topic NewWorld, you have a Bank Of America card. Even though i... in General Credit Topics

The Futility of Trying to Improve FICO

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 07:58:05 GMT

Folks, all I can say is if you're trying to improve your FICO, good luck. Ain't gonna happen. At least not in your lifetimes. It's a rigged system. Do anything wrong, and they'll drop your score like a radioactive chunk of lead. And once your score drops--especially due to charge-off or bankruptcy--the corporations will commit seppuku with dental tools before they ever let it rise. Here's what I suggest you do as a cure for your credit woes. Get a good lawn chair, and relax. Wait for the Sun to age, move off the main sequence, and swell into a red giant. Solar radiation will then ionize the upper atmosphere, and about ten kilowatts of hard ultraviolet and X-rays per square meter will fry FICO and all three credit bureaus along with the rest of the Earth. This will happen FAR more quickly than your FICO score going up, and it will be much more fun to watch too. And it's FREE. : gathering a barbecue grill, some burgers, steaks and fries and A1, putting on SPF 5000 sunblock and welding goggles, and watching the sky with anticipation :

Wow New World. The rig must have broken because even wit...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 11:31:08 GMT

Wow New World. The rig must have broken because even with a BK on my record my scores are now 676-702. I understand your frustration but please don't discourage people who are honestly looking for ways to improve their scores by scaring them into thinking they will forever be in debtors h*ll. That's the very thing that kept my score in the 5s for years. Settling for one subprome card and never knowing what I COULD do to improve my scores.

I agree with Brammy

antredd67 — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 17:02:11 GMT

As Americans, we have become so spoiled that I think we sometimes forget how bless we truely are. I will say that if you are looking to make a major purchase like buy a home, then your FICO score matters big time.

We have become so obsessed with having credit and getting things now and paying for it later that we have a record number of people (about 900,000) who are about to default on their home loans because banks and home builders were so greedy into getting these people to believe that they could afford a 200,000-400,000 house on a 40,000 a year salary. WHAT EVER HAPPENED TO LIVE WITHIN YOUR MEANS.

I listen to a financial talk show host Dave Ramsey and he makes a lot of sense in regards to managing our money. He believes that besides purchasing a house, we should not be buying anything on credit. We should not be purchasing cars brand new when they depreciate as fast as we drive off the lot, and if we don't need it don't buy anything on credit. In fact all of us should have at least 6 months emergency fund of living expenses before we even think about slurging.

But what ends up happening is that we see our neighbors and family members purchasing new houses, new cars, and we become pressured to do the same thing.

GREAT INFORMATION

credit_safe — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 17:21:23 GMT

That was said perfect. You could almost sell that. Funny thing is it's so true and honest it's priceless no pun intended.

In my case, it was a few unpaid bills caused primarily by...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 17:36:20 GMT

In my case, it was a few unpaid bills caused primarily by a long-term illness. I don't like buying things on credit either...the only reason I even have a credit card is to improve FICO, not actually buy anything on credit. And for a time, it actually worked...got my score up eight points.

But the collection agencies are conspiring to keep my credit score down...every time it starts to go up, they take another of my OLD collection accounts (2001 to 2004) and report it again as if it is NEW. They just did that last week and knocked my score back DOWN nine points. That is what gets me angry enough to wish a meteor strike would obliterate them all and let God sort them out. If they would just report the debt once and leave it at that, it wouldn't be a big deal. I'd probably be at around 620 or so and climbing. But no, they have to keep RE-reporting it over and over again, making it look like it just charged off yesterday. Aren't there supposed to be laws against industries conspiring against consumers?

And then my own bank refuses to approve me for a credit-line increase even though I have ALWAYS paid their card on time.

So I'm just telling it like it is. My advice to anyone blacklisted with a low credit score and unable to buy a home is to LEAVE the U.S. and buy property elsewhere. That's what I intend to do. I'll settle in my fiance's homeland where my name isn't on some quasi-government/corporate list.

NewWorld, you have a Bank Of America card. Even though i...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 17:41:59 GMT

NewWorld, you have a Bank Of America card. Even though it is secured that is a prime issuer so they are likely to be sticklers when it comes to unsecuring or raising you limits sth the baddies. Try applying for a Household bank card. Its great for rebuilding and gives regular increases. However as soon as you have recovered enough to apply for better cards, move up. You'll know when that happens when BOFA unsecures you or increases your limit.

Just remember: Either PIF everymonth or keep your utilization down below 30%. Here's a tip; Household reports your balance as it stands at the EOM not on your statement date.

That's not entirely true Brammy...

dlm0820 — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 17:59:30 GMT

My Household card reports the balance as of my cutoff date on the 2nd. They report to the bureaus on the 5th. So I know whatever the balance is on the card, not my statement is what gets reported to the bureaus.

My bad. Maybe they changed it since I closed mine last y...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 18:13:32 GMT

My bad. Maybe they changed it since I closed mine last year. They used to report my account balance EOM as of the balance of that date. Do you have the credit rebuilding card with the annual fee? Plain old Household Bank MasterCard or one of their near prime cards? The one I was talking about was the rebuilding card with the 59.00 annual fee.

Message Edited by Brammy on 03-25-2007 02:13 PM

Yeah, but won't Household charge like $100 in annual fees...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 18:13:37 GMT

Yeah, but won't Household charge like $100 in annual fees? That's what all the credit card companies want unless your credit score is up there with that of Satan Himself.

Depends on which card you apply for. The one I started w...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 18:17:22 GMT

Depends on which card you apply for. The one I started with was their highest at the time I believe a 59.00 annual fee. Some have fees as low as 39.00, some no fees at all. Remember, at the time I applied I had a fresh bankruptcy on my report and you don't seem to be in nearly as bad a shape as all that. They also offer Orchard. Go out to the website and see what you come up with. You can always decline the offer and one inquiry won't kill you. They have some sort of thing that does a pull and tells you which card they will offer yo.

That's the rub...you wouldn't think a few charge-offs wou...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 19:08:34 GMT

That's the rub...you wouldn't think a few charge-offs would be that bad, but I can't get approved for anything, even department-store cards. You'd think I'd joined Al-Quaeda or pulled a string of bank robberies, from the way the credit world shuns me. That's why I'll probably end up just saying the heck with it and buying a home abroad.

I have the HHB regular card

dlm0820 — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 19:51:17 GMT

that carries a $79 annual fee. It's a little steep for the fee, but all I could get 3 years agao when I applied. I have the CL up to $1,200 which isn't bad for a rebuilder card. I don't remember what my scores were 3 years ago, but I'm sure having the Household card helped bring them up.

$79...no thanks, that's about 8% or so of my PLANE TICKET...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:01:16 GMT

@dlm0820 wrote:
that carries a $79 annual fee. It's a little steep for the fee, but all I could get 3 years agao when I applied. I have the CL up to $1,200 which isn't bad for a rebuilder card. I don't remember what my scores were 3 years ago, but I'm sure having the Household card helped bring them up.

$79...no thanks, that's about 8% or so of my PLANE TICKET to a country where no one's even heard of FICO...lol.

Well at least it reports better than it used to. I'm sur...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:02:17 GMT

Well at least it reports better than it used to. I'm sure its the same card I got in '03 just the fee went up. I closed mine in 06 luckily I had another card opened at the same time so my average age didn't suffer a whole ot.

$79...no thanks, that's about 8% or so of my PLANE TICKET...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:04:54 GMT

@dlm0820 wrote:
that carries a $79 annual fee. It's a little steep for the fee, but all I could get 3 years agao when I applied. I have the CL up to $1,200 which isn't bad for a rebuilder card. I don't remember what my scores were 3 years ago, but I'm sure having the Household card helped bring them up.

$79...no thanks, that's about 8% or so of my PLANE TICKET to a country where no one's even heard of FICO...lol.

Not to be blunt New World but your mistakes are what cost you on your FICO score. If you'd like to improve, you'll have to pay the price of those mistakes. Onthing that will bring your score down and keep you from getting better offers are low limits. From what you say BOFA isn't in a big Hurry to give you better limits. HHB does regularly increase. 79.00 may be a portion of a plane ticket. However, a 50 point FICO boost can theoretically save you thousands of dollars in subprime lending interest.

But the problem is my score will never improve. As soon a...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:09:23 GMT

@Anonymous wrote:
@dlm0820 wrote:
that carries a $79 annual fee. It's a little steep for the fee, but all I could get 3 years agao when I applied. I have the CL up to $1,200 which isn't bad for a rebuilder card. I don't remember what my scores were 3 years ago, but I'm sure having the Household card helped bring them up.

$79...no thanks, that's about 8% or so of my PLANE TICKET to a country where no one's even heard of FICO...lol.
Not to be blunt New World but your mistakes are what cost you on your FICO score. If you'd like to improve, you'll have to pay the price of those mistakes. Onthing that will bring your score down and keep you from getting better offers are low limits. From what you say BOFA isn't in a big Hurry to give you better limits. HHB does regularly increase. 79.00 may be a portion of a plane ticket. However, a 50 point FICO boost can theoretically save you thousands of dollars in subprime lending interest.

But the problem is my score will never improve. As soon as it starts to go up, one of the collection agencies steps in to RE-report the old debt and list last month as the "First Reported" date, thus knocking my score down again. I don't mind that the old debts are listed; as you said, those were my mistakes. What I DO mind is when they are RE-listed, and RE-RE-listed, and so on, ad infinitum. The banks will never raise my credit limit until my FICO improves. And my FICO will never improve until I get things like higher credit limits. See the conundrum? So the only answer I have if I ever want to buy a home is to emigrate to a country where they've never heard of FICO.

What you are describing is called re-aging which is illeg...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 20:14:46 GMT

What you are describing is called re-aging which is illegal. Reaging is the process through which a new last date of delinquency with the original creditor is reported. Have you noticed a change in that date? Though they don't have a right to do this, they do have a right to report it monthly as unpaid. While true the longer it goes without reporting the less impact it has, have you ever considered paying them off to stop it? Are they affordable? How long has it been there? Are you close to your reporting limits as far as seven years?

Moreover as long as its active and within the 7 yr period it can be sold over and over again and each new collection will show up on your report.

If they are reaging the debt, contact a lawyer orthe FTC.

I started at $300

dlm0820 — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 21:06:28 GMT

with my HHB card and got increases about every 6 months for about $250 without doing anything except paying on time. Yeah, it sucks that I have to pay $79, but that's the price I pay for messing up my credit. I'll take the $1,200 credit limit and have them report as an account in good standing and pay the $79 in order for my account to age and show my ontime payments. Same goes for my auto loan. I'm paying through the nose in interest, but it's another trade line and I have to bite the bullet and deal with it. My wife and I make enough so that we can make the payments, but if making a large payment on my car will raise my score and get me a prime rate for a mortgage so be it.

There are lots of things you can do NewWorld. Have you actually tried to disupute the re-aged items? Brammy's right, they can't keep adding it back and re-aging it. 7 years from the date of last deliquency is when the accounts hould fall off your report. Also, you can do pay for deletes, something I wish I knew before I paid my collection account. There's no harm in asking, just make sure to get it in writing if they say they will.

I just called Macy's last week to tell them to please update my file as the balance they show me owing was reduced in a settlement I made with their CA. The woman was very nice and agreed to update my file. If they don't, then I'll disupte in writing with the CA's showing the cancelled check with their Collection Agency.

Instead of compalining that you can't do anything, try doing something first. Really look at your report and see what can be disputed. Worse comes to worse, go for a pay for delete with the CA and see what happens. Don't just blame FICO for your score not going up. You are ultimatley responsible for your own actions and score. If you keep letting everything go and not following up when stuff is reported, of course your score is going to go down.

You gotta think positive. Last year was a good year for me. I managed to pass my licensing exams, my son was born and I got a decent bonus at work. I'm gonna try to think positive for this year as well. I'm gonna think that this year I will get above 700 on my scores so that by next year we'll be able to get the house that we want. You'd be surprised as to how much mental attitude plays a part in what we do. If you think you will fail and everyone is against you then you will and they are.

Credit is a game that you have to know how to play. One strike and you're out unfortunatley. You gottat pick yourself up and recoup.

Good luck with whatever you do.

Message Edited by dlm0820 on 03-25-2007 02:06 PM

Actually, I have been doing a lot to work on improving my...

Anonymous — Sun, 25 Mar 2007 22:37:18 GMT

Actually, I have been doing a lot to work on improving my credit score...I got the secured card throughh BofA, another card through CapitalOne, I've paid them both on time. The problem is that the FICO scoring system is configured to recognize and be influenced by only the NEGATIVE, not the POSITIVE. Every time my score starts to rise, something beyond my control comes along to knock it back down again.

The bottom line is that this whole system needs reform. The Feds need to step in and outlaw some of the practices that have been used against me, like endlessly re-reporting an old debt. They need to mandate that EVERY creditor report monthly, including credit limits, and that the data submitted in these reports be current. The FICO scoring system needs to be reformed to better take into account the positive steps people like me take to improve our credit.

But it would be easier to push Earth out of its orbit than it is for any citizen in this country to make a difference these days. So the bottom line is it's easier for me to emigrate to another country and make a fresh start there than it is for me to improve my FICO score here in the U.S. I've been pushing at it for six months and have made exactly zero progress.

It shouldn't be that way, but it is.

Hey NewWorld, Not to talk down on your or anything but...

Anonymous — Mon, 26 Mar 2007 00:24:08 GMT

Hey NewWorld,

Not to talk down on your or anything but is the debt you owe too great to pay off? It seems like you're waiting for the 7 to 10 year listing period to expire and all will be forgotten. Something tells me that it may be for a substantial amount of money since they are determined to keep your credit score down by re-listing it. Have you considered working on paying off the debt by any chance? Creditors and CA's are very hip to this stunt and will try anything to keep reminding you (and other potential lenders) of the outstanding debt you have. I also tried, as many people do, to wait until the listing period to expire and hope that it is erased off of my report. During which I realized that unpaid accounts typically go from late then to delinquent then to seriously delinquent/dorrogatory then to collections then to judgements. Judgements can stay on your report and hurt your score for up to 10 years and WILL NOT be removed until the judgement is satisfied through the court in which it was filed.

The creditors and CA's bank on the fact that sooner or later, you are going to come into a situation where you're going to need credit whether it's for a house, car, student or personal loan. Most people at some point in their lives need credit in one of those forms and that's where your credit report and your FICO score comes into play. There are many ways they can hurt your credit score but two commom ways are simply re-listing bad debt or entering a civil judgement against you. I'm almost ashamed to say that I've had many judgements before because I tried to "wait it out" like you and most other people. If you could try to pay off the debt, you may find that they may be willing to be more flexible in terms of a payment plan until the debt is paid because the bottom line is they only want the debt paid. They really don't have any interest in keeping your FICO score or you down.