topic Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic???? in Understanding FICO® Scoring

TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:22:36 GMT

I have been trying to buy a house since Feb. I was 6 pts away from qualifying at that time and my TU score was the highest of the 3. At the time my bureau was reporting 3 credit cards over the limit, 1 past due and 2 closed accounts so I decided to pay off the 3 over limits and of course made payments on time and reopened 1 of the closed accounts. I reapplied for a mortgage last week and to my complete dismay...my TU score dropped 48 points!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! There is NO new negative information, all accounts are accurately reporting and are identical with all 3 bureaus and 3 are at a 0 balance. My scores improved 14 Pts with EX and 2 Pts with EQ. Now I do not qualify at all!!!!! Please help!!

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

medicgrrl — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 16:37:34 GMT

Were both TU scores given to you by your mortgage lender? You have 1 cc reporting a small balance?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Mon, 27 Jul 2009 18:11:46 GMT

Yes, both scores given by lender. Was the fico score. The balance on the one card was $3114 in Feb and is now $2657, so it went down and the others are reporting 0. I have a copy of my Feb report and the July report and there are NO other differences other than what I stated????

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

medicgrrl — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 12:29:44 GMT

What negative items do you have on your report? I have had score drops due to a CO updating and also a CA updated to show 120 days past due. Have any of the reporting dates updated on your baddies?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 15:48:20 GMT

The ONLY negative items were there in Feb and again, NO new info except for 0 balances or lower balances. I have compared line by line and that is it!! That is why I am baffled and beyond upset!

What are my options?? there is nothing to dispute since nothing is reported incorrectly????

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

llecs — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 16:10:35 GMT

Welcome to the forums...sorry it had to be for this.

Couple of questions:

Was the score pulled in February and the score pulled now from the exact same lender? Can you verify that it is the same formula? I ask because per TU, there are two, nearly-equally used FICO formulas used by lenders. One is TU 98 and the other TU04. To confuse things, there's also TU08. Not every lender uses the same formula and lenders are switching all the time to TU04. It would be worth comparing on the docs the lender provided for you.

Medicgrrl hinted at your baddies. I know you looked line-by-line, but look at the dates within those baddies. If the reported date or DOLA date changed from February's CR to now, your score can possibly drop by that much.

Look at the CCs reporting $0. Make sure the TL is still listed as "open". A closed CC removes itself from utilization and that would cause your % to increase and your score to drop.

I'd pay that one CC with a balance down below 9% to get more points.

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:02:59 GMT

Ok, this is going from BAD to WORSE!! The mortgage company is the same, the credit agency they used is the same and now on top of everything thing else they pulled another report and it has went down AGAIN!!!!!!!!! We did pay the balance on the Bank of America card from $3117 to $351, that just updated today, however the score went down with Equifax from 614 to 589, and it went up from 628 to 659 with Experian. TU is the same because they haven't updated anything yet.

When I say nightmare it is beyond comprehension. We are supposed to close the loan in 3 wks, the mortgage company has approved me pending this score because they do not understand it either.

The original report was as follows in Feb:

TU: 616, EX: 614, EQ: 587

All accounts were over limit, 2 were closed, 1 was 120 days past due and $4887 Total Revolving.

TODAY:

TU: 572, EX: 659, EQ: 589

Now ALL accounts have been on time, 3 are at 0 Balance and Bank of America CC is @ $351.

PLEASE help me understand?? We did the Fico Simulator, I am paying all the different monitoring companies, I don't know what to do or how to find out what is going on?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 18:44:35 GMT

I stand corrected, Equifax went from 587 to 571!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

llecs — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 20:33:17 GMT

rnk wrote:
TODAY:
TU: 572, EX: 659, EQ: 589

You pulled new scores today. Where did you pull them from?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Wed, 29 Jul 2009 21:30:51 GMT

The same mortgage company pulled the credit. Is there ANY one to talk to that may can shed some light on the Fico scoring model? Also, the inquiries are hurting us because the mortgage company is pulling the credit, at least according to the file that is what they have said.

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 14:32:26 GMT

Did your bank reduce your lines of credit after you paid down the CCs?

I would pull my own scores off of MyFico. If anything else to see what the explanations behind your current scores are. Also, for my own peace of mind that the bank has the right info...

Best of luck.

Message Edited by BornAgainConsumer on 07-30-2009 07:32 AM

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 14:47:02 GMT

Hi rnk!

Obviously, something changed in between each lender pull where a different score was reported, if your lender maintains that they used the exact same scoring model. So, more questions:

Do you have any collection accounts listed on your credit reports? What is the DOLA currently reported for each collection account?
In your efforts to obtain mortgage financing, did you recently pay any collection accounts, whereas the balance updated to $0/paid?
From your credit reports, what is the listed credit line and current balance on each revolving credit line? Have your credit limits changed since paying down your cards. For example, did you get a CLD after paying down your debt on any cards? Were any of these accounts closed?
You mentioned that you re-opened a previously closed card. Did the CC issuer insert a new tradeline for the reopened account? Meaning that there are now two tradelines (one opened, and one closed) for this account.

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:20:42 GMT

No, there were NO changes on the Credit lines, I have pulled my bureau every day from all three and have followed them dilligently.

There is No information that has changed other than balances and all are reporting as of July.

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 15:31:49 GMT

Do you have any collection accounts listed on your credit reports? What is the DOLA currently reported for each collection account? NO, NONE AT ALL
In your efforts to obtain mortgage financing, did you recently pay any collection accounts, whereas the balance updated to $0/paid? N/A
From your credit reports, what is the listed credit line and current balance on each revolving credit line? Have your credit limits changed since paying down your cards. For example, did you get a CLD after paying down your debt on any cards? Were any of these accounts closed? HSBC: $300/$39, HSBC: $500/$90, CAP 1: $300/$0, BOA: CLOSED Bal was $3116/$351
You mentioned that you re-opened a previously closed card. Did the CC issuer insert a new tradeline for the reopened account? Meaning that there are now two tradelines (one opened, and one closed) for this account. They did NOT list as new tradeline, only updated from Closed to Open and updated the balance.

I have been watching, comparing like a hawk, and oddly enough each bureau is reporting identical info which is not always the case. The last activity is July for all accounts and there have been NO changes other than balance decreases and inquiries due to the mortgage company pulling the report a few times to see if the score has increased. They have pulled at least 7 inquiries BUT those are within the 30 day frame and are only supposed to count as 1????

I promise that I am NOT exaggerating or embelishing. I wish I could find a discrepancy that could explain?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 16:58:11 GMT

Do you have copies of your credit report from before and after you had the score decreases? If so, can you reprint (minus any personally identifying information such as your account number) the tradelines for your BoA account, *exactly* as they appear on your credit report?

rnk wrote:
Do you have any collection accounts listed on your credit reports? What is the DOLA currently reported for each collection account? NO, NONE AT ALL
In your efforts to obtain mortgage financing, did you recently pay any collection accounts, whereas the balance updated to $0/paid? N/A
From your credit reports, what is the listed credit line and current balance on each revolving credit line? Have your credit limits changed since paying down your cards. For example, did you get a CLD after paying down your debt on any cards? Were any of these accounts closed? HSBC: $300/$39, HSBC: $500/$90, CAP 1: $300/$0, BOA: CLOSED Bal was $3116/$351
You mentioned that you re-opened a previously closed card. Did the CC issuer insert a new tradeline for the reopened account? Meaning that there are now two tradelines (one opened, and one closed) for this account. They did NOT list as new tradeline, only updated from Closed to Open and updated the balance.

I have been watching, comparing like a hawk, and oddly enough each bureau is reporting identical info which is not always the case. The last activity is July for all accounts and there have been NO changes other than balance decreases and inquiries due to the mortgage company pulling the report a few times to see if the score has increased. They have pulled at least 7 inquiries BUT those are within the 30 day frame and are only supposed to count as 1????

I promise that I am NOT exaggerating or embelishing. I wish I could find a discrepancy that could explain?

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:35:39 GMT

As of: 07/28/2009 Report Does Not Update

Your FICO® score as of July 28, 2009 is:

Not Good

589

Open Accounts CAPITAL ONE Equifax TransUnion Experian

Account Type:

Revolving Revolving Account Number: 41217424XXXX 41217424XXXX

Payment Responsibility:

Individual Individual Date Opened: 09/2004 09/2004

Balance Date:

07/2009 07/2009 Balance Amount: $0 $0

Monthly Payment:

High/Limit: $300 $741 Account Status: As Agreed As Agreed Past Due Amount: $0 $0

Comments:

LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 11/2008=R2 CREDIT CARD AMT IN HIGH CREDIT IS CREDIT LIMIT LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 11/2008=R2 Show Details
HOUSEHOLD BANK Equifax TransUnion Experian

Account Type:

Revolving Revolving Revolving Account Number: 09000547XXXX 46630900XXXX 000547XXXX

Payment Responsibility:

Individual Individual Individual Date Opened: 06/2006 06/2006 06/2006

Balance Date:

06/2009 06/2009 06/2009 Balance Amount: $140 $140 $140

Monthly Payment:

$0 $0 High/Limit: $300 $531 $531 Account Status: As Agreed As Agreed As Agreed Past Due Amount: $0 $0 $0

Comments:

LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 02/2009=R2 CONSUMER DISPUTES THIS ACCOUNT INFORMATION CREDIT CARD LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 02/2009=R3,01/2009=R2 ACCT INFO DISPUTED MEETS FCRA OPEN CURRENT ACCOUNT/WAS DELINQUENT 60 DAYS PAST DUE DATE LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 02/2009=R ,01/2009=R ACCOUNT INFORMATION DISPUTED BY CONSUMER Show Details
HOUSEHOLD CREDIT SERVICES Equifax TransUnion Experian

Account Type:

Revolving Revolving Account Number: 45502988XXXX 54404550XXXX

Payment Responsibility:

Individual Individual Date Opened: 08/2005 08/2005

Balance Date:

06/2009 06/2009 Balance Amount: $0 $0

Monthly Payment:

High/Limit: $500 $951 Account Status: As Agreed As Agreed Past Due Amount: $0 $0

Comments:

LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 02/2009=R5,01/2009=R4,12/2008=R3 CONSUMER DISPUTES AFTER RESOLUTION CREDIT CARD DISPUTE RESOLVED-CUSTOMER DISAGREES LAST REPORTED DELINQUENCIES: 02/2009=R5,01/2009=R4,12/2008=R3 Show Details
Closed Accounts Bank of America Equifax TransUnion Experian

Account Type:

Revolving Revolving Revolving Account Number: XXXX XXXX XXXX

Payment Responsibility:

Individual Individual Individual Date Opened: 09/2005 09/2005 09/2005

Balance Date:

07/2009 07/2009 07/2009 Balance Amount: $2,751 $2,751 $2,751

Monthly Payment:

$90 $90 $90 High/Limit: $3,500 $4,022 $4,022 Account Status: As Agreed As Agreed As Agreed Past Due Amount: $0 $0 $0

Comments:

ACCOUNT CLOSED AT CONSUMER S REQUEST ACCOUNT CLOSED BY CREDIT GRANTOR ACCOUNT CLOSED BY CONSUMER CLOSED CURRENT ACCOUNT ACCOUNT CLOSED BY CONSUMER Show Details

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:44:29 GMT

This is the Bureau from Today: Score is 572

Open Accounts Account Name Account Number Date Opened Balance Date Reported Past Due Account Status Credit Limit CAPITAL ONE
BANK USA
Hide Details 09/2004 $0 07/2009 $0 PAYS AS AGREED $300 CAPITAL ONE

Account Number: Current Status: PAYS AS AGREED Account Owner: Individual Account. High Credit: $741 Type of Account : Revolving Credit Limit: $300 Term Duration: Terms Frequency: Monthly (due every month) Date Opened: 2004/09 Balance: $0 Date Reported: 07/2009 Amount Past Due: $0 Date of Last Payment: 06/2009 Actual Payment Amount: $125 Scheduled Payment Amount: $0 Date of Last Activity: 06/2009 Date Major Delinquency First Reported: Months Reviewed: 56 Creditor Classification: Activity Description: N/A Charge Off Amount: $0 Deferred Payment Start Date: Balloon Payment Amount: $0 Balloon Payment Date: Date Closed: Type of Loan: Credit Card Date of First Delinquency: N/A Comments: Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec 2009 * * * * * * 2008 * * * * * * * * * * 30 * 2007 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2006 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2005 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2004 * * * *

Payment History Key

HSBC BANK
Hide Details 06/2006 $39 07/2009 $0 PAYS AS AGREED $300 HOUSEHOLD BANK

Account Number: Current Status: PAYS AS AGREED Account Owner: Individual Account. High Credit: $531 Type of Account : Revolving Credit Limit: $300 Term Duration: Terms Frequency: Monthly (due every month) Date Opened: 2006/06 Balance: $39 Date Reported: 07/2009 Amount Past Due: $0 Date of Last Payment: 07/2009 Actual Payment Amount: $264 Scheduled Payment Amount: $0 Date of Last Activity: 06/2009 Date Major Delinquency First Reported: Months Reviewed: 31 Creditor Classification: Activity Description: N/A Charge Off Amount: $0 Deferred Payment Start Date: Balloon Payment Amount: $0 Balloon Payment Date: Date Closed: Type of Loan: Credit Card Date of First Delinquency: N/A Comments: Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec 2009 * 30 * * * * 2008 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2007 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2006 * * * * * * *

Payment History Key

HSBC BANK
Hide Details 08/2005 $60 07/2009 $0 PAYS AS AGREED $500 HOUSEHOLD CREDIT SERVICES

Account Number: Current Status: PAYS AS AGREED Account Owner: Individual Account. High Credit: $951 Type of Account : Revolving Credit Limit: $500 Term Duration: Terms Frequency: Monthly (due every month) Date Opened: 2005/08 Balance: $60 Date Reported: 07/2009 Amount Past Due: $0 Date of Last Payment: 07/2009 Actual Payment Amount: $60 Scheduled Payment Amount: $0 Date of Last Activity: 04/2009 Date Major Delinquency First Reported: Months Reviewed: 40 Creditor Classification: Activity Description: N/A Charge Off Amount: $0 Deferred Payment Start Date: Balloon Payment Amount: $0 Balloon Payment Date: Date Closed: Type of Loan: Credit Card Date of First Delinquency: N/A Comments: Year Jan Feb Mar Apr May Jun Jul Aug Sep Oct Nov Dec 2009 90 120 * * * * 2008 * * * * * * * * * * * 60 2007 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2006 * * * * * * * * * * * * 2005 * * * * *

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Thu, 30 Jul 2009 19:45:49 GMT

This is Continued to include Bank of America

Closed Accounts Account Name Account Number Date Opened Balance Date Reported Past Due Account Status Credit Limit BANK OF AMER
ICA
Hide Details 4356023301
23XXXX 09/2005 $351 07/2009 $0 PAYS AS AGREED $3,500 Bank of America

4060 Ogletown Stanton Rd
Newark, DE-197133102
(800) 421-2110

Account Number: 435602330123XXXX Current Status: PAYS AS AGREED Account Owner: Individual Account. High Credit: $4,022 Type of Account : Revolving Credit Limit: $3,500 Term Duration: Terms Frequency: Monthly (due every month) Date Opened: 2005/09 Balance: $351 Date Reported: 07/2009 Amount Past Due: $0 Date of Last Payment: 07/2009 Actual Payment Amount: $104 Scheduled Payment Amount: $90 Date of Last Activity: 07/2009 Date Major Delinquency First Reported: Months Reviewed: 44 Creditor Classification: Activity Description: N/A Charge Off Amount: $0 Deferred Payment Start Date: Balloon Payment Amount: $0 Balloon Payment Date: Date Closed: 07/2009 Type of Loan: Credit Card Date of First Delinquency: N/A Comments: Account closed by credit grantor

Re: TU Score Nightmare defies logic????

Anonymous — Fri, 31 Jul 2009 20:07:16 GMT

rnk,

It appears that the problem with your score drop could be related to the disputes on several accounts where you had recent lates. Those recent lates would hurt your score significantly. While the accounts were in dispute, those lates and your utilization would, temporarily, not factor into your score. Once the accounts were no longer in dispute, the lates and 40% utilization now come back to factor in.

I think that your best bet for gaining some points is to payoff the closed BoA account to get your utilization way down. Then, you may want to try goodwilling those lates, at least, the most recent ones.