topic Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map? in General Credit Topics

Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 19:59:40 GMT

I have several credit cards that offer free credit score options and I check those regularly. Trouble is, the scores are all over the place. There can be a 60 point difference in supposed FICO score depending on which credit card site I'm checking, even those that claim to use the same bureau (TransUnion or Experian, for example). Why do the scores vary so much and how reliable are those "free credit score" options.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

AverageJoesCredit — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:08:08 GMT

Definitely check to make sure the free score is a fico first and formost as many free credit scores given are Vantage aka Fako. Then if its actually Fico 8 as Fico as different models as well

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:15:35 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I have several credit cards that offer free credit score options and I check those regularly. Trouble is, the scores are all over the place. There can be a 60 point difference in supposed FICO score depending on which credit card site I'm checking, even those that claim to use the same bureau (TransUnion or Experian, for example). Why do the scores vary so much and how reliable are those "free credit score" options.

Welcome to MyFICO

Your question is a common one. First, there are many versions of FICO scores and various creditors provide different ones. If you tell us what credit cards that you are dealing with then we can help you out more. Additionally some creditors like Capital One give you a Vantage score which is completely different than a FICO score. It can be very confusing but once you learn what score you are actually being provided then you will be able to determine how useful and reliable they are.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:21:59 GMT

Thanks. The cards are Capital One, Merrick Bank, Discvoer and Credit One

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

jawbrkr — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:30:05 GMT

Discover is TU FICO 8 and Cap1 is Vantage 3, not FICO. Not sure about credit one and the other.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:31:23 GMT

Ah, so the Discover score is probably the most accurate in terms of what banks will see when I apply for a loan

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 20:33:48 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Ah, so the Discover score is probably the most accurate in terms of what banks will see when I apply for a loan

Maybe but not necessarily. All depends on what type of loan and what the particular creditor uses. There can be a sizable difference even in FICO scores.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Loquat — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 22:22:50 GMT

I just wish that if a lender is going to offer a credit score as part being a customer of their institution that they'd govern the account by that very same score. I hate that CapOne, Chase, etc offers these fako scores knowing darn well that they rely heavily on their own internal and FICO scores rather than the bogus score they provide you.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

rmduhon — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 22:23:18 GMT

Credit One is a Fako as well.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

K-in-Boston — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 22:31:06 GMT

Unless it has changed since I closed mine last year (doubtful), Merrick Bank is giving you a Transunion FICO 08 Bankcard score which will usually differ slightly up or down compared to a regular Transunion FICO 08 score. A quick search came up with CreditOne giving an Experian FICO 08 Bankcard score, which would not be a FAKO.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

rmduhon — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 22:33:16 GMT

Credit One was a Fako up to a year ago when hubby had the card. That may have changed.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

rmduhon — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 22:54:41 GMT

Out of curiosity, I looked at hubby's old Credit One account and was able to login. Nowhere does it say it's a Fico scores so it could very well be a Fako.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

K-in-Boston — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 23:02:53 GMT

I've found as many threads saying it's a EX FAKO (Vantage 1 to be exact) as EX 08 Bankcard now, so I don't know.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

SouthJamaica — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 23:02:56 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
I have several credit cards that offer free credit score options and I check those regularly. Trouble is, the scores are all over the place. There can be a 60 point difference in supposed FICO score depending on which credit card site I'm checking, even those that claim to use the same bureau (TransUnion or Experian, for example). Why do the scores vary so much and how reliable are those "free credit score" options.

That's chump change; I have a 140 point spread between my lowest and highest FICO scores.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Anonymous — Thu, 22 Jun 2017 23:45:31 GMT

So to recap, there are three reasons why two FICO scores could be very different:

(1) The data that are generating the score are different because they come from different bureaus.

The three credit bureaus each could have very different accounts listed for you. Even if the accounts appear to be the same, there could be subtle differences that end up having a big scoring difference. For example, you may have paid down a big CC debt, and EQ has updated its database but TU hasn't yet.

But let's assume that the two scores are drawn on the same bureau, say Equifax.

(2) The FICO model used by each score could be different.

For example, you could have three FICO scores: one is the old mortgage model (which you got when you did a pre-qualification from a mortgage lender). Another is the FICO 8 Classic score (which you got from Credit Check Total). Another is a FICO 8 Bankcard Enhanced (which you got from Citibank). Those three models could give very different scores with different ranges as well.

But let's suppose you are comparing two scores that use the same bureau and the exact same model.

(3) The scores could be generated on different dates.

Here we are back to the issues of the possibility of different data. Suppose the difference in dates is small, four days say. In those four days some major changes could happen on your report, causing that same model to create very different scores.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Thomas_Thumb — Sun, 25 Jun 2017 17:05:37 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I have several credit cards that offer free credit score options and I check those regularly. Trouble is, the scores are all over the place. There can be a 60 point difference in supposed FICO score depending on which credit card site I'm checking, even those that claim to use the same bureau (TransUnion or Experian, for example). Why do the scores vary so much and how reliable are those "free credit score" options.
That's chump change; I have a 140 point spread between my lowest and highest FICO scores.

@on my last 3B report I had a spread of 96 points in Fico scores [high EX Bankcard Fico 8 @ 900, low EQ Classic Fico 04 @ 804]. All high scores are Fico 8 Bankcard version. All low scores are Fico 04 Classic version

As many know Citi uses EQ Fico 8 bankcard (range 250 to 900) while some other card issuers (AMEX, Discover) use Classic Fico 8 (range 300 to 850). Wells Fargo and/or other credit card issuers may report an older Fico 04 or even Fico 98 score. As an example, if EQ Fico 04 is reported, that version has range 334 to 818.

If someone had credit cards that reported the above combination of credit versions and highest score for each version, range in scores would be 82 points (900 - 818).

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

SouthJamaica — Fri, 23 Jun 2017 01:59:25 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
I have several credit cards that offer free credit score options and I check those regularly. Trouble is, the scores are all over the place. There can be a 60 point difference in supposed FICO score depending on which credit card site I'm checking, even those that claim to use the same bureau (TransUnion or Experian, for example). Why do the scores vary so much and how reliable are those "free credit score" options.
That's chump change; I have a 140 point spread between my lowest and highest FICO scores.
@on my last 3B report I had a spread of 96 points in Fico scores [high EX Bankcard Fico 8 @ 900, low EQ Classic Fico 04 @ 804].

As many know Citi uses EQ Fico 8 bankcard (range 250 to 900) while some other card issuers (AMEX, Discover) use Classic Fico 8 (range 300 to 850). Wells Fargo and/or other credit card issuers may report an older Fico 04 or even Fico 98 score. As an example, if EQ Fico 04 is reported, that version has range 334 to 818.

If someone had credit cards that reported the above combination of credit versions and highest score for each version, range in scores would be 82 points (900 - 818).

Interestingly my highest and lowest are all Bankcard models. My lowest is EX Bankcard 2 and my highest are in a tie: EQ Bankcard 9 and TU Bankcard 8. On May 6th the spread was 142 points!

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

Thomas_Thumb — Fri, 23 Jun 2017 11:30:47 GMT

@SouthJamaica wrote:

Interestingly my highest and lowest are all Bankcard models. My lowest is EX Bankcard 2 and my highest are in a tie: EQ Bankcard 9 and TU Bankcard 8. On May 6th the spread was 142 points!

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

@on my last 3B report I had a spread of 96 points in Fico scores [high EX Bankcard Fico 8 @ 900, low EQ Classic Fico 04 @ 804].

As many know Citi uses EQ Fico 8 bankcard (range 250 to 900) while some other card issuers (AMEX, Discover) use Classic Fico 8 (range 300 to 850). Wells Fargo and/or other credit card issuers may report an older Fico 04 or even Fico 98 score. As an example, if EQ Fico 04 is reported, that version has range 334 to 818. If someone had credit cards that reported the above combination of credit versions and highest score for each version, range in scores would be 82 points (900 - 818).

FYI - EX Bankcard score 2 is EX Fico 98 Bankcard. It has a score range of 276 to 878. If your EX Fico mortgage score lower than your EQ and TU mortgage scores?

One thing of note - Fico 98 model looks at B/HB on NPLS chage cards as a scoring factor. Fico 04, Fico and Fico 9 models do not look at charge card B/HB.If you have a closed NPLS charge card with a balance or open one with a very high B/HB, it could be impacting your Fico 98 score - but not to the extent you report. Also, data suggests Fico 8 and Fico 9 are more forgiving to new accounts and # cards reporting balances than Fico 98.

Beyond that a small collection, paid or unpaid, will negatively influence Fico 98 perhaps up to 80 points but not Fico 8 or Fico 9 if paid. Does your EX file have some dirt while TU and EQ are clean?

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

SouthJamaica — Fri, 23 Jun 2017 16:45:27 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:

Interestingly my highest and lowest are all Bankcard models. My lowest is EX Bankcard 2 and my highest are in a tie: EQ Bankcard 9 and TU Bankcard 8. On May 6th the spread was 142 points!

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

@on my last 3B report I had a spread of 96 points in Fico scores [high EX Bankcard Fico 8 @ 900, low EQ Classic Fico 04 @ 804].

As many know Citi uses EQ Fico 8 bankcard (range 250 to 900) while some other card issuers (AMEX, Discover) use Classic Fico 8 (range 300 to 850). Wells Fargo and/or other credit card issuers may report an older Fico 04 or even Fico 98 score. As an example, if EQ Fico 04 is reported, that version has range 334 to 818. If someone had credit cards that reported the above combination of credit versions and highest score for each version, range in scores would be 82 points (900 - 818).
FYI - EX Bankcard score 2 is EX Fico 98 Bankcard. It has a score range of 276 to 878. I[s] your EX Fico mortgage score lower than your EQ and TU mortgage scores?

Yes. EX FICO 2 = 723; EQ FICO 5 = 733; TU FICO 4 = 753.

One thing of note - Fico 98 model looks at B/HB on NPLS chage cards as a scoring factor. Fico 04, Fico and Fico 9 models do not look at charge card B/HB.If you have a closed NPLS charge card

I have no NPLS charge cards in my personal profile

with a balance or open one with a very high B/HB, it could be impacting your Fico 98 score - but not to the extent you report. Also, data suggests Fico 8 and Fico 9 are more forgiving to new accounts

This would seem to be the case, because 8 and 9 are my highest scores, and the only bad thing about my profile is the array of 'newness' factors.

and # cards reporting balances than Fico 98.

Beyond that a small collection, paid or unpaid, will negatively influence Fico 98 perhaps up to 80 points but not Fico 8 or Fico 9 if paid. Does your EX file have some dirt while TU and EQ are clean?

I have no negatives of any kind on any bureau.

Re: Why are so-called FICO scores all over the map?

K-in-Boston — Fri, 23 Jun 2017 18:58:28 GMT

@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

One thing of note - Fico 98 model looks at B/HB on NPLS chage cards as a scoring factor. Fico 04, Fico and Fico 9 models do not look at charge card B/HB.If you have a closed NPLS charge card with a balance or open one with a very high B/HB, it could be impacting your Fico 98 score - but not to the extent you report.

I always find your posts fascinating. I knew about the B/HB thing on older models, which is one reason a lot of us used to just bite the bullet and try to run up the balance as high as we could reasonably afford to pay at least once to not have that ding every month. Do you happen to know where the NextGen2 model falls? I've been wondering why my NG2 score from PenFed is far and away my highest score that I have access to (more so than just the change in scale would suggest), and now I wonder if it's because of my two Amex charge cards. My gold has a high balance of $19k or so and is sock drawered until November when I may close it ($0 balances reporting every month), while my Platinum has a high balance north of $22k and lately has only been seeing $1-3k a month in spend. As my profile is almost entirely hindered by revolving utilization (if I were under 10%, I'd likely be somewhere in the 800-810 FICO 08 range right now), could it be that the additional close to $40k of "available credit" is helping me tremendously by pushing my util down?