topic Re: Credit Sesame in Understanding FICO® Scoring

Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 01:14:24 GMT

This is an Experain credit monitoring site. It offers a free credit score., They make it clear that it is not FICO but some of the web pages indicate it is a FICO silmuation (what ever that might mean).

Does anyone know if it is a Simulator or whether it is just a repackaging of an existing non FICO (I hate the term FAKO).

B TW I Wish it wasa real FICO. I got an 840. I would be happy with that score fora FICO.

Re: Credit Sesame

haulingthescoreup — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 21:28:05 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
THis is an Experain credit monitoring site. It offers a free credit score., They make it clear that it is not FICo but some of the web pages indicate it isa FICO silmuation (what ever that might mean).

Does anyone know if it isa Simulator or wherthr it is justa repackaging of an existing non FICO (I hate the term FAKO).

B TW I Wish it wasa real FICO. I got an 840. I would be happy with that score fora FICO.

Unless EX is (illegally) applying the FICO scoring formula in some way, it is a "repackaging of an existing non FICO", as you put it, or who knows, possible a brand spanking new non FICO.

I mean, I could announce that I was a "simulation" of Angelina Jolie, but I doubt that anyone would be convinced. Same species, same gender, but...

Re: Credit Sesame

GregB — Thu, 28 Jul 2011 21:39:17 GMT

It does state that the info is provided by Experian and the amounts of all balances match my Experian report from earlier today. Score and Score Range seems to be very different from the usual EX Plus nonsense.

It recatagorizes some of my accounts into categories that are different than any reports I have ever seen. Utilization percentage is WAY off. Since they have the balances correct, to come up with their 24% utilization would require my available limits to be increased by $250K+. The only way that adds up is if they were including the equity in my house. Since they do "value" my house, that seems possible.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 01:13:32 GMT

So no one knows I guess.

Re: Credit Sesame

RobertEG — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 01:26:39 GMT

The FICO scoring algorithm is a proprietary trade secret of Fair Isaac, and there is simply no way, outside of one having access to their trade secrets, for anyone to "simulate" a secret. To suggest so implies some direct correlation between their scoring algorithm and that used by FICO.

To my knowledge, no one has yet reverse-engineered their algorithms, so no one can claim any correlation to a scoring algorithm of which they are not privy.

Unless they can lay such a claim, and thus take on a legal battle that would ensue from obtaining trade-secret information, the discussion is kinda silly.

An apple is a fruit, but few would attempt to sell an apple as a simulation of an orange.

Re: Credit Sesame

haulingthescoreup — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 01:48:53 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
So no one knows I guess.

If it's not a FICO, it's not a FICO.

Nothing necessarily wrong with non-FICO's, other than that they don't tell you how lenders view you, and they often give advice that, if followed, would hurt your FICO's.

And it's perfectly fine to follow non-FICO's. It's just that we have so many people here who post that their blah-blah score was a 733, and their lender pulled a 647, and why, and on and on. It's like deciding to listen to classical music, but someone asks you questions about jazz, and you're lost.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 16:53:52 GMT

Hi All,

I work for Credit Sesame as the credit and lending information manager so I'm very familiar with the score we offer and how we represent the it. We do not say that we offer a FICO simulation. In fact, our FAQ it clearly states that we offer Experian's National Equivalency Score and that it is not a FICO score. The Experian NES, like other "educational" credit scores, is not a FICO score and does not pretend to estimate your FICO score.

Here's our FAQ:

Credit Questions What is a credit score and where did you get it?

Your credit score is number that indicates your creditworthiness. Credit Scores are based on credit report and your personal credit history recorded by credit bureaus. Banks and credit bureaus examine all of your credit and debt information and give you a score: the higher the number, the better the score.
Credit Sesame uses Experian's National Equivalency Score (not FICO) to give consumers a better idea of their credit standing.

Let me know if you have any quesitons.

Re: Credit Sesame

GregB — Fri, 29 Jul 2011 17:27:33 GMT

twahl,

I do see that now but I think there was some misleading info fairly recently. I'm fairly sure I saw some reference to "FICO" on the site. I do see that the site clearly says "beta" on it so I assume it is still being modified into its final release.

It might be worth chasing the bizzare Credit Usage that I see on my account. Do we know how that amount is calculated?

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 00:44:44 GMT

I believe there are references to a "FICO simulatr" (hence the original question) but not to FICO itslelf.

Now we know what it is.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 01:48:50 GMT

GregB,

I've been here before we launched and honestly don't remember any confusing references to FICO but I guess it's possible. The site is officially in beta but the site is fully functional. It just doesn't offer all of the features that we'd like to have built in at this point.

The issue with the credit usage is definitely a bug that we are aware of but there are so many other priorities that we have not gotten to that one yet. I know for me it includes the credit limit of my HELOC into the denominator but does not add the balance on the HELOC into the numerator throwing the usage off. Would that make sense for your issue as well?

It's probably a good time to devote some resources to fixing the problem because we are working some related features to give user better information regarding score factors.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 02:02:33 GMT

This is from the similar Credit Sesame? thread from a few months ago

Because DH just had an EX FICO pulled by a lender, I thought I'd log in to see what this Sesame site has to say.

DH's EX FICO is below average at 702; Sesame has it way off - at a lovely and nicely above average 753 (wish it was)! Hey that's only 51 points off Their FAKO score is very misleading. Their advice is worse.

Their recommendation was to refinance my home at, interestingly enough, the existing rate, and to include my auto loan and my PIF but balance-reporting cards. Of course, it's very shaky reasoning that recommends you put your house on the line to pay off cc's and auto loans.

They also posted APR's on several of our low APR cards at 30%. Funny. On the other hand, Macy's which is an outrageous 24.99% was listed at 10%.

I also don’t like that they demand your annual income. That’s not public record and I don’t give it out. They demanded it – and I fudged it.

If anything, it was reassuring that our ducks are in a row – at least in their view – which I guess isn’t all that reassuring anyway. Our cc's are at zero, our car loan is great - we wouldn't move either of those onto a mortgage ever. So they had nothing to offer me.

Security warnings on every page. I personally would avoid these guys. Sometimes pretty charts cause a guy to crumble, but hold out for sites with solid information and sites that won't ask you for personal info in order to market their items to you. IMO - This site is a potential cash cow for them - not helpful to you. And it asks too much of you in return.

And, JIC you're wondering, you don't actually see your report. At least I didn't see mine and I wandered around aimlessly for awhile. If it's there, I missed it.
And I made sure to delete my account before logging off.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 17:14:30 GMT

Actually all I ever intended for this thread to be was a way to find out whether the score shown was some Experian sore other than FICO or the result of some simulator. that was it. I am sorry it became yet another place to put down all "FAKO" scores or to look at the recommendations of Credit Sesame. it was justa simple question about the source of the score.

Re: Credit Sesame

haulingthescoreup — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 18:48:45 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Actually all I ever intended for this thread to be was a way to find out whether the score shown was some Experian sore other than FICO or the result of some simulator. that was it. I am sorry it became yet another place to put down all "FAKO" scores or to look at the recommendations of Credit Sesame. it was justa simple question about the source of the score.

Sorry for my contribution to any TJ. I was a little confused by your reference to a FICO simulator.

Re: Credit Sesame

Anonymous — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 20:37:22 GMT

There are references on the credit seame site yo the score being a "FICO simulator" henceforth my use of that terma when asking what it is and whether it is just that or an established , or new Experain credit score. I was just curious about what it is. that has been answered now and that answer is supported bya link to a differnt page on the CS site.

Sorry If I seemed harsh but sometimes every thread becomes a place to regurgitate the idea that only FICO is good and that you can only get FICO from certain sources.. i don't dispute that I just don't see how it is relevant

Re: Credit Sesame

haulingthescoreup — Tue, 02 Aug 2011 21:10:18 GMT

I hear ya on that. I suppose that one reason is because although longer-term members know about non-FICO scores and the fact that they react differently to credit report changes (due to different scoring formulas), most newbies don't, and they do a lot of reading when they first get here. It never fails that someone will read about a non-FICO score, get all excited, and be off and running, especially when a pull from a lender gives a totally different score.

It kinda wears many members out to try to untangle these (understandably) confused folks, so it's very possible that we react, ummm, over-enthusiastically on a thread that starts discussing non-FICO scores. I can certainly see how it would feel like piling on!

Not to mention that the actual FICO simulator itself baffles many people...

Anyway, sorry again for any derailing on my part!

eta: and as I re-read this, I can see that it might look like I'm still keeping it going. Sorry, that was absolutely not my intent.