topic Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28% in General Credit Topics

AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Ugenie7 — Tue, 19 May 2020 23:53:16 GMT

I sort of get the AZEO idea. For example 8% of $3900 CLI is $312 and all other cards report zero even if you have 15 cards.

I see posts where someone recommends letting 8% report. I assume that is for one card only.

Then we get into letting 28% report for 2 or more cards.

Shouldn't this 28% start to decrease as more cards are in use or does the 28% stay the same for all your cards with a balance?

Hmmm, now that I think about I have it backwards.

28% for AZEO with a single card reporting and all others report zero. Now 28% of the $3900 example above is $1092.

If using 8% for two cards, would that be 4% for each card or 8% for each card.

Someone jump right in and explain where I'm wrong but remember I get confused easily!

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Girlzilla88 — Wed, 20 May 2020 00:17:17 GMT

@Ugenie7 Honestly I saw the biggest score jump and CLI etc when I did 8.9% across the board rather than on one card and the rest report 0, so I had like 4% on one card, 2% on another etc to equal around 8% (below 9%) but some people RAVE on the AZEO method, for me it just didn't give me grins and giggles like I thought LOL (If you are wanting to be 29% and below that is something completely seperate than AZEO which you can do your Bank Card reporting 28%, and the rest 0, but most people when referring to AZEO are referring to Bank Card reporting 8.9% while others report 0. Just keep in mind also to use your other cards and pay them down to 0 on statement so you don't have CLD or Closures by trying to behave

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Ficoproblems247 — Wed, 20 May 2020 00:19:01 GMT

AZEO (All Zero Except One) is simply the number of cards you let report a balance. The other numbers are the percentages of those balances that are reporting to the bureaus. They are two different things. What you are thinking about is using one in conjunction with the other for optimal scoring purposes. In order to optimize certain FICO scores, you would want to pay off all cards except for one. The one card that you let report should have a balance below 8.9% to keep it in the most optimal threshold. AZEO is certainly not something you need to practice on a consistent basis, rather something you should use before submitting an app to ensure you are approved for the best terms/CL possible. In a normal situation, feel free to let your balances report as you spend organically, provided it does not leave you with high utilization on any one card, or your aggregate utilization.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 00:57:20 GMT

@Ficoproblems247 +1, Well said, except for the fact the threshold is equal to or less than 9% as proven by @Anonymous. It was long wrongly believed it had to be below 8.9%, but that has been debunked.

@Ugenie7 What you’re thinking of is the best practice of keeping your aggregate equal to or less than 9% and then any individual cards equal to or less than 29%.

But, when you need your best score, such as when you’re about to app, you want to practice AZEO with the one card having a balance under $100, so that you receive awards for optimizing: 1. utilization metrics, 2. raw dollar amount metric and 3. The number of accounts/revolvers with a balance metric.

@Ficoproblems247 is correct that what we commonly advise as AZEO includes a small balance, which therefore combines 3 metrics to gain points, not just 1.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 02:09:06 GMT

Just keep in mind that a lot of people use Experian's credit monitoring. If someone is only using that service, they will think AZEO isn't that big of a deal.

EX 8 doesn't really care about number of cards with a balance. This is not true of EQ/TU 8. I get +19/+14 on them at AZEO, when EX 8 doesn't move. Some other scores on EQ/TU at AZEO move as much as +27pts. This is just with 1 of 2 cards reporting a balance.

Of course, it all depends on the scorecard. People with derogatories or much greater length of credit history might not see much movement at any CRA.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 04:22:05 GMT

Very good point, Cassie.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Ugenie7 — Wed, 20 May 2020 14:20:41 GMT

Good info everyone!

I do use experian since its free. There's no concern where my experian report says usage low (had a balance) or no usage (0 balance) even though the low was reported at 2% for all cards and 8.92% rounded to 9% on one card? This is with 3 cards reporting where 2 had a balance.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 14:49:05 GMT

@Anonymous @Anonymous - So if you only have 1 CC is a $0 balance better than < 9%? I don't want to open a new account right now and I only have the one card. I am an AU on another account but it is my understanding that only impacts AAoA.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 19:19:38 GMT

@Ugenie7 wrote:
Good info everyone!
I do use experian since its free. There's no concern where my experian report says usage low (had a balance) or no usage (0 balance) even though the low was reported at 2% for all cards and 8.92% rounded to 9% on one card? This is with 3 cards reporting where 2 had a balance.

Having only one card of the three report a small balance would be optimal. The only low useage that you have to worry about is if all your revolvers report zero.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Wed, 20 May 2020 17:04:56 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous @Anonymous - So if you only have 1 CC is a $0 balance better than < 9%? I don't want to open a new account right now and I only have the one card. I am an AU on another account but it is my understanding that only impacts AAoA.

No matter what you have to have a balance on at least one revolver to avoid the all zero penalty.

if you're AU card counts for version eight it also must have a small balance or you will receive a penalty. If it doesn't count then it doesn't matter, except for the mortgage scores where AUs always count.

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Girlzilla88 — Wed, 20 May 2020 17:08:33 GMT

@Anonymous if you only have 1 card you don't want it to report 0, I would put a small percent on it. You can be penalized by some for $0 if it is your only card

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Ugenie7 — Wed, 20 May 2020 18:14:52 GMT

@Anonymous

Thanks! I appreciate the info!

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 00:28:31 GMT

Illustrating the point about AZEO differences:

CassieCard 3B Report - Score changes at AZEO, CRA Comparison

MTG(Mortgage), AUT(Auto), and BKC(Bankcard) scores are 5,4,2 from the top.

	8	BC8	AU8	MTG	AUT	BKC	9	BC9	AU9	3
EQ	+19	+23	+20	+1	+1	+4	+16	+17	+17
TU	+14	+22	+16	+6	+6	+6	+27	+27	+27
EX	0	+3	0	+10	+9	+7	+6	+6	+6	+2

AoOA 2yr1mo | AAoA 1yr5mo | AoYA/AoYRA/AAoRA 1yr1mo

8% to 5% aggregate change, ($816 to $539), TCL $11K

(9 & 8) to (0 & 6)% on 2 individual cards

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 00:32:45 GMT

So much for reducing the disparity on version 9!

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Ugenie7 — Thu, 21 May 2020 18:13:40 GMT

@Anonymous

Thanks for the very informative charts!

It looks like Experian is being stingy though!

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Thu, 21 May 2020 23:53:49 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
Illustrating the point about AZEO differences:

CassieCard 3B Report - Score changes at AZEO, CRA Comparison
MTG(Mortgage), AUT(Auto), and BKC(Bankcard) scores are 5,4,2 from the top.

8
BC8
AU8
MTG
AUT
BKC
9
BC9
AU9
3
EQ
+19
+23
+20
+1
+1
+4
+16
+17
+17

TU
+14
+22
+16
+6
+6
+6
+27
+27
+27

EX
0
+3
0
+10
+9
+7
+6
+6
+6
+2
AoOA 2yr1mo | AAoA 1yr5mo | AoYA/AoYRA/AAoRA 1yr1mo
8% to 5% aggregate change, ($816 to $539), TCL $11K
(9 & 8) to (0 & 6)% on 2 individual cards

This still surprises me. My model is that there is one algorithm, say FICO 8 (non bankcard etc) and you get different results by running it on the slightly different data held by each CRA. But you are saying that EX implements FICO 8 differently from TU (even though they are paying FICO for the algorithm)?

ETA: OK, now I see that CRAs do make modifications to the algorithm, so I guess that's why! Thanks

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 00:24:00 GMT

@AnonymousKind of, but not exactly. The CRA has FICO customize the algorithm for them. They definitely vary by bureau. Starting with Score 8, there was a move to reduce the disparity. Supposedly Score 9 reduced it even more, but I can't tell!

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 13:23:38 GMT

@Girlzilla88 Thanks! <8.9% still advisable if you only have 1 card?

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Girlzilla88 — Fri, 22 May 2020 16:36:26 GMT

@Anonymous Yes! It would be ideal actually So use to the limit is what I used to do, pay it down to 0 dollars on the payment date, whether you pay a little here, more there, then down to 0 on payment date, then put a little bit back on after to let report for the statement (Ideally under the 9% but don't put so little that it shows as 0, some places will round down so if you put 5 dollars on a 20k limit (random example) they may report as 0 ((hopefully you get the point I was exaggerating lol)) but that will show you use the limit they give, you can make more than your payment back and can use it responsibly so it will give good chances at CLI (especially Auto ones) side note I know my scores don't look it right now lol but that's how I jumped my score almost 200 points in less than a year (I have just been playing around with my score and adding things, bought a house, refinanced etc and now I'm just building it back for my next big purchase (I just high high UTL right now which is my biggest henderence atm) But that method got me several CLI's quickly YMMV but if it works for other ppl hopefully they will agree and let you know too

Re: AZEO vs 8% and 28%

Anonymous — Fri, 22 May 2020 17:30:58 GMT

It’s actually 9% or less and if you’ve only got one card you can get a couple more points at 4% or less. But it’s only like 3 more points so.