topic Re: FICO Resilience Index - a new nonsense number in General Credit Topics

FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

Anonymous — Mon, 13 Apr 2020 03:05:50 GMT

Presummably thanks to COVID-19, a new stress index is popping up. Equifax calls it the FICO Score Stress Indicator, and Equifax calls it FICO Resilience Index (now shown in myFICO). I tried to research this topic before I posted, so my apology if I missed it or have cross-posted.

I'm not sure when or how this index is going to be used (or currently being used), but suffice it to say, we can let our imaginations run wild until we see something concrete. If you have installment loans and/or carry balances, you run real risks of flagging in these indexes. Admittedly, I'm scoring an average 770 FICO score, but I'm a "high risk" according to the Equifax version of the index.

This is something that needs to be watched, and may even see some uses during these economic times - regardless of your FICO score.

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

Trudy — Thu, 26 Mar 2020 00:39:06 GMT

This is very interesting. Probably a good topic and get more feedback in Credit in the News but the Mods know what they're doing so if it needs to be moved I'm sure they will.

I was unaware of this. Thanks for sharing.

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

AllZero — Thu, 26 Mar 2020 00:43:38 GMT

Thanks for sharing!

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

AllZero — Thu, 26 Mar 2020 00:49:32 GMT

Equifax wrote:
More sensitive customers tend to have:

Higher number of active account
Higher total balances
Less experience managing a mix of credit
More recently opened a new trade line

https://assets.equifax.com/assets/usis/FICO_score_stress_indicator_ps.pdf

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

Remedios — Thu, 26 Mar 2020 02:07:26 GMT

I've moved it to GC as this is not dealing with scoring per se, nor does this product changes/affects scores.

This is really no different than other add ons sold by CRA to those lenders who are willing to pay extra for someone else to tell them what's going on.

There are probably too many to count, but some are not advertised publicly, so when one makes an appearance, it seems so ominous, when in reality it's business as usual.

I wouldnt sweat it too hard as majority of the lenders are already utilizing something similar, except most rely on their own proprietary in-house algorithms and internal risk scoring.

There will certainly be some changes due to current situation, but not as a result from this.

FICO Resilience Index?

RehabbingANDBlabbing — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 04:19:28 GMT

Hello all!

I updated my FICO 3 bureau report this month and noticed a new feature/score pop up on my dashboard. It ic called the FICO Reslience Index. Has anyone else noticed this recently? Strangely enough, it is only showing up for my Equifax report, which is my worst out of the 3 due to some inaccuracies and charge-offs currently showing. I am in this process of getting this stuff fixed, but I think many of us understand the difficulty in completing such a simple task.

Anyway, has anyone else gotten this message? Are you seeing it for any bureau other than Equifax? What is your score?

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

NRB525 — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 04:41:04 GMT

Interesting. Haven't seen anything like this. Looking forward to the discussion of how this sort of logic would be assembled.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Brian_Earl_Spilner — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 05:05:11 GMT

Definitely interesting. Probably based on trended data as well as your place of employment listed on the bureaus. If you work in the restaurant business, you'll score lower.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Anonymous — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 06:51:21 GMT

There's a thread about it that has more info and links - https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/General-Credit-Topics/FICO-Score-Stress-Indicators-Indexes/td-p/5962374/jump-to/first-unread-message

I am curious about this score but not enough to blow $30.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

RehabbingANDBlabbing — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:01:20 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
There's a thread about it that has more info and links - https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/General-Credit-Topics/FICO-Score-Stress-Indicators-Indexes/td-p/5962374/jump-to/first-unread-message

I am curious about this score but not enough to blow $30.

Thanks for sharing this! Yeah, I currently have the boujee monthly 3 bureau subscription because I am in the process of some disputes and getting some inaccuracies removed. Once all that is done, I will not be paying for it anymore.

I also find it interesting that I am only seeing it from Equifax. My other two scores are higher, so maybe that's why?

It says the 2 reasons I am eing "red flagged" are a high amount of revolving debt (2 unpaid charge-offs on EQ) and the second reason is that I have a "high percentage of revolving accounts." In the little explanation box, it says, "Our predictive analysis shows that people who have a moderate mix of mortgage, installment loans (like auto) and credit cards may be more resilient in the event of an economic downturn."

Soo too many revolving accounts is a red flag apparently.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Anonymous — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:04:42 GMT

@RehabbingANDBlabbing wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
There's a thread about it that has more info and links - https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/General-Credit-Topics/FICO-Score-Stress-Indicators-Indexes/td-p/5962374/jump-to/first-unread-message

I am curious about this score but not enough to blow $30.
Thanks for sharing this! Yeah, I currently have the boujee monthly 3 bureau subscription because I am in the process of some disputes and getting some inaccuracies removed. Once all that is done, I will not be paying for it anymore.

I also find it interesting that I am only seeing it from Equifax. My other two scores are higher, so maybe that's why?

It says the 2 reasons I am eing "red flagged" are a high amount of revolving debt (2 unpaid charge-offs on EQ) and the second reason is that I have a "high percentage of revolving accounts." In the little explanation box, it says, "Our predictive analysis shows that people who have a moderate mix of mortgage, installment loans (like auto) and credit cards may be more resilient in the event of an economic downturn."

Soo too many revolving accounts is a red flag apparently.

I mean everything is a red flag. As long as I'm getting what I want from my lenders, I'm not trying to stress about it. Pick some solid lenders for your core like CUs for some stability in rough times and you can weather the storm. If this whole coronavirus thing has taught me anything, it's that my instincts about making sure I have CUs in my wallet was spot on. If some of my banks want to go all slashy slashy on my cards, there are other cards. Just would have me moving more business to credit unions.

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

RehabbingANDBlabbing — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:09:32 GMT

I just saw this pop up on my 3 bureau report this month, which I pulled on 3/25. It is only showing up for my Equifax report, which is my worst score/report. No indexes are posted for my other two reports. My two "red flags" are a high percentage of revolving accounts (compared to other account types) and high revolving balances. The second one refers to two unpaid charge-offs showing on my EQ report. The rest of my balances total like $300 out of like $30k available, so it's definitely not any of my open accounts. I am also surprised i wasn't flagged for new accounts, because I have quite a few of those, but maybe the factors are weighted in terms of importance. I am looking forward to having those 2 inaccurate charge-offs removed soon, so hopefully my index score will improve.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

RehabbingANDBlabbing — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:20:14 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@RehabbingANDBlabbing wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
There's a thread about it that has more info and links - https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/General-Credit-Topics/FICO-Score-Stress-Indicators-Indexes/td-p/5962374/jump-to/first-unread-message

I am curious about this score but not enough to blow $30.
Thanks for sharing this! Yeah, I currently have the boujee monthly 3 bureau subscription because I am in the process of some disputes and getting some inaccuracies removed. Once all that is done, I will not be paying for it anymore.

I also find it interesting that I am only seeing it from Equifax. My other two scores are higher, so maybe that's why?

It says the 2 reasons I am eing "red flagged" are a high amount of revolving debt (2 unpaid charge-offs on EQ) and the second reason is that I have a "high percentage of revolving accounts." In the little explanation box, it says, "Our predictive analysis shows that people who have a moderate mix of mortgage, installment loans (like auto) and credit cards may be more resilient in the event of an economic downturn."

Soo too many revolving accounts is a red flag apparently.
I mean everything is a red flag. As long as I'm getting what I want from my lenders, I'm not trying to stress about it. Pick some solid lenders for your core like CUs for some stability in rough times and you can weather the storm. If this whole coronavirus thing has taught me anything, it's that my instincts about making sure I have CUs in my wallet was spot on. If some of my banks want to go all slashy slashy on my cards, there are other cards. Just would have me moving more business to credit unions.

I could not have said it better myself. I just find this whole thing a bit frustrating considering I am finally starting to get my credit back into a good place. And you're right, how our lenders treat us right now will show us who they really are in the long run. I am definitely not putting all my eggs into one basket, which is why I opened a few new cards this year. I am blacklisted at a few places, so I definitely looked a bit out of the way to find some good cards at smaller banks and CUs.

A good example of a great lender is Target. They have stuck with me through when my credit was in the toilet in 2017 and I had several credit cards go into charge-off status. They did not close my account or do any adverse action. I kept paying them on time every month, because I could afford to, but I am thankful they didn't shut down my account. And I still have it to this day. Discover has also been really good to me as well. The only other cards I am seeking in the forseeable future are the AmEx BCP for groceries, Cap1 Savor for the SUB and ongoing cash back similar to Marvel MC, and maybe the travel credit card from SSFCU for SUB and travel related spending. And I know it will take a whilw to get these until I get some inaccuracies removed, but I am steadily making progress toward those long term goals.

Re: FICO Score Stress Indicators/Indexes

Mv350 — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:23:10 GMT

I have the same exact ones, with under 10% UTI. It'll be interesting to see how if reacts to paid off balances vs carrying them. I also have a bunch of new accounts, but isn't exactly saying that is a red flag.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Anonymous — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 07:34:07 GMT

@RehabbingANDBlabbing wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
@RehabbingANDBlabbing wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
There's a thread about it that has more info and links - https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/General-Credit-Topics/FICO-Score-Stress-Indicators-Indexes/td-p/5962374/jump-to/first-unread-message

I am curious about this score but not enough to blow $30.
Thanks for sharing this! Yeah, I currently have the boujee monthly 3 bureau subscription because I am in the process of some disputes and getting some inaccuracies removed. Once all that is done, I will not be paying for it anymore.

I also find it interesting that I am only seeing it from Equifax. My other two scores are higher, so maybe that's why?

It says the 2 reasons I am eing "red flagged" are a high amount of revolving debt (2 unpaid charge-offs on EQ) and the second reason is that I have a "high percentage of revolving accounts." In the little explanation box, it says, "Our predictive analysis shows that people who have a moderate mix of mortgage, installment loans (like auto) and credit cards may be more resilient in the event of an economic downturn."

Soo too many revolving accounts is a red flag apparently.
I mean everything is a red flag. As long as I'm getting what I want from my lenders, I'm not trying to stress about it. Pick some solid lenders for your core like CUs for some stability in rough times and you can weather the storm. If this whole coronavirus thing has taught me anything, it's that my instincts about making sure I have CUs in my wallet was spot on. If some of my banks want to go all slashy slashy on my cards, there are other cards. Just would have me moving more business to credit unions.
I could not have said it better myself. I just find this whole thing a bit frustrating considering I am finally starting to get my credit back into a good place. And you're right, how our lenders treat us right now will show us who they really are in the long run. I am definitely not putting all my eggs into one basket, which is why I opened a few new cards this year. I am blacklisted at a few places, so I definitely looked a bit out of the way to find some good cards at smaller banks and CUs.

A good example of a great lender is Target. They have stuck with me through when my credit was in the toilet in 2017 and I had several credit cards go into charge-off status. They did not close my account or do any adverse action. I kept paying them on time every month, because I could afford to, but I am thankful they didn't shut down my account. And I still have it to this day. Discover has also been really good to me as well. The only other cards I am seeking in the forseeable future are the AmEx BCP for groceries, Cap1 Savor for the SUB and ongoing cash back similar to Marvel MC, and maybe the travel credit card from SSFCU for SUB and travel related spending. And I know it will take a whilw to get these until I get some inaccuracies removed, but I am steadily making progress toward those long term goals.

Those are some good choices. I griped about SSFCU in the past for their tech and their policies but in retrospect, they went above and beyond to approve me for their card because you have to get a $5K minimum limit and my profile at the time didn't really support one (three cards - $6250, $2K, and $1K but the $6250 was 4 years old and started at $300) One thing to know about them - they don't do auto anything. If you want a CLI or an APR reduction, it's a HP. I wanted to PC my Power Cash Back to the travel card and they told me that you have to apply for and be approved for it as a new card, can't PC. But they were one of the lenders with the best COVID-19 options. Any loans with them were automatically deferred 90 days and credit cards 30 days. No phone call needed as long as you were current when this happened. That's a solid lender right there.

Just keep doing what you're doing and it will be all good.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Nomad3 — Sun, 29 Mar 2020 20:02:24 GMT

I feel like the PDF explanation could have had more explanations. I had to google DPD Rate and I'm still not 100% sure what it is but I'm pretty sure it's Delinquincy rate?

Also, I couldn't figure out which end of the spectrum is better? Usually higher score = better, but this model looks like lower score is better?

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Anonymous — Sat, 04 Apr 2020 17:20:31 GMT

I think that only people within a certain range have generated this index score. It looks like this will be used by most lending institutions now given our current state. Looks like another number we will all have to work to maintain now! https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m8jTmdkzDOY

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Remedios — Sat, 04 Apr 2020 19:15:18 GMT

If you have a credit score, you have one.

I dont think you can get in anywhere else, though. You have to have a subscription here to see yours.

While it's unfortunate anyone felt the need to throw it out there right now, we all have to remember we're not the "real" customers, lenders are.

I doubt many will rely on a couple of digits to let them know how likely someone is to default. That's what the internal algorithm is for, and most have their own.

It's taking same factors into account as any FICO scoring model such as utilization, recency of new accounts, negatives, mix of credit.

That makes it even more puzzling as all of those are already "accounted" for in *regular* score.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

NRB525 — Tue, 07 Apr 2020 04:24:05 GMT

So after updating my 3-month MyFICO reports, I also have this Resilience index showing up. I am rated at 63 out of 99, higher score being worse.

There are only two red flags, associated with Amount of Debt, which apparently has a high impact on the Reslience index. Two reason codes: High Revolving Account Balances, and High Installment Loan Amounts due.

My Revolving account balances are at about $21k as of the latest MyFICO report snapshot. 6% Utilization on EX and EQ, 5% on TU where Apple Card is reporting. So low aggregate utilization percentage alone will not save you. A Dell Financing account is at 45% Utilization and a small LOC is at 32% utilization. Those factors may be increasing the red-flag situation.

The High Installment Loan Amounts seems to also include mortgage amounts.

The other factor categories are

Credit Mix (High Impact) with no red flags, so apparently a balance between revolving, installment, and mortgages.

Amount of New Credit - 3 new accounts in the last year, but apparently not enough to trigger a red flag here.

Length of Credit History - 20 years or more, so not surprising no red flags here.

Payment History - No missed payments anywhere so no red flags.

So I'm not sure how to improve the Resilience score, how much it will make a difference bringing down the revolving balances. They are either PIF items, or short term payment balances that should clear up in a few months. Whatever benefit comes from that, we'll see soon enough.

If the mortgage or installment items are the main weighting, then I don't see how the Resilience could be expected to improve.

The biggest factor in resilience is, do you have income continuing. In my role at work, and my skill set, I do not see any possibility of losing my job, unless the entire world shuts down for a year.

This would probably be more useful if they had a "user input" factor: "How confident are you that your job is secure?" It could even be a three-level choice: 1 = Very Confident 2 = Average 3 = High risk.

Re: FICO Resilience Index?

Remedios — Sun, 04 Apr 2021 00:25:44 GMT

Mine is 65

Main factors listed high utilization, which is at 6% till mid month when it should go to my usual 2%-3% and no open installment loan, which I now do have.

At the time it was generated, I had two paid off mortgages and 3 paid auto loans.

I'm not sure how often resilience index refreshes as it's still listing non existent reason for me