topic Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge in General Credit Topics

WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

BronzeTrader — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 16:01:11 GMT

WF BILT is one of the best cards out there. So I can't complain about the card. But this is a nasty surprise.

To meet the 5 spend requirement, I made some small charges and the total balance is about $4.00. Statement closed on the 28th and due on the 21st. Then I made the rent payment about $2,000 on the 1st.

I made a $1,500 payment before 21st and that more than cover the $4 statement balance. I always want to pay most of the balance before month end, so I can make new rent payment. But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder. WF is about the only bank that matches the two accounts. So it will deny payment from P2 account to pay P1 BILT card.

But that returned payment only posted several days after the payment date. So I made another $1,500 payment from inside WF and that went through.

So this resulted to a late payment. And WF charged me $36 interest charge. When I looked at my statement, it shows a 28% APR. WF rep said that rate if perfectly legal and it is part of the T&C that all cardholders accepted when they applied for the card.

Sure I phoned WF rep to complain. It is sad to see a $36 interest charge for a $4 statement balance and that WF rejected the original payment.

Anyhow, WF removed that nasty interest charge. But that 28% APR stays.

WF still gets a lot of work to improve itself.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

simplynoir — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 16:38:40 GMT

@BronzeTrader wrote:
I made a $1,500 payment before 21st and that more than cover the $4 statement balance. I always want to pay most of the balance before month end, so I can make new rent payment. But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder. WF is about the only bank that matches the two accounts. So it will deny payment from P2 account to pay P1 BILT card.

....

WF still gets a lot of work to improve itself.

I fail to see why WF needs to work to improve themselves in this situation. You attempted to make a payment from a checking/savings account that was not under your name. As a result when they tried to process the payment they discovered the bank account was not under your name and declined it. They have a right to cover themselves from potential fraud and deny the payment method as a result. This is something that pretty much all banks ask to confirm when you add bank accounts for making payments, certifying that the account is under your name or you're authorized to. Now while banks mostly don't really check like WF it doesn't make them the bad guys in this case. It was just bad timing on you part but in no way their fault

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

Anonymous — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 17:07:22 GMT

@simplynoir wrote:
@BronzeTrader wrote:
I made a $1,500 payment before 21st and that more than cover the $4 statement balance. I always want to pay most of the balance before month end, so I can make new rent payment. But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder. WF is about the only bank that matches the two accounts. So it will deny payment from P2 account to pay P1 BILT card.

....

WF still gets a lot of work to improve itself.

I fail to see why WF needs to work to improve themselves in this situation. You attempted to make a payment from a checking/savings account that was not under your name. As a result when they tried to process the payment they discovered the bank account was not under your name and declined it. They have a right to cover themselves from potential fraud and deny the payment method as a result. This is something that pretty much all banks ask to confirm when you add bank accounts for making payments, certifying that the account is under your name or you're authorized to. Now while banks mostly don't really check like WF it doesn't make them the bad guys in this case. It was just bad timing on you part but in no way their fault

Was the $36 interest or late fee? If interest I guess the $36 charge wasn't on the $4 balance (takes MUCH MUCH more than a 28% APR to do that in a month). My guess is that since the balance wasn't PIF (because of the returned payment) you also paid interest on the $2000 rent charge.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

simplynoir — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 17:34:48 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@simplynoir wrote:
@BronzeTrader wrote:
I made a $1,500 payment before 21st and that more than cover the $4 statement balance. I always want to pay most of the balance before month end, so I can make new rent payment. But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder. WF is about the only bank that matches the two accounts. So it will deny payment from P2 account to pay P1 BILT card.

....

WF still gets a lot of work to improve itself.

I fail to see why WF needs to work to improve themselves in this situation. You attempted to make a payment from a checking/savings account that was not under your name. As a result when they tried to process the payment they discovered the bank account was not under your name and declined it. They have a right to cover themselves from potential fraud and deny the payment method as a result. This is something that pretty much all banks ask to confirm when you add bank accounts for making payments, certifying that the account is under your name or you're authorized to. Now while banks mostly don't really check like WF it doesn't make them the bad guys in this case. It was just bad timing on you part but in no way their fault

Was the $36 interest or late fee? If interest I guess the $36 charge wasn't on the $4 balance (takes MUCH MUCH more than a 28% APR to do that in a month). My guess is that since the balance wasn't PIF (because of the returned payment) you also paid interest on the $2000 rent charge.

OP mentions the $36 is the interest fee that they were able to get credited back due to late payment, penalty APR is stuck though

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

BronzeTrader — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 18:09:38 GMT

@simplynoir wrote:
@BronzeTrader wrote:
I made a $1,500 payment before 21st and that more than cover the $4 statement balance. I always want to pay most of the balance before month end, so I can make new rent payment. But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder. WF is about the only bank that matches the two accounts. So it will deny payment from P2 account to pay P1 BILT card.

....

WF still gets a lot of work to improve itself.

I fail to see why WF needs to work to improve themselves in this situation. You attempted to make a payment from a checking/savings account that was not under your name. As a result when they tried to process the payment they discovered the bank account was not under your name and declined it. They have a right to cover themselves from potential fraud and deny the payment method as a result. This is something that pretty much all banks ask to confirm when you add bank accounts for making payments, certifying that the account is under your name or you're authorized to. Now while banks mostly don't really check like WF it doesn't make them the bad guys in this case. It was just bad timing on you part but in no way their fault

This is clearly not true. I've made many many credit card payment from any banks, and I only recall WF declined payments. So WF is an odd thing to do such. If I paid from inside WF or inside BILT, then I get no problem. Fraud? Where does that come from?

Anyhow. The $36 is interest charge. I guess that is on the $2,000 new balance. WF does not even want to both with late charge since it is a $4 statement balance.

My point is that, we should be aware that some CC banks charge very high interest rate. This is the reason that US Congress tries to get to those CC banks for charging extremely high interest rate. Then banks have to justify the 28% interest rate.

If the CC customer rep did not remove the charge, I can certainly visit local branch to get the banker remove that.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

Turbobuick — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 19:24:03 GMT

Whether the interest rate is 5% or 35%, you can decline the cc offer. All the terms are in that 10 page fine print contract they send or email.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

GZG — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 19:39:38 GMT

@BronzeTrader wrote:
But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder.

I guess this goes without saying, but a potential P1+P2 joint account in the future might be worth considering to avoid this in the future

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

FinStar — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 20:29:33 GMT

@Turbobuick wrote:
Whether the interest rate is 5% or 35%, you can decline the cc offer. All the terms are in that 10 page fine print contract they send or email.

Right.

Clearly, the T&Cs are clearly spelled out before clicking the submit button and checking the box that one accepts such T&Cs. So, a returned payment is not Wells Fargo's fault if something doesn't match in their systems.

Plus, the last time I checked WF (and other FIs) are not charities. So, while they've had their share of really bad publicity, the system performed the F/C and L/F actions on the account accordingly 🤷‍♂️ This would have been no different outcome-wise if it had been Capital One, Citi, Chase, BoA, etc., and BILT was a partner of any of those FIs instead of WF.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

simplynoir — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 20:45:29 GMT

@BronzeTrader wrote:
My point is that, we should be aware that some CC banks charge very high interest rate. This is the reason that US Congress tries to get to those CC banks for charging extremely high interest rate. Then banks have to justify the 28% interest rate.

They did justify it in your case though because of the late payment which triggered the maximum APR they can charge you. Or heck maybe that is what you were approved with I have no idea what your approval terms were. But the APRs listed on the Bilt card page does mention a max APR of 28.49% is possible if approved depending on credit worthiness. So I'm failing to see what you are talking about here

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

Remedios — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 20:55:16 GMT

Someone educate me, but I thought payment account used must be cardholder's or joint account?

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

wasCB14 — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:03:27 GMT

@Remedios wrote:
Someone educate me, but I thought payment account used must be cardholder's or joint account?

Banks vary. IME Amex and Citi aren't fussy at all. Chase wants the payment account to be in the name of a primary or AU.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

FinStar — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:05:56 GMT

@Remedios wrote:
Someone educate me, but I thought payment account used must be cardholder's or joint account?

Some FIs (not all) allow non-cardholder or third party payment account to be used online, but only once said account is vetted properly including any vendor or third party UI. The reason I stated "some" is because not every FI accepts a non-cardholder or joint account party as a payee for online or other direct payments. In most instances, things must match on both ends of ACH.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

simplynoir — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:07:02 GMT

And to go back to the payment issue that caused this, here is an example from AMEX's add bank account page. It clearly states there: "You must be the bank holder or an authorized signer on the bank account." Simply being a family member that lets you is not enough, you gotta be listed on the account to make the payment. Again, most banks don't care or figure the customer/bank will catch it since they're getting paid, WF can't be blamed for doing their actual due deligence for once

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

BronzeTrader — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:07:37 GMT

@GZG wrote:
@BronzeTrader wrote:
But WF returned the payment since the payment account owner does not match the BILT card holder.
I guess this goes without saying, but a potential P1+P2 joint account in the future might be worth considering to avoid this in the future

Sure this is something we can do. But it is far more complex than that. We have 4 BILT cards. And I have multiple bank account to pay off those cards. It is just that sometime, this is out of my radar and WF BILT is very special. I have no problem paying other WF CCs.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

BronzeTrader — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:10:49 GMT

Regardless of the payment account, charging $36 for a $4 statement balance?

I have some other CCs that will even skip the payment all together. Nothing is even due for such tiny amount.

Sure the CC customer rep knew it. Local banks will certainly know it too.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

BronzeTrader — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:14:10 GMT

@wasCB14 wrote:
@Remedios wrote:
Someone educate me, but I thought payment account used must be cardholder's or joint account?
Banks vary. IME Amex and Citi aren't fussy at all. Chase wants the payment account to be in the name of a primary or AU.

With my experience, this is not true.

I use one major bank to do all the payments. I do all CC payments from the same account (P1+P2) for all credit cards. WF, AmEx, Chase, Barclay, TD, Citi, US Bank. P1, P2, P3 and P4. Never any single problem other than WF BILT.

And I do not have problem with paying from inside BILT account.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

FinStar — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:17:22 GMT

@BronzeTrader wrote:
Regardless of the payment account, charging $36 for a $4 statement balance?

I have some other CCs that will even skip the payment all together. Nothing is even due for such tiny amount.

Sure the CC customer rep knew it. Local banks will certainly know it too.

The F/C calculation wasn't on just the $4. It was on the ADB of the larger amount, which included the $4 since it was calculated with ADB for the X number of days before you corrected the NSF instance. I bet if you sat down and did the math diligently with the ADB based on what you stated further upthread, you'd see how WF's system charged the $36.

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

simplynoir — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:18:22 GMT

@wasCB14 wrote:
@Remedios wrote:
Someone educate me, but I thought payment account used must be cardholder's or joint account?
Banks vary. IME Amex and Citi aren't fussy at all. Chase wants the payment account to be in the name of a primary or AU.

I remember one time when Chase called me because I used my personal account that didn't have my wife's name on it to pay for her Altitude Reserve credit card bill. They wanted to make sure it was a legit payment and not her just using my acount without permission. I verified it with them and that was that. They didn't say anything about not doing it again, just a "okay, thanks. bye!"

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

Jnbmom — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:24:46 GMT

I can only confirm that cap one doesn't care apparently. I have been helping our son out of a little bind . I added my bank account to his C1 account and made a few payments . They didn't blink an eye . He is NOT on my banking account .

Re: WF BILT Huge Interest Charge

FinStar — Sun, 01 Jan 2023 21:28:05 GMT

@Jnbmom wrote:
I can only confirm that cap one doesn't care apparently. I have been helping our son out of a little bind . I added my bank account to his C1 account and made a few payments . They didn't blink an eye . He is NOT on my banking account .

I have a statement cycling soon @Jnbmom. Since Capital One didn't mind, would you care if we replicate the same results for my account? 😂 for science of course and the generosity of 2023 🤪