 are closed. 8 of them are paid off student loans--one for each your of school (undergrad and grad).

Can anyone explain why my score is being hurt because of the number of accounts, especially when they are closed (paid in full) student loans. Six of these were closed in 2000, the other two in 2005. All of the su

What's the justification for these dragging down my current FICO?

Is there anything that can be done about this "negative factor" or am I going to be penalized for two more years until these fall of the report?

This doesn't make any sense.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Fri, 23 May 2008 02:38:22 GMT

Unfortunately, there is nothing you can do about them. I agree it doesn't make a lot of sense, but that's the way it is. As counterintuitive as it may seem, too many total accounts, whether open or closed, has been shown to be a significant risk factor, which is why it's included in one's score.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

smallfry — Fri, 23 May 2008 09:21:03 GMT

What is your score? This sounds like it might be one of those reasons FICO pulls when there isn't much else if anything hurting your score. Over 760?

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Mythic850 — Fri, 23 May 2008 09:58:37 GMT

@smallfry wrote:
What is your score? This sounds like it might be one of those reasons FICO pulls when there isn't much else if anything hurting your score. Over 760?

I wish. It's TU 678. And believe me there's still plenty of concrete stuff hurting my score:

o 5 accounts with serious delinquency or derogatory description
o heavy use of available credit (18%, just paid it down to .5% tonight)
o 5 accounts showing missed payments or derogatory descriptions (24 total late payments)

In addition, I've opened 3 new TLs in the last year (one $28K auto loan). And, I still have two chargeoffs reporting (one 4 years ago, one last year).

At least the five collections (PFD) and one charge off (aged off) are gone (TU was 617 on 2/22).

Was I rebucketed?

I just reviewed an older report (4/30) with 2 collections and saw this:

What’s helping your FICO® score?
You have many accounts that are in good standing. (9)

TU FICO was 648 on 4/30 with two collections
TU FICO was 678 on 5/8 with no collections

On the former, number of accounts (9) currently paid as agreed (open accounts) is helping my score. On the latter, the number of accounts (21) paid as agreed (open and closed accounts) is hurting my score.

Message Edited by Mythic850 on 05-23-2008 02:58 AM

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Fri, 23 May 2008 11:20:34 GMT

OP, I'm glad you posted this because I would like to know why also! Another thing that bothers me is when an account/tl is transferred to another bank and the old account stays as well as the new one so you get dinged for 2 when it is really 1!!!!! This happened to me when my mortgage was sold, when my cap 1 was sold to lowes and when I moved and transferred my electric......

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Fri, 23 May 2008 13:00:46 GMT

IMO- Mythic850

You are getting this because of the ratio of Good accounts to Negative accounts-

Just keep paying on-time and keep your utl low-

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Junejer — Fri, 23 May 2008 15:02:38 GMT

Mythic, I agree with Timothy. Also, you were rebucketed. Went from collections to no collections.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Fri, 23 May 2008 18:42:42 GMT

I don't think it's the ratio. I also have the "too many accounts paid as agreed" message on TU with only 13 total accounts, all positive.

I tend to think it's related to some sort of "too many accounts in relation to your short history" factor, as ByrdMan suggested to me on a thread where I posted this a few months ago.

ETA: Score is 744 on a completely clean report, and the only things FICO complains about are my short history, my short revolving history, and the fact that my 13 accounts are "too many."

Message Edited by cheddar on 05-23-2008 11:42 AM

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

smallfry — Fri, 23 May 2008 19:06:33 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I don't think it's the ratio. I also have the "too many accounts paid as agreed" message on TU with only 13 total accounts, all positive.
I tend to think it's related to some sort of "too many accounts in relation to your short history" factor, as ByrdMan suggested to me on a thread where I posted this a few months ago.
ETA: Score is 744 on a completely clean report, and the only things FICO complains about are my short history, my short revolving history, and the fact that my 13 accounts are "too many."

Message Edited by cheddar on 05-23-2008 11:42 AM

What is your average age of accounts?

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Mythic850 — Fri, 23 May 2008 19:51:56 GMT

@smallfry wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I don't think it's the ratio. I also have the "too many accounts paid as agreed" message on TU with only 13 total accounts, all positive.
I tend to think it's related to some sort of "too many accounts in relation to your short history" factor, as ByrdMan suggested to me on a thread where I posted this a few months ago.
ETA: Score is 744 on a completely clean report, and the only things FICO complains about are my short history, my short revolving history, and the fact that my 13 accounts are "too many."
Message Edited by cheddar on 05-23-2008 11:42 AM
What is your average age of accounts?

From the same report, the "What's helping your scores" shows:

1: You have an established credit history.
Your oldest account was opened 22 Years, 11 Months ago
Average age of your accounts 9 years

2: No public records or collections.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Fri, 23 May 2008 20:19:40 GMT

@smallfry wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

I don't think it's the ratio. I also have the "too many accounts paid as agreed" message on TU with only 13 total accounts, all positive.

I tend to think it's related to some sort of "too many accounts in relation to your short history" factor, as ByrdMan suggested to me on a thread where I posted this a few months ago.

ETA: Score is 744 on a completely clean report, and the only things FICO complains about are my short history, my short revolving history, and the fact that my 13 accounts are "too many."

Message Edited by cheddar on 05-23-2008 11:42 AM

What is your average age of accounts?

13 months.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Junejer — Fri, 23 May 2008 21:57:59 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:

I don't think it's the ratio. I also have the "too many accounts paid as agreed" message on TU with only 13 total accounts, all positive.

I tend to think it's related to some sort of "too many accounts in relation to your short history" factor, as ByrdMan suggested to me on a thread where I posted this a few months ago.

ETA: Score is 744 on a completely clean report, and the only things FICO complains about are my short history, my short revolving history, and the fact that my 13 accounts are "too many."

Message Edited by cheddar on 05-23-2008 11:42 AM

How quickly we forget.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

RobertEG — Sat, 24 May 2008 03:44:09 GMT

I wish that FairIsaac would clarify this continuing confusion for all of us.

FairIsaac recently and emphatically stated in their recent webinars that it is a complete fallacy that there is such as thing as too much revolving credit, or that it would have any negative impact on FICO score. But what that statement does not address is whether having 3 or 30 cards contributing to that credit is scored differently in any significanat way.

I still do not have a fix on whether the "What's hurting your FICO score" comments attached to credit score reports are generated directly by FairIsaac based upon definitive affects from their actual scoring algorithm, or whether they are second or third party evaluations based on their own, and separate, observations.

Does anyone have any info on this?

Message Edited by RobertEG on 05-23-2008 08:44 PM

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Anonymous — Sat, 24 May 2008 03:49:24 GMT

RobertEG wrote:

I still do not have a fix on whether the "What's hurting your FICO score" comments attached to credit score reports are generated directly by FairIsaac based upon definitive affects from their actual scoring algorithm, or whether they are second or third party evaluations based on their own, and separate, observations.

Does anyone have any info on this?

Those statements on myFICO reports come directly from FI, and are based on the actual algorithm used to generate that particular score.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

RobertEG — Sat, 24 May 2008 04:01:15 GMT

Thanks, Cheddar! That is important to know. It gives them some credibility in my mind. But it opens up the question as to why, if they are based on the actual FI scoring algorithm, do they so often contradict themselves, even in the same score report? We all see it over and over.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Junejer — Sat, 24 May 2008 20:17:55 GMT

Yeah, it may seem that way. It seems like after there is nothing to yell at you about, that the reasons just get crazier and crazier. Here is that list of reason codes from each of the CRAs again.

http://ficoforums.myfico.com/fico/board/message?board.id=ficoscoring&message.id=17061#M17061

R- Revolving (usually a credit card)
I - installment (like home or auto loan)
R1 or I1 = pays as agreed never late
R2 or I2 = 30 days late
R3 or I3 = 60 days late
R4 or I4 = 90 days late
R5 or I5 = 120 days late
R7 or I7 = making regular payments under wage earner plan
R8 or I8 = repossession
R9 or I9 = charge off
EQUIFAX - BEACON Score Codes
00039 - serious delinquency
00038 - serious delinquency, and derogatory public record or collection filed
00034 - amount owed on delinquent accounts
00033 - proportion of loan balances to loan amounts is too high
00032 - lack of recent information loan information
00030 - time since most recent account opening is too short
00024 - no recent revolving balances
00023 - number of bank or national revolving accounts with balances
00020 - length of time since derogatory public record or collection is too short
00019 - too few accounts currently paid as agreed
00018 - number of accounts with delinquency
00016 - lack of recent revolving account information
00015 - lack of recent bank revolving information
00014 - length of time accounts have been established
00013 - time since delinquency is too recent or unknown
00012 - length of time revolving accounts have been established
00011 - amount owed on revolving account is too high
00010 - proportion of balances to credit limits is too high on bank revolving or other revolving accounts
00009 - too many accounts recently opened
00008 - too many inquiries last 12 months
00006 - too many consumer finance company accounts
00005 - too many accounts with balances
00002 - level of delinquency on accounts
00001 - amount owed on accounts is too high
O - beacon not available, no recently reported account information
FA - number of inquiries adversely affected the score, but not significantly
TRANSUNION - EMPIRICA Score Codes
040 - derogatory public record or collection filed
039 - serious delinquency
038 - serious delinquency, and public record or collection filed
030 - time since most recent account opening is too short
029 - no recent bankcard balances
028 - number of established accounts
027 - too few accounts currently paid as agreed
024 - no recent revolving balances
021 - amount past due on accounts
020 - length of time since derogatory public record or collection is too short
018 - number of accounts with delinquency
017 - no recent non-mortgage balance information
016 - lack of recent revolving account information
015 - lack of recent bank revolving information
014 - length of time accounts have been established
013 - time since delinquency is too recent or unknown
012 - length of time revolving accounts have been established
010 - proportion of balances to credit limits is too high on bank revolving or other revolving accounts
009 - too many accounts recently opened
008 - too many inquiries last 12 months
006 - too many consumer finance company accounts
005 - too many accounts with balances
003 - proportion of loan balances to loan amounts is too high
002 - level of delinquency on accounts
001 - amount owed on accounts too high
- file not scored because subject does not have sufficient credit
FA - in addition to the factors listed above, the number of inquiries on the consumer's credit file has adversely affected the credit score
EXPERIAN - FAIR ISAAC Score Codes
40 - derogatory public record or collection field
39 - serious delinquency
38 - serious delinquency and public record or collection filed
33 - proportion of current loan balance to original loan amount
32 - no recent installment loan information
24 - lack of recently reported balances on revolving/open accounts
21 - amount past due to accounts
20 - length of time since legal item filed or collection item reported
18 - number of accounts delinquent
16 - insufficient or lack of revolving account information
15 - insufficient or lack of bank revolving account information
14 - length of time accounts have been established
13 - length of time (or unknown time) since account delinquent
12 - length of revolving account history
10 - proportion of balance to high credit on bank revolving or all revolving accounts
09 - number of accounts opened within the last 12 months
08 - number of recent inquiries
06 - number of finance company accounts
05 - number of accounts with balances
02 - delinquency reported on accounts
01 - current balances on accounts
9002 - the profile report does not contain any tradeline which satisfies both of the following: status date within the last six (6) months or a balance within the last six (6) months. does not contain disputed information
- risk score not calculated due to lack of credit history

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

marty56 — Sat, 24 May 2008 22:09:43 GMT

Great list. I like 027 - too few accounts currently paid as agreed. I wonder what too few means. Seems funny to me.

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Junejer — Sun, 25 May 2008 02:26:52 GMT

@marty56 wrote:

Great list. I like 027 - too few accounts currently paid as agreed. I wonder what too few means. Seems funny to me.

You would think that they could've worded that better huh?

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

RobertEG — Sun, 25 May 2008 02:39:23 GMT

After reading your post, I understand from supreme authority that FI has established a new code 27A that reads:

027A - too many accounts currently paid as agreed.

That way, alll bases will always be covered with feces, with no possible escape!

Re: You have too many credit accounts. --> 21 total: 10 open, 11 closed

Junejer — Sun, 25 May 2008 02:47:57 GMT

@RobertEG wrote:

After reading your post, I understand from supreme authority that FI has established a new code 27A that reads:
027A - too many accounts currently paid as agreed.

That way, alll bases will always be covered with feces, with no possible escape!

ROFL. RobbySaprano, that was the funniest thing that I ever read from you. I love it.