Shouldn't my auto-enhanced FICO score be better?

[Anonymous]

Without information overload here's my deal:  8 BMWs financed and/or leased in 9 years.  Last one was a lease - app submitted Feb. of 09' - lease is now up. Apparently there was no tier system then.  As of Jan. 12' I was approved through dealer at standard plus?  I submitted an app to BMW FS online (3 days after I gave one to the dealer - I know dumb) and they sent me a letter weeks later decling credit and citing a score of, get ready...557.  My credit 6-7 years back was 730, then dropped to 660 then 620.   No bankruptcies, no collections, no late mortgage payments. There are 6 30-day lates accross 3 of my 19+ monthly accounts.  And they are all 2-4 years old. I'm sending out some good faiths soon.  The demon is the utilization ratio.  I'm now at 66%, but I was in the low 90s in January.  So I paid 3 of my 5 cards off and I'm now working on the big two.  But I'm not taking out of savings to pay down credit cards.  It will take another 9-12 months to wipe the two remaining cards out without touching savings.   

Even if my score was in the high 500s (which is beyond offensive to someone who has never transfered a balance, never had a late mortgage payment or car payment), doesn't the auto enhanced do something to bump up the score??

To make matters more confusing, my facos were 660-690 in January and my FICO classic Equifax as of yesterday was 660?????

I'm beyond confused and frankly I consider myself a touch smarter than the average bear.  Something smells foul here.  

I'm waiting to submit another app, but the car I ordered will be in by May.  Any advice?  If my FICO classic is higher then what the dealer pulls can I argue to use the higher score (why wouldn't an auto enchaned score be higher with someone with a long - unblemished - history of buying and leasing cars ???)

P.S. I'd love to make my own "free credit score.com" commercial....

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Without information overload here's my deal:  8 BMWs financed and/or leased in 9 years.  Last one was a lease - app submitted Feb. of 09' - lease is now up. Apparently there was no tier system then.  As of Jan. 12' I was approved through dealer at standard plus?  I submitted an app to BMW FS online (3 days after I gave one to the dealer - I know dumb) and they sent me a letter weeks later decling credit and citing a score of, get ready...557.  My credit 6-7 years back was 730, then dropped to 660 then 620.   No bankruptcies, no collections, no late mortgage payments. There are 6 30-day lates accross 3 of my 19+ monthly accounts.  And they are all 2-4 years old. I'm sending out some good faiths soon.  The demon is the utilization ratio.  I'm now at 66%, but I was in the low 90s in January.  So I paid 3 of my 5 cards off and I'm now working on the big two.  But I'm not taking out of savings to pay down credit cards.  It will take another 9-12 months to wipe the two remaining cards out without touching savings.   

Even if my score was in the high 500s (which is beyond offensive to someone who has never transfered a balance, never had a late mortgage payment or car payment), doesn't the auto enhanced do something to bump up the score??

To make matters more confusing, my facos were 660-690 in January and my FICO classic Equifax as of yesterday was 660?????

I'm beyond confused and frankly I consider myself a touch smarter than the average bear.  Something smells foul here.  

I'm waiting to submit another app, but the car I ordered will be in by May.  Any advice?  If my FICO classic is higher then what the dealer pulls can I argue to use the higher score (why wouldn't an auto enchaned score be higher with someone with a long - unblemished - history of buying and leasing cars ???)

P.S. I'd love to make my own "free credit score.com" commercial....

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Your utilization is hurting you way more than you realize.  Get that under 30% and you will see a huge spike.  Also, and I don't mean to sound rude or judgemental, because I have horrible credit problems, but you act like 6 lates in the last 4 years is  no big deal.  That is a lot of 30+ day lates.  FICO doesn't care how many accounts it is out of.  If you have 6 30 day lates in the last 4 years, that is also hurting your score.  Some people see drops of 50 or more with just 1 late added to their reports.

Either way, get that utilization down to <30% and your score will rise quite a bit.  Get it to <9% and it will go up even more.  Keep in mind that 35% of your score is payment history (you have 6 lates, not good) and 30% of it is utilization (you have 67%, also not good).  So basically 65% of your score is from categories you are not doing well in.  That should help explain why your score is low now hopefully and how you can best go about improving it from here.

[Anonymous]

Your point is well made.  I have had a hard time accepting these 30 day lates as serious.

Very few of my payments are automated.  Im on the web every day with this stuff.  I did the math and I'm making on average 27 payments a month to various creditors, or roughly 1300 payments in the last 4 years. The fact that less than 1/2 a percent  were recd' a day or two after the due date never seemed like a big deal.  But it is.  I particulalry am upset with Barneys NY.    Their bills for years had no minimum due.  They still charge me no inteerst and never any late fees, but they have 3 of my 30 day lates....?  The other two or three were simply not receved in time.  It would be nice if FICO tracked percentage of on time payments.  I can appreciate that my 6 30 day lates send the same data to the FICO computer rules engines as someone who simply couldn't pay their obligations and let 6 credit cards go late for a few weeks.  

You live and you learn.  But when I hear that the average score is XXX and there are more than XXXXXXX americans over 750, I say to myself FICO should exact more of a penalty for collections, bankruptcies and write offs and worry less about utilization ratios.  Imagine if there was a new category called 10 days late.   All my 30 day lates would fall into it...   

[cdtotten]

Being a day or two late on a CC payment does not result in it being reported as 30-days late. You will get hit with a late fee, but won't get reported. 30 days late is just that... Your due date is April 1, you don't make a payment until May 1 or later, you are then 30 days late.

Do some lenders report to the CRAs before 30 days, ya... it happens, but don't think that 30 day lates are not important, because a new late will tank your score and will continue to bring it down for up to 7 years. You are expected to make all your payments on time, not rewarded.

Agree with poster above though, recent lates + high util is always going to tank your score. Get your util under 9% and even with the recent lates, could see a 30-40 point jump instantly.

[pakman92]

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@cdtotten wrote:

Being a day or two late on a CC payment does not result in it being reported as 30-days late. You will get hit with a late fee, but won't get reported. 30 days late is just that... Your due date is April 1, you don't make a payment until May 1 or later, you are then 30 days late.

Do some lenders report to the CRAs before 30 days, ya... it happens, but don't think that 30 day lates are not important, because a new late will tank your score and will continue to bring it down for up to 7 years. You are expected to make all your payments on time, not rewarded.

Agree with poster above though, recent lates + high util is always going to tank your score. Get your util under 9% and even with the recent lates, could see a 30-40 point jump instantly.

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+1  Two ways to increase your score quickly.  1.  Bring your util down.  2. Hope for GW to work on baddies.     First is sure fire, Second one, YMMV.  

[Anonymous]

If your due date is the 10th and the payment posts the 14th... your're 30 days late.  My understanding is, using this example, the 10th marks one month past the closing of the billing cycle for which you're paying on.   So from Jan 10 to Feb 10 is your billing cycle.  It closes on the 10th, and the bill goes out a little while thereafter.  Your bill in the mail will have a due date of March 10.  Once you miss March 10, you're 30 days past the end of the billing cycle..thus 30 days late.

If a 30 day late was for missing the due date by 30 days, I could understand why it should impact your score.  Those are not what I have. Those are called 60 day lates...

I honestly hope that within my daughter's lifetime we can all laugh about FICO scores.  They are not an indication of someones likelihood to pay someone back.  I have never refused or been unable to pay someone and I have a terrible score.   Few of my bankruptcy clients have scores as low as mine.

DRP 

[cdtotten]

As I mentioned, some lenders will post you as 30 days late, even when only a couple days after the due date of the payment, but that is not 30 days late. 30 days late is 30 days after the due date, not the statement date. You can disagree all you would like, but this has been clarified many times by 100s of users on these boards over the years.

Based on your logic, you could never make an on-time payment unless you paid your bill before the statement cut.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

If your due date is the 10th and the payment posts the 14th... your're 30 days late.  My understanding is, using this example, the 10th marks one month past the closing of the billing cycle for which you're paying on.   So from Jan 10 to Feb 10 is your billing cycle.  It closes on the 10th, and the bill goes out a little while thereafter.  Your bill in the mail will have a due date of March 10.  Once you miss March 10, you're 30 days past the end of the billing cycle..thus 30 days late.

If a 30 day late was for missing the due date by 30 days, I could understand why it should impact your score.  Those are not what I have. Those are called 60 day lates...

I honestly hope that within my daughter's lifetime we can all laugh about FICO scores.  They are not an indication of someones likelihood to pay someone back.  I have never refused or been unable to pay someone and I have a terrible score.   Few of my bankruptcy clients have scores as low as mine.

DRP 

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This should not be the case.  30 day lates, as the name implies, is only for when you are 30 days past the due date.  Some creditors may report 30 day lates earlier, but they should not and this is disputable.  If your due date is April 10, you should only get a 30 day late if you pay after May 10.

As for collections hurting worse than 30 day lates, trust me, they do.  Your 6 30 day lates are hurting a lot less than my 5 collections/charge-offs.  Also, 30 day lates start to lose their effect after a couple years and hurt less.  Charge-offs sting badly for all 7 years.

[Anonymous]

Veering back on topic a bit (like the pun there?), your AEFICO may be lower if any of those 30s are on one of your lease payments. I think you said they weren't though; if that's the case, then maybe AEFICO is more sensitive to revolving 30s than we think?

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Without information overload here's my deal:  8 BMWs financed and/or leased in 9 years.  Last one was a lease - app submitted Feb. of 09' - lease is now up. Apparently there was no tier system then.  As of Jan. 12' I was approved through dealer at standard plus?  I submitted an app to BMW FS online (3 days after I gave one to the dealer - I know dumb) and they sent me a letter weeks later decling credit and citing a score of, get ready...557.  My credit 6-7 years back was 730, then dropped to 660 then 620.   No bankruptcies, no collections, no late mortgage payments. There are 6 30-day lates accross 3 of my 19+ monthly accounts.  And they are all 2-4 years old. I'm sending out some good faiths soon.  The demon is the utilization ratio.  I'm now at 66%, but I was in the low 90s in January.  So I paid 3 of my 5 cards off and I'm now working on the big two.  But I'm not taking out of savings to pay down credit cards.  It will take another 9-12 months to wipe the two remaining cards out without touching savings.   

Even if my score was in the high 500s (which is beyond offensive to someone who has never transfered a balance, never had a late mortgage payment or car payment), doesn't the auto enhanced do something to bump up the score??

To make matters more confusing, my facos were 660-690 in January and my FICO classic Equifax as of yesterday was 660?????

I'm beyond confused and frankly I consider myself a touch smarter than the average bear.  Something smells foul here.  

I'm waiting to submit another app, but the car I ordered will be in by May.  Any advice?  If my FICO classic is higher then what the dealer pulls can I argue to use the higher score (why wouldn't an auto enchaned score be higher with someone with a long - unblemished - history of buying and leasing cars ???)

P.S. I'd love to make my own "free credit score.com" commercial....

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This is the best part of all............ Do  you change your car every year?????

If you don't have any lates on auto loans than show BMW this and ask for reconsideration.