topic Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates in Rebuilding Your Credit

Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Tue, 03 Oct 2017 17:30:29 GMT

As I've researched the heck out of the issues that are on my credit report, Portfolio Recovery Associates has taken center stage. I'd read reports of them reporting as a Factoring Company opposed to a collections agency, and sure enough, they have been reporting as BOTH on my credit reports for quite a while. They own two accounts of mine, and each account is being reported as duplicates--once as a collections account with one account number, and then as a factoring account with a different account number. To clarify, two accounts, but reported four separate times on my report.

I've read success stories from approaching the BBB with PRA, so I am sharing my experience there:

9/12: Filed complaint with BBB

9/18: Filed required paperwork for BBB to contact PRA on my behalf

9/28: BBB contacts me to let me know PRA didn't respond by the deadline, and they were contacting again.

9/28: I responded that I was not satisfied.

10/2: PRA responded with a very, VERY lengthy report to the BBB including:

Demands that my complaint and their communication not be published for public viewing
Denying 100% that they report as a factoring company
Stated "Because of the consumer's allegation that PRA did something that it does not do, i.e. describe itself as a "factoring company" or its accounts as "factoring accounts," PRA emphatically expects and requests that the details of neither the complaint nor the response be published on the BBB website
They claimed that my complaint is completely false and ubsubstantiated

10/3: I responded with:

Copies of the pages referenced from my credit reports, and the following response:
Tamara Bond, the Regulatory Compliance Analyst, closes out her letter by stating "Because of the consumer's allegation that PRA did something it does not do, i.e., describe itself as a "factoring company" or its accounts as "factoring accounts", PRA empahatically requests and expects that the details of neither the complaint nor the response will be published on the BBB website." I have attached portions of my credit report which show that Tamara Bond and PRA are both lying in their response, and in fact doing exactly that.

Tamara Bond's letter also indicates "PRA does not and did not describe itself as a "factoring company" or its accounts as "factoring accounts." The consumer's allegation was inappropriate and wholly unsubstantiated." Again, PRA is attempting to dismiss and ignore the facts of the matter by lying directly to the Better Business Bureau. Please see the attached documents which are directly from my credit report wherein it shows exactly what I've filed a complaint about--and I will be very adamantly sharing the information on consumer websites and public areas if the matter is not resolved per my request.

Note: Attachments showing PROOF that PRA is lying about reporting as a factoring company were submitted via email. I am shocked that the company can lie so freely while the proof is black and white.

I'm not sure what will happen from here. Either way, they've been a pain in the butt to deal with since I first learned about them owning these accounts. Anybody else have similar experiences or have any expectations from here? I've read stories around different forums where people got to this point and had success with accounts being deleted... but who knows. Either way, I'll keep the updates rolling in.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

RobertEG — Tue, 03 Oct 2017 19:58:25 GMT

In determining how to address inaccurate reporting to a CRA, the recommended steps, in order, are:

1. File a dispute with the CRA, which compels a "reasonable investigation" by both the furnisher and the CRA within 30 days, and sending of their Notice of Results of Reinvestigation within 5 business days thereafter. A dispute is also required under FCRA 623(c) as pre-condition to later filing of any civil action against them.

2. File a complaint with the CFPB, which has authority under the FCRA for administrative consideration of violations of both the FCRA and FDCPA.

3. File a complaint with the BBB, which is informal complaint, as the BBB has no authority to compel action.

Since you have documentation to support both a dispute under the FCRA and/or a formal complaint with the CFPB, I would recommend those actions rather than reliance on an informal complaint of business practices to the BBB,

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Tue, 03 Oct 2017 19:47:37 GMT

Thank you for the feedback. I will certainly look into doing that--been literally going step-by-step following another few peoples' success stories with the same situation and PRA; hopefully this will do the trick, if not, I'll keep going with your recs!

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Anonymous — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 03:52:39 GMT

Ive read several positive results with CFPB, where its removed, I guess they don't want government attention especially since the last time they got smacked by uncle sam. i intend to do the same with my PRA paid collection account.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 14:28:02 GMT

There was a thread I read where it was a step-by-step on how using the BBB only, PRA disappeared for a consumer. Mine has literally gone exactly the same way so far, but I'm not to the finish line yet. They responded firmly and vehemently denying any wrongdoing--in fact calling me a liar for claiming they were. I responded to the BBB letting them know that I vehemently and firmly disagree with PRA, and uploaded the pages from my credit report proving the dishonesty. That proof was forwarded to PRA yesterday, so fingers crossed...

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Adkins — Tue, 10 Oct 2017 16:06:53 GMT

Fingers crossed for you! Please keep us updated!

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Anonymous — Fri, 20 Oct 2017 19:24:16 GMT

Hi Myfico fam, very long time lurker here - first time posting...

@Zizo have you gotten a response back from PRA?? im in the same step - they reply to my complaint on BBB 2 days ago(similar to yours) and I sent my response back to them along with the proof from my credit report.

Trying to get an idea on timeframe if any on their 2nd response.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

maxgold — Sat, 21 Oct 2017 18:58:06 GMT

Did the collection pass the SOL? How much is the collection amount?

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 15:48:38 GMT

So an update:

PRA has taken every second available for their responses. Unbelievably to me (sarcasm), they've failed to accurately address what I've submitted the complaint about. So apologize for the formatting, but here is the last two weeks:

October 13 (Response from PRA): We were unable to locate the consumer's copies of the credit reports which the consumer stated were "submitted via email." PRA does not and did not describe itself as a "factoring company" or its accounts as "factoring accounts". PRA furnishes account information in accordance with the Fair Credit Reporting Act, its implementing regulations, and the Credit Reporting Resource Guide. As noted on page 2-7 of the Guide, Debt Buyers such as PRA are instructed to describe the "type" of their accounts with the code "OC". PRA consistently furnished the account type code "OC" - not the description "Factoring Company" - to the credit reporting agencies with regard to the accounts ending in 6324 and 2008.

To reiterate: The consumer's allegation, that PRA "is illegally reporting" its "accounts as Factoring Company", was inappropriate and wholly unsubstantiated. PRA has neither the authority nor the ability to change the manner in which the consumer reporting agencies, such as Experian, Equifax and TransUnion, describe or report the information we furnish. Any differences in their descriptions or reporting of the information PRA furnishes is the responsibility of the consumer reporting agencies, not PRA.

October 17 (My response): (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
PRA continues to blatantly lie. I have furnished photo evidence from my credit reports which show that PRA is in fact reporting multiple accounts, in multiple ways... including as a Factoring Company (which per Tamara Bond's own words is a violation of the FCRA--who will be receiving the same complaint today since PRA has had many opportunities to do the right thing and correct the illegal actions, but has instead attempted to act as a bully toward consumers as it has for a long time... there is a reason PRA has the reputation it has). I am including AGAIN the photo proof and demand that PRA deletes any history from all of the credit agencies as a means to close this matter. If done swiftly, the FCRA will not need to deal with this complaint as well.

The proof is in the pictures. PRA is acting illegally and needs to be held accountable--from its first response it was more concerned with keeping complaints from public view than in handling the fact that it is hurting yet another consumer.

October 23 (Response from PRA): This communication is from a debt collector: This message may contain confidential and/or nonpublic personal information and is intended solely for resolution of a complaint forwarded to Portfolio Recovery Associates, LLC ("PRA") by the Better Business Bureau of Greater Hampton Roads ("BBB"); dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.

The credit reports attached to the consumer's complaint do not appear to be from the agencies to which PRA furnishes account information. PRA does not describe itself as a "factoring" company or describe the debts it purchases as "revolving" or "factoring" accounts. PRA has neither the authority nor the ability to change the manner in which the consumer reporting agencies to which we furnish information, Experian, Equifax and TransUnion, describe or report the information we furnish. Any differences in their descriptions or reporting of the information PRA furnishes is the responsibility of the consumer reporting agencies, not PRA.
The consumer's allegation, that PRA "is illegally reporting" its "accounts as Factoring Company", was inappropriate and wholly unsubstantiated. PRA's records reflect that PRA purchased the relevant accounts together with the right to receive payment of the balance due on the accounts, provided appropriate initial notification information to its customer, validated the relevant account-related information, verified the integrity and accuracy of the relevant information PRA furnished to the credit-reporting agencies, and provided to its customer documentation from the original accounts validating the PRA accounts with its most recent letter dated on or about October 14, 2017.

October 24 (My response): (The consumer indicated he/she DID NOT accept the response from the business.)
If it weren't such a serious and common occurrence with this company, it would be laughable. They have contradicted themselves throughout this process, and are now stating that the credit report doesn't look like one they report to. The evidence in this case is black and white--and even circled in red to alleviate concern that the reporting as a factoring company could somehow be overlooked. PRA continues to bully consumers, and a quick Google search or search over at the myFico forums show just how nasty this company is, and its reputation is well warranted.

I have shown the evidence. PRA continues to try deflecting the evidence and claiming that despite the evidence and proof that the complaint is unsubstantiated... PRA has been slapped with massive fines and such due to these kinds of practices. For reference, here are two quick results:

https://www.consumerfinance.gov/about-us/newsroom/cfpb-takes-action-against-the-two-largest-debt-buyers-for-using-deceptive-tactics-to-collect-bad-debts/

http://files.consumerfinance.gov/f/201509_cfpb_consent-order-portfolio-recovery-associates-llc.pdf

All of this, in combination with the evidence showing exactly what PRA is doing (which they are denying repeatedly here with the BBB), suggests that they are predatory and willing to lie and deceive in order to go after consumers.

If this isn't resolved to my satisfaction, I will be pursuing every outlet to highlight this company's continued illegal practice.

October 25 (Today), I was sent an offer to mediate from the BBB because no satisfactory agreement could be reached. Our initial effort to reach a voluntary settlement on the above-mentioned complaint has not been successful.

If you would like to pursue this matter further, the BBB would like to offer mediation.

Mediation would be through a volunteer Supreme Court certified mediator. The mediator's role is not to tell either party the solution that should be reached but rather, to assist in helping both parties at arriving at a mutually agreeable solution. It will be mutually agreeable because it will be a solution that both parties will have a say. If you're not able to reach a solution then both parties are free to walk away; a solution will not be forced on either party. At that point you are free to pursue whatever means you feel necessary.

Please inform our office five (5) days from today's date. Otherwise, we will assume you no longer seek assistance through the BBB and your file will be closed.

***In summary, PRA demanded multiple times that the BBB not publish my complaint. Additionally, they blatantly denied reporting as a Factoring Company or reporting Factoring Accounts, despite the fact that I uploaded copies from my credit reports showing exactly that. The first two responses were from a Regulatory Compliance Analyst, while the final response was from a different Regulatory Compliance Analyst. Their responses took the approach of deny and deflect, while accusing me of being a liar and offering unsubstantiated claims (despite the claims being entirely substantiated). The BBB never took any actions throughout, just relaying messages--and no resolution was reached. At this point I'll be filing a complaint with the FCRA and trying that route.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Kree — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 16:04:31 GMT

@Zizou615 wrote:

dissemination, distribution or copying of this communication is strictly prohibited.

I love how businesses always include this line. Prohibited by who? The business? If we cared what they thought we wouldn't be filing complaints.

Kudos to you for standing up for free speech and open discussion.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

RobertEG — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 16:49:52 GMT

It is a bit unclear as to why the issue of whether or not they are reporting as a "factoring company" is relevant to the continued reporting of the collection.

That issue is separate from and verifiable or corrrectible reporting that does not mandate, even if inaccurate, any deletion of their reporting as a debt buyer who now owns the debt.

The post asserts that reporting as a "factoring company" is per se illegal. Factoring companies are legitimate businesses, and it is unclear as to how reference to being a factoring company is per se inaccurate or illegal.

Regardless, they assert that they have only reported account type to the CRA as being code 0C, which is the Credit Reporting Resource Guide code for a Debt Buyer.

There is thus a disagreement in fact as to what they have reported.

A statement made in a commercial credit report is not evidence of what was actually reported to the CRA.

They assert reporting as account type 0C.

What specific documentation, other than the commercial credit report, evidences that their statement of reporting as type 0C is a "lie" ?

If their reporting is asserted to be inaccurate and reported with knowledge of its inaccuracy, then you have recourse to filing a civil action under FCRA 623(c), but only after having first filed a dispute with the CRA challenging its accuracy. The CRA would then be forced to weigh-in on what their file record shows as the accuracy of their reporting of the account type. A BBB or CFPB complaint is not adequate to first establish CRA reinvestigation of the accuracy, as mandated under FCRA 623(c), before the consumer can pursue civll action regarding their reporting. A BBB complaint will not formally establish the accuracy or inaccuracy.

I would recommend consultation with an attorney regarding pursuing your own civil action if you seek a clear legal resolution of the issue of whether they have reported as a factoring company, and even if they have, whether that is per se illegal and basis for any removal of their reported collection.

The BBB is not a legal resolution forum.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 16:59:03 GMT

Thanks for the info. I suppose what I'm confused about based on your reply is why would PRA's accounts be reporting as Factoring Accounts from a Factoring Company on each credit report I pull, as opposed to Collections Accounts from a Collections Company? The forums here are how I discovered the discrepency and thus moved forward with the complaint.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Anonymous — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:16:21 GMT

@Zizou615 wrote:
Thanks for the info. I suppose what I'm confused about based on your reply is why would PRA's accounts be reporting as Factoring Accounts from a Factoring Company on each credit report I pull, as opposed to Collections Accounts from a Collections Company? The forums here are how I discovered the discrepency and thus moved forward with the complaint.

Download a copy of the Credit Reporting Resource Guide. Google results Verify for yourself whats required and appropriate.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

RobertEG — Wed, 25 Oct 2017 17:20:29 GMT

They are reporting as a debt buyer, which means their reporting is considered a collection.

The separate issue of what their industry account type might be does not alter the fact that they are not the original creditor, and have purchased a debt that was established under an original creditor. That fact alone makes their reporting a collection as a debt collector/debt buyer, apart from your issue of whether they have reported as doing business as a factoring company.

It is, in my opinion, not an issue that will mandate any removal of their collection.

There is no requirement that resolution of inaccurate reporting of one item mandates deletion of their entire reporting of otherwise accurate information.

It is a side-show as to whether they can report their collection.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Zizou615 — Thu, 26 Oct 2017 13:50:38 GMT

Interesting. There are several threads on the forums which indicate that PRA cannot report as a Factoring Company or have Factoring Accounts--if they are reporting accurately, why then would the CRA's turn around and change them from collections accounts to factoring accounts? This practice has in the past for many others resulted in the items deletions...

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

CrawleyGrantham — Tue, 05 Dec 2017 16:59:22 GMT

Sorry I'm new here but in my case, I have a PFD agreement drafted by my lawyer and PRA's lawyer. Not only did they not remove all tradelines as outlined in the aggreement, they have deliberately kept it as an open, active account and even had the audacity to update the balance to $7!

I have filed disputes with the CRAs on 2 occasions without success. Any advice on how to enforce the PFD agreement?

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

gdtobefree — Tue, 05 Dec 2017 18:04:53 GMT

PRA is a pain and the best way I found to get rid of them was through due diligence, DV, dispute, BBB complaint and that's where the buck stopped. My next attack was a complaint to my AG'S office. POOF PRA gone!!!!

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

wilmer007 — Tue, 05 Dec 2017 21:11:37 GMT

how long ago was this?

PRA had two collections for me from like 2011 and i disputed it with all 3 CRAs i said "it was from 9 years ago and that it no longer needed to be in my CR" and was able to get them removed about 6 months ago.

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Anonymous — Wed, 20 Dec 2017 19:27:14 GMT

Hey everyone. I'm new here and have a few questions.

I received a call from whom I believe is PRA (it's the only name on collections in my Credit Score. I haven't answered as I really don't want to talk to these people.

Amount is for $496, from Kohl's and is 3 years 6 months old. What I'm wondering is, I believe this is an Open Ended type of debt. If that's the case, here in Virginia SoT is 3 years for that. I just want to know if I'm right or not.

Thanks in advance for your help, I appreciate it!

Re: Portfolio Recovery Associates

Anonymous — Wed, 14 Mar 2018 06:44:36 GMT

Never talk on the phone to them, tell then you communicate via written commuincations . Period