topic Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster? in General Credit Topics

Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 14:23:37 GMT

So we co-signed on D-20's car last month. She really, REALLY needed a safe reliable vehicle & bioMom was unwilling to cosign. (I suspect it was more unable b/c of credit problems than unwilling) but either way, she wouldn't do it.

Now S-22 wants a parent to be guarantor on a lease for him. He's 22, just getting out of the AF & going back to finish college. Again, bioMom said no, says she doesn't want to be stuck with something on her credit (again, I think it's more that she's worried about not being approved, but that is just speculation). We are *maybe* willing to say yes, but on the condition that he give us our own "deposit" equiv to about 1 month's rent, so that we can follow up w/ the complex after he moves out & already have HIS money on hand to pay any final expenses... ensuring it DOESN'T end up on our credit.

I don't think S-22 would have approached us if he didn't know that D-20 hadn't just gotten the car through us. DH feels guilted into signing because he doesn't want them to do the immature, but very natural "that's not FAIR!" thing on him. He's been gone most of their life & is only now in the position to start helping out like this, so feels secretly he has to make up for the lost TIME with extra MONEY.

I feel like S-22 is a MAN now. He just had 4 yrs in the air force. He's about to be a sophomore in college. He'll have steady income from the GI Bill. BUT he wants to live in the newest, snazziest (media room & a freakin' Lazy River pool! WTF?) college apartments. He says he wants a 2-br, so that he won't have "the party atmosphere" at HIS place, but I kinda feel like he shouldn't be living there at all... why doesn't he go for a quiet, older place that's maybe not as whiz-bang exciting, but will *cost less* and be completely removed from the so-called "party atmosphere"?

At age 22, do we really have any say at this point, as to where he moves? I mean, we're all adults here, so are we past the point of imposing restrictions on what we'll be guarantor, and where? I just feel like he'd have more chance for success in a quieter, older (uglier) apartment that won't attract quite as many writhing hormonal freshmen.. he's 22, for goodness' sake! Shouldn't he be getting over that stage anyway?

Or am I completely off the mark?

BTW, I'm only 26 so it's odd enough having a stepson 4 yrs my junior.. but at 22 I had two kids, was working full-time and dreaming of the day when I could have a stable enough income to set up a savings account.. so maybe I don't know what "normal" is for a 22-yo...

Message Edited by ivyalmighty on 09-26-2008 07:23 AM

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 14:30:54 GMT

Have you thought about talking to him about your concerns and perhaps offering him a "deal?"

Perhaps, like, if he takes a more sensible apartment for a year and gets good grades (to prove to you that he's taking all of this seriously) that you'll help him with the snazzier apartment for the year after?

I'd look at it this way, really: The car you co-signed for for DD ... was it a Porsche? Was it an Escalade? Or was it RELIABLE and COST-EFFECTIVE? What was the determining criteria for the car? Since I know you to be a sane and intelligent woman (and your DH simply MUST be sane and intelligent as well, to have married you!!), I doubt seriously that "snazzy" or "flashy" was the criteria in choosing the car.

Yannow, I highly doubt the car you chose had a "Lazy River!"

Perhaps if you let him know that you'll help him get the "car" equivalent of an apartment (safe, reliable, reasonable, cost-effective, etc), he won't see it as "unfair."

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 14:34:17 GMT

BTW, forgot to add: Hell YEAH you're being reasonable!!

And as long as YOU'RE expected to co-sign WHERE he lives, I'd say that you have a helluva "say" in this. It's YOUR siggie that he needs to make it a reality.

Hell, Darlin', if he were mine, I'd make him come to the house and do chores on the weekends. I'd put in stipulations like a frickin' curfew. But then again, my kids DO say I'm mean.

You're in the right. Nuff said.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 18:15:37 GMT

THANK YOU Wonderin'. You put into words exactly what I felt, but couldn't form!

And no, her car does NOT have a "Lazy River" lol... it's an '04 Escape, the only real upgrade is that it has a sunroof.

We have until mid-December to hash it out with him. I will give my DH the talking points you mentioned about reliable & cost-effective. The other thing I want to throw in for him to chew on is, the apartments he's looking at come completely furnished.. but at 22 yrs old, he needs to start getting some furniture of his own, so a partially furnished (and not bells'n'whistles) place will allow him to start amassing some stuff of his own. Sounds reasonable, no?

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 18:30:48 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
THANK YOU Wonderin'. You put into words exactly what I felt, but couldn't form!
And no, her car does NOT have a "Lazy River" lol... it's an '04 Escape, the only real upgrade is that it has a sunroof.
We have until mid-December to hash it out with him. I will give my DH the talking points you mentioned about reliable & cost-effective. The other thing I want to throw in for him to chew on is, the apartments he's looking at come completely furnished.. but at 22 yrs old, he needs to start getting some furniture of his own, so a partially furnished (and not bells'n'whistles) place will allow him to start amassing some stuff of his own. Sounds reasonable, no?

Darlin' I'm the wrong one to ask about reasonable!! Frankly, I think that if you're willing to sign on the dotted line for him, he ought to accept whatever YOU decide!!

Let's just put it this way: You're so generous, I'm trying to figure out a way to convince you to adopt ME!!

Seriously, you're being more than reasonable. I was brought up to believe that really, all you NEED is a roof, a place to sleep (rocks make decent pillows if you find a fairly even surface), and some food in your tummy. You're offering him far more than that. He ought to be as grateful as grateful can be!

'Sides, think about the spartan living conditions monks lived in -- then think about the great, beautiful works of art they created. If you've never seen their lettering art, you ain't seen nothin'! Spartan conditions spark creativity!

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 18:59:08 GMT

Well spanks, Wonderin... I'm exploring the line (lol, with DH's kids, using them as my gerbils until my two 7 & 4, are older) between crippling them with too much help and crippling them by letting them slam face-first into the real world.. my parents did the latter, and that's the reason I had a 454 FICO at age 24!!! I don't want that for them!

But I also don't want to be incapacitatingly hepful, thereby just prolong the agony & have them end up with a 450 FICO at age 30, because we didn't put our foot down & cut off the softer-landing gear til they're 29!

...hopefully by the time the younger set age up, we'll have it figured out..

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Miner — Fri, 26 Sep 2008 20:56:07 GMT

When I went to UCLA (88-93), I had to have roommates to afford the rent and we never had to get a parent to cosign. Apartments that regularly rent to college students know they often don't have very long credit historys. If he needs a cosigner, then I have to ask about where he is trying to rent from.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 00:01:41 GMT

I'm with ya. I lived with my parents through college and commuted which was still cheaper than living in a dorm.. Now that I have a real job I live in an older one-bedroom apartment beside the folks on SS I'm thankful my parents taught me how to deal with money and to live within my means. He should be so busy between studying and working that he has no time to admire a snazzy apartment or use a lazy river.. haha

I would imagine it is a hard spot for you to be in. Hopefully you all can find a compromise that works. I don't think an extra layer of security deposit is being at all unreasonable, nor is requiring a cheaper apartment if you're going to be guarantor. If he has steady income I guess I don't understand why he needs a guarantor to begin with..

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 14:02:38 GMT

When I left Active duty at 22- (with a wife and a 8 month old baby) my credit was not perfect and we got turned down at a few places. I was done with the whole partying thing.

I would have never even thought about asking my parents to co-sign on an apt.

It took several years for me after leaving active duty to get back to school (I did graduate top of my class when I did). My kids yelling each time my name was announced was one of my finest hours.

I would advise against the college apt- if he can. Nothing that is a part of the school. He will find a reasonable apt that is close to school that will not require a co-signer and it will be cheaper and less restrictive on his activities.

If he insists on the Apt- you are entitled to set your terms.

Message Edited by Timothy on 09-27-2008 07:02 AM

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

CodeMonkey — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 19:06:10 GMT

I lived in a (very small) dorm with a roommate all four years of university.

I didn't get my first apartment until I graduated and went to law school.

At the time I was - shall we say - slightly underwhelmed at the prospect of having to live in a dorm room the size of a typical gas station restroom.

But, it was one less thing I had to worry about - rent, maintenance, paperwork, etc. - and in the end it really helped me focus on my studies, and make some friends too.

As others have said, you have every right to dictate your terms if he's asking you to co-sign.

You might want to ask him to reflect on his priorities and goals in attending college, and understand why living in such a nice apartment is so important to him in light of those things.

Edited to add: of course, he is 22 - and if he can convince you after some reflection that he has a legitimate reason for an apartment like this - does he have a family? - backing him on it may be the right way to go. Definitely a tough call.

Good luck!

Message Edited by CodeMonkey on 09-27-2008 12:06 PM

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 21:38:36 GMT

RE: Needing a co-signer.. it's pretty standard these days, for the big built-for-the-college apartment complexes. I had it when I was in college in 2000..

They build the complexes w/ 3-br, 3-ba units, and 4-ba, 4-br units... each room/bathroom has its own individual lease (to prevent being stuck if your roommates bail on the lease) and the kitchen & living room are considered the "common area." This is the style ap't I had when I was in college, and they're becoming more common as builders cash in on the college crowd. It also affords protection to the realtors who manage the complex, b/c they have individual leases so they're raking in more $$ & preventing any finger-pointing over repairs.

He's looking at a 2br, 2ba in this style of complex, saying he doesn't want 2-3 roommates b/c the partying won't be as easy to control when they're all bringing different people over.

I don't count on him getting in a dorm, esp as a sophomore. The whole reason I had to get an apartment as a freshman was b/c FSU waaaay overbooked the dorms (standard practice for big schools) assuming not everyone they accepted would show up.. well, everyone did, and I ended up with 1100 other kids on the waiting list, despite the fact that I had already spent the semester before in the dorms!!!! I had to get an apartment a week & a half before classes started. I really don't want him OR us to be scrambling come the week before the semester, when we find out the dorms are full.

We've got a few more months to explore the options. I don't want him getting screwed if another roommate messes up, but I also don't want him living in a big orgy. Which is what the big pretty-boy college-plexes are. Which is why I was trashed every day, and then pregnant exactly nine weeks after my lease in the apartment began. Ha.

Message Edited by ivyalmighty on 09-27-2008 02:38 PM

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Sat, 27 Sep 2008 22:05:01 GMT

FSU??

Resisting temptation to ask what campus!!! o_O

We have an FSU campus right down the street!!

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

haulingthescoreup — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 00:08:21 GMT

I think it would be heaven to live alone, but I sure wouldn't insist on a 2 BR 2 BA that required co-signers.

This isn't just jealousy (really, it isn't), but what is it with college students who think that they should start out living in something straight out of Architecture Today? Where do they think they're going to live when they graduate and they're making $28K?

Expectations are being set awfully high these days.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 14:02:18 GMT

@haulingthescoreup wrote:
I think it would be heaven to live alone, but I sure wouldn't insist on a 2 BR 2 BA that required co-signers.

This isn't just jealousy (really, it isn't), but what is it with college students who think that they should start out living in something straight out of Architecture Today? Where do they think they're going to live when they graduate and they're making $28K?

Expectations are being set awfully high these days.

Not for nothing, but anyone going to college to make $13.50/hour is 'wasting' their time anyway, IMO. Most skilled trades make that or more with only a HS diploma.

A more realistic salary coming out of college is $40-50k depending on field and amount of work experience picked up through internship/volunteer work while studying.

College is not for everyone.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

haulingthescoreup — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 14:30:32 GMT

Check out starting salaries for teachers and journalists, among others, in non-major urban areas.

Not to mention the SL debt that so many of these kids will be starting to pay. That can effectively reduce income pretty impressively.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

treski — Sun, 28 Sep 2008 16:35:32 GMT

I think he may be banking in on the "well you co-signed for her!" dynamic. It is certainly reasonable to make a compromise with him. He is an adullt and he has been out of high school for several years now, so he can probably be adult enough to take it or leave it.

My brother and I are close to his age and both of us are serving. I'm married so this may not apply for me, but my brother is single and younger, and I he's also got his ducks all lined in a row.

Do you know that on top of a full-ride to a state university the GI Bill offers up to an extra grand or so just for cost-of-living expenses? It's a dream.

Good luck!

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 12:26:22 GMT

I COMPLETELY agree w/ you hauling.. this place (mycampusedge.com) really does look like something out of AD...

and my feeling is, he IS going to be broke when he's done with college. (He wants to be a weatherman). So he better suck it up & get used to living close to the bone, or he'll be setting himself up for a life of keeping-up-w/-jones if he starts thinking that at age 22, he needs an ap't that looks like MTV Cribs.

...it's a little harder to teach him these principles, b/c his mother is very Jones-oriented... in fact, just redid the kitchen w/ stainless & granite, yet couldn't help her daughter get a car that would pass inspection... so their model for financial principles is pretty skewed.

The "well you did it for her" is exactly what he's banking on. Thing is, she didn't get a 2008 pimped-out Escalade, which is what this apartment is equivalent to. She got an '04 Escape, and would've gotten a '03 Dodge Stratus, except the deal & mileage on the Escape was too good to turn down. So, he'll get (as wonderin' said so well) SAFE and RELIABLE in an apartment. End 'o' story.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Anonymous — Mon, 29 Sep 2008 17:01:37 GMT

Glad to see you got that worked out, now he can either accept it or go it on his own. But your in the clear because you are trying to help. Good thing to learn early on in life how to live within your means. Good Luck to you all. Vicki

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

valley_man0505 — Tue, 30 Sep 2008 20:05:42 GMT

ivyalmighty wrote:
So we co-signed on D-20's car last month. She really, REALLY needed a safe reliable vehicle & bioMom was unwilling to cosign. (I suspect it was more unable b/c of credit problems than unwilling) but either way, she wouldn't do it.

Now S-22 wants a parent to be guarantor on a lease for him. He's 22, just getting out of the AF & going back to finish college. Again, bioMom said no, says she doesn't want to be stuck with something on her credit (again, I think it's more that she's worried about not being approved, but that is just speculation). We are *maybe* willing to say yes, but on the condition that he give us our own "deposit" equiv to about 1 month's rent, so that we can follow up w/ the complex after he moves out & already have HIS money on hand to pay any final expenses... ensuring it DOESN'T end up on our credit.

I don't think S-22 would have approached us if he didn't know that D-20 hadn't just gotten the car through us. DH feels guilted into signing because he doesn't want them to do the immature, but very natural "that's not FAIR!" thing on him. He's been gone most of their life & is only now in the position to start helping out like this, so feels secretly he has to make up for the lost TIME with extra MONEY.

I feel like S-22 is a MAN now. He just had 4 yrs in the air force. He's about to be a sophomore in college. He'll have steady income from the GI Bill. BUT he wants to live in the newest, snazziest (media room & a freakin' Lazy River pool! WTF?) college apartments. He says he wants a 2-br, so that he won't have "the party atmosphere" at HIS place, but I kinda feel like he shouldn't be living there at all... why doesn't he go for a quiet, older place that's maybe not as whiz-bang exciting, but will *cost less* and be completely removed from the so-called "party atmosphere"?

At age 22, do we really have any say at this point, as to where he moves? I mean, we're all adults here, so are we past the point of imposing restrictions on what we'll be guarantor, and where? I just feel like he'd have more chance for success in a quieter, older (uglier) apartment that won't attract quite as many writhing hormonal freshmen.. he's 22, for goodness' sake! Shouldn't he be getting over that stage anyway?

Or am I completely off the mark?

BTW, I'm only 26 so it's odd enough having a stepson 4 yrs my junior.. but at 22 I had two kids, was working full-time and dreaming of the day when I could have a stable enough income to set up a savings account.. so maybe I don't know what "normal" is for a 22-yo...

Message Edited by ivyalmighty on 09-26-2008 07:23 AM

FWIW---all college students are going to party. However, when I went to college, the "fancy" apartments were actually the quieter, non-party apartments. It is the junky apartments where the major partying happens. This was typically for two reasons: 1) the people in the "fancy" apartments didn't have any money left to party after paying rent and 2) believe it or not, college students in nice places actually don't want to wreck them--the students in the junky apartments, however, have no problem taking the risk to throw parties since the places are already in bad shape and, if they cared wha they looked like, they woudn't be living there in the first place.

Sometimes, the nicer places do provide a better atmosphere to get things done...but, within reason, or course.

Re: Renting college apartments.. is this a recipe for disaster?

Miner — Tue, 30 Sep 2008 21:27:04 GMT

My experience is the further from campus and away from the Frat houses, the less partying that goes on since it is less convienant for others to visit. This of course also means that you have some neighbors who are not college students and often don't put up with the noise of some of the parties. The amount of partying was also determined by the kind of friends you chose to hang out with.

Message Edited by Miner on 09-30-2008 02:27 PM