topic Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits in General Credit Topics

Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:17:52 GMT

so i've been fighting with comenity for a while now and to put a long story short i got a notice that my limit on one of my cards was put form $500 to $200 and the reason cited was that my equifax score was 570, which is complete nonsense as my scores have never been below 600 and even then it was only that low because i went for a new subaru and they did the usual shoping around for loans and that ran up about 8 or 9 hard pulls.

currently my equifax is 636, my transunion is 621 and my experian is 619

so i dispute it and then finaly get the response that the dispute was denied and the reasoning is that the score they used was (exact words) an internal scoring system and that was what the system assigned as my score.

even the customer support supervisor looked at my account and couldn't understand why they reduced my limit i had 1 missed payment with them in almost 5 years and 2 missed payments on my report in it's entirety out of 8+ years of revolving accounts with no closures and no charge offs and no other major items of concern.

he then told me that my only option is to submit another dispute and there is no way to talk to or send a message to the group who handles the disputes so i'm effectively SOL

now i am getting notices that they are reducing my other cards with them in a like fashion with the same BS score that now just say that it is 570 and no bureau or other credit agency being listed as the score source.

i now know they are pretty **bleep**ty as far as card companies go so are they now finnaly ditching the regular reporting sources and just doing their own thing?

do i have any recourse? maybe the BBB? i really want to close my cards with them now as they've been nothing but trouble but between all the store cards with them that i've used to build my credit thats over $3500 of my avail credit that would be chopped off my report and would likely really hurt my scores.

any ideas would be appreciated.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Pikaboo-icu — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:24:28 GMT

Welcome to My Fico

I really hate to lecture when you're down but that missed payment with them and the other missed payments are in a fact a big deal.

Once a CC issuer starts AA, it's pretty much a done deal.

With Comenity, there is no appeal.. I'm sorry.

Perhaps app for something else to make up the available credit you're going to lose.

Again, sorry.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:36:24 GMT

well those missed payments are from years ago, they are just on my report, the one from them was at their instruction; i had been laid off along with the whole department when that job outsourced their IT dept and had the hardship insurance so i called and was told it i HAD to let the payment go for a 30 day period in order to use the insurance at all and they said that if i make a payment that i would never be allowed to use that insurance.

this was back in 2013 or so; comenity started this whole thing with my limits just this last year so they already new about the missed payment to them.

the other missed payment was even earlier back in 2011 or 2012 and was with paypal, think it was about the end of the year so not sure if it was before christmas or after.

so the only bad things on my report they knew about long before this, and the kicker is that when they started doing this with the limits my income took a massive jump as i got a new job that added almost a third to my income (went from 29k to 37k per year) and now when i got these additonal notices i am at another job as a sys admin that has now jumped my income to 55k/yr so i've been doing everything i was supposed to and even have more available income so i dont understand why they are reducing my limits or where they get this BS score from

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Pikaboo-icu — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:36:47 GMT

I know it seems unfair, sorry..

What is keeping your scores depressed? Any other neg items?

Also what was your uti on those cards? Over all cards?

Those things can help figure out why this is happening..

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Jnbmom — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:38:16 GMT

Unfortunately once any creditor starts AA, you are not going to get anywhere with them, disputing or filing a complaint won't help.

Creditors can and do what they want basically and leave us very little recourse. Sorry this happened to you .

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:39:52 GMT

There may be more going on here than just some inquiries from the dealership. If the loss of $3500 in credit lines will tank your scores, that suggests that you might have a UTI issue. Have you carried high balances for any length of time on any of your cards? What is your current UTI? How many accounts have you opened up recently?

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:42:28 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
well those missed payments are from years ago, they are just on my report, the one from them was at their instruction; i had been laid off along with the whole department when that job outsourced their IT dept and had the hardship insurance so i called and was told it i HAD to let the payment go for a 30 day period in order to use the insurance at all and they said that if i make a payment that i would never be allowed to use that insurance.

this was back in 2013 or so; comenity started this whole thing with my limits just this last year so they already new about the missed payment to them.

the other missed payment was even earlier back in 2011 or 2012 and was with paypal, think it was about the end of the year so not sure if it was before christmas or after.

so the only bad things on my report they knew about long before this, and the kicker is that when they started doing this with the limits my income took a massive jump as i got a new job that added almost a third to my income (went from 29k to 37k per year) and now when i got these additonal notices i am at another job as a sys admin that has now jumped my income to 55k/yr so i've been doing everything i was supposed to and even have more available income so i dont understand why they are reducing my limits or where they get this BS score from

Whatever scoring methodology Comenity chooses to use is not "BS" so you should immediately disabuse yourself of that notion. Its their money and therefore they can set whatever rules they want as long as there's no discrimination.

I am curious as to why your self-reported scores are so low; they are all sub-prime. There must be something in your credit history that is causing your low scores and making Comenity take adverse action against your accounts

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:53:15 GMT

Maybe its time to just cut ties with them and move on? Thats what i did a few years back with a Wells fargo card that i had and they changed the fees. I will give them another chance in the future perhaps, but well see.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Physh1 — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:54:04 GMT

Besides what has been said you must be aware that nearly all if not all creditors are going to have an internal risk assessment on their customers. Sounds like something else is holding your scores in the low 600s & their internal risk assessment is throwing flags up.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sat, 19 Jan 2019 23:58:20 GMT

as far as i can tell the average age of accounts (coming up on 8 years) and that i dont have any mortage, or loans other than my car; i live in my families home on our horse farm and rent the in-law apartment here.

my total util is about 78% but when this started was 70% and was going down, i had had to use a good portion of my navy federal credit card for roof repairs when a bad storm tore shingles up in a small section and soaked the baseboard so they had to be replaced so that drove it up.

the comenity cards are largely unused; i had about $2000 in credit with them out of which i had used about $600, the cards i have are HSN, gamestop, and Kingsize, limits were $1000, $500, and $500 respectively, hsn is still at $1000 and has no running balance. gamestop has about a $70 balance but was $130 and change at the time of the first notice and the kingsize has about $378 for a balance but was at $468 at the time of the notice

in total between all my lines of credit as far as revolving accounts i have a limit of $9900 of which i have used about $7600 currently, when this started i had used about $6800 or so maybe a little less.

i always make my payments and usually pay a bit more than the minimum, maybe not multiples more but $15-30 more than the minimum depending on whats going on.

the comenity cards are also some of my oldest cards from going on 6 years ago now, i had not been able to get any lines of credit really until i was about 24 just due to the fact that i had no history so even though i had a job and minimal housing bills due to living with family in an apartment i couldn't get any approvals until about 2011 with paypal credit and later a comenity card for hsn

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 00:08:50 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
as far as i can tell the average age of accounts (coming up on 8 years) and that i dont have any mortage, or loans other than my car; i live in my families home on our horse farm and rent the in-law apartment here.

my total util is about 78% but when this started was 70% and was going down, i had had to use a good portion of my navy federal credit card for roof repairs when a bad storm tore shingles up in a small section and soaked the baseboard so they had to be replaced so that drove it up.

the comenity cards are largely unused; i had about $2000 in credit with them out of which i had used about $600, the cards i have are HSN, gamestop, and Kingsize, limits were $1000, $500, and $500 respectively, hsn is still at $1000 and has no running balance. gamestop has about a $70 balance but was $130 and change at the time of the first notice and the kingsize has about $378 for a balance but was at $468 at the time of the notice

in total between all my lines of credit as far as revolving accounts i have a limit of $9900 of which i have used about $7600 currently, when this started i had used about $6800 or so maybe a little less.

i always make my payments and usually pay a bit more than the minimum, maybe not multiples more but $15-30 more than the minimum depending on whats going on.

the comenity cards are also some of my oldest cards from going on 6 years ago now, i had not been able to get any lines of credit really until i was about 24 just due to the fact that i had no history so even though i had a job and minimal housing bills due to living with family in an apartment i couldn't get any approvals until about 2011 with paypal credit and later a comenity card for hsn

Your aggregate utilization is the problem. 78% aggregate utilization is perilously close to maxing out your credit limits and would cause any creditor to examine your accounts closely in order to limit their potential losses. Creditors consider 88.9% utilization as maxed out; ideally you want your aggregate utilization to be at 8.9% or below and any of your individual credit cards to be at 28.9% or below. Anything above those thresholds will negatively affect your credit scores.

Even if you don't carry large balances on your Comenity cards they will soft-pull your credit reports and will be able to see the balances with other lenders. Comenity cutting your limits is a warning; you'd be fortunate if other creditors don't do the same.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 00:07:03 GMT

i'm aware thats it's their money but why i say its BS is that it doesnt seem to follow any other scoring methodology that i can find my score in; as i've said all my scores have NEVER been below 600 at any point in my life.

how they get a 570 score when my lowest is 619 and my highest is 636 doesnt make sense.

even going to fico 8 my scores are still 616 or higher.

and if there is something else on my report then i cant find it; on the reports i have there is no delinquency and the only derogitory marks are those two missed payments.

the only other thing is the hard pulls from the car dealer which added 9 inquiries and put the total up to 12 and the util now being above the 75% mark from the roof repair.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 00:11:46 GMT

i understand that; but they are the only ones who are doing this and that jump in util was after they started hitting my limits; before that it was at 70% and falling, my next set of payments between all my credit lines would have brought it down to about 67% if not more.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:37:41 GMT

Did you at least get that Subaru?

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:39:40 GMT

You have to realize that most of the lenders are working with reports that are 1-2 months behind current. While you may be paying everything down, the report they have might be from when the balances were higher. Also, all lenders have their own internal scoring. It's why someone like me was able to get a PayPal card, for more than the normal starting limit, with a sub 600 score. While my FICO score wasn't in the normal range of approvals, their internal score has me in a better place than most.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:43:59 GMT

Also, the Subaru loan isn't dinging your score that bad. If they're grouped together within 2 weeks, you only took 1 hit, probably for around 5 points. The number of inquiries, however, could have brought you on their radar. If the computer that combs through their accounts isn't programmed to filter out possible auto loan inquiries, it's only going to see the number of inquiries and it could have flagged you for credit seeking.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

CreditInspired — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 01:48:29 GMT

OP
I think once your anger at Comenity subsides, you’ll realize what everyone else is saying is true, informative, and helpful. Understanding this going forward will help you build and maintain a strong credit profile.

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 04:47:55 GMT

ok this whole mess started last year when i had that 70% utilization and it was going down; thats the point i have been trying to make, i got hit with the loan inquiries (i did get the car loan btw ended up navy federal gave the best rate) back in january these reductions then happened almost 6 months later then nothing happened until the roof thing which was maybe barely a month and a half ago. so these reductions are ocurring outside of any of the nearest (time wise) changes by more than 5 months on either end.

anything else they were already aware of for years before some of the accounts i have with them even being opened yet.

if i have such an increased risk then why would navy federal give me a line of up to 38K for a new car on top what i already have a single credit card with them for a $4600 limit and an additonal $1000 checking line of credit?

same deal with my other non-comenity cards; why woudl chase give me a $1000 unsecured card, a quicksilver card from capitol one for $500, or a paypal credit line for almost $850.

why would all these larger, supposedly stricter companies agree to extend these lines of credit and maintain and in some cases increase the limits when i'm supposedly a higher risk; if i missed or lagged on the payments for multiple accounts i could understand it but i've missed litterally 2 payments in almost 8 years so i've made 98% or better of all the payments in my entire credit life.

by any other means than utilization i have a pretty dam good credit record.

and the only reason i'm mad at comenity is that they do this with no apparent logical reason, as i've said when they did this it was 5 months on either side of any changes, even their customer support said they dont understand why they reduced them as they've seen account in much worse shape keep their limits and accounts.

i honestly think whatever system or process they use had a glitch or hickup such as was suggested with the auto loan inquiries in that it is a programming error or oversight. and what gets me the most is the department or group or whatever is responsible for reviewing this just tells me what in effect is "tough **bleep** F-off" in complete disregard to the facts and my own history with my accounts

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Pikaboo-icu — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 05:25:43 GMT

You need to remember it isn't personal.. It isn't..

It's also not decided by a human being as a rule, it's a computer algorithm.

The auto loan is secured debt, totally different from an unsecured loan which is what a CC is.

NFCU is NFCU- they are unlike any other! Getting a good SL from them is great but it's well known they will risk where others wont dare to tread.

Sadly, Comenity and Synchrony (to a lesser extent) are well documented around these forums for taking AA.

People have app'd for new cards and had them all closed before they even received them.

Their actions aren't a judgement against you- it's just the algorithm detected similar issues in your credit, that have resulted in loss to them before.

It will be ok..

You already have some prime cards and can replace the Comenity cards with something better after your uti is lowered.

There are a lot of other people that have been hit with this same thing.

Hang in there..

Re: Comenity using BS internal credit score and tanking my limits

Anonymous — Sun, 20 Jan 2019 05:41:07 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
ok this whole mess started last year when i had that 70% utilization and it was going down; thats the point i have been trying to make, i got hit with the loan inquiries (i did get the car loan btw ended up navy federal gave the best rate) back in january these reductions then happened almost 6 months later then nothing happened until the roof thing which was maybe barely a month and a half ago. so these reductions are ocurring outside of any of the nearest (time wise) changes by more than 5 months on either end.
anything else they were already aware of for years before some of the accounts i have with them even being opened yet.

if i have such an increased risk then why would navy federal give me a line of up to 38K for a new car on top what i already have a single credit card with them for a $4600 limit and an additonal $1000 checking line of credit?
same deal with my other non-comenity cards; why woudl chase give me a $1000 unsecured card, a quicksilver card from capitol one for $500, or a paypal credit line for almost $850.
why would all these larger, supposedly stricter companies agree to extend these lines of credit and maintain and in some cases increase the limits when i'm supposedly a higher risk; if i missed or lagged on the payments for multiple accounts i could understand it but i've missed litterally 2 payments in almost 8 years so i've made 98% or better of all the payments in my entire credit life.
by any other means than utilization i have a pretty dam good credit record.

and the only reason i'm mad at comenity is that they do this with no apparent logical reason, as i've said when they did this it was 5 months on either side of any changes, even their customer support said they dont understand why they reduced them as they've seen account in much worse shape keep their limits and accounts.

i honestly think whatever system or process they use had a glitch or hickup such as was suggested with the auto loan inquiries in that it is a programming error or oversight. and what gets me the most is the department or group or whatever is responsible for reviewing this just tells me what in effect is "tough **bleep** F-off" in complete disregard to the facts and my own history with my accounts

OP, where are you getting your credit scores from?

Also, it appears that you are ignoring your DTI ratio which is a critical measure used by lenders to evaluate your financial health. What is your current debt to income ratio?

By your own admission your credit card (revolving) utilization was above 70% and you were barely making a little more than the minimum payments monthly. That alone suggests you were having problems paying your debts. Then to compound the problem, you went out and got a $38K car loan, which appears to be more than your annual income. A car loan (any loan for that matter) reporting to the credit bureaus with 100% of the balance unpaid can easily cost you 20-30 points on your credit scores.

So in addition to the points deducted for the hard inquiries associated with the car loan, you also have a new installment loan reporting on your credit report and I'm guessing it is at or near 100% which will cost you points. You generally wouldn't see any gain from a loan until the outstanding balance is below 88.9% and you get the most points when your loan balance is below 8.9% but not fully paid off.

The fact that life events like the need to repair your roof happened, is of no concern to Comenity...they just want the money they lent you back and you're clearly demonstrating that you've made sub-optimal financial choices.