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Account Closures

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longtimelurker
Epic Contributor

Re: Account Closures


@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

And this brings up a point I've made repeatedly here, that I don't push my issuers hard for more CLIs, lower rates, SUB chasing, a bunch of new accounts, or using the card only for high category spend. I believe it hurts the cardholder over the long term.


If someone is purposely not trying to get the most out of their credit cards in a legitimate way then the banks win. Why should someone limit themselves that way to appease a bank? That blows my mind reading that


The issuers allow you to do things. It doesn't mean they like it. They are in the business to make money. If you squeeze them from every angle, you are less profitable. If you are less profitable, you have greater exposure to some kind of AA. If you are more risky, you also have greater exposure to AA.


By that logic AMEX and Chase must hate me a lot. Just as a few examples I'm going to reach the grocery cap on AMEX Gold card organically for foreseeable future since I'm supporting two households and on the Chase side me and fiancee have two CIP cards where we basically reach the cap for 3X because of advertising costs

 

I should be posting a closure thread any day now about that 😐


I'm tempted to call Chase after the email I got from them: Well done, you've earned points to the max. Congratulations, you've earned 7,500 bonus category points last quarter. You're a points pro.

 

I want to ask them if its so great, why don't I focus hard on doing that every quarter, and spending only on the 5% categories? They would love me even more, right? I can't see them making money off of me if they give me 5% cash back while collecting 2-3% from merchants.

 

If it were so profitable, there would be no caps.


As usual, I think there is a spectrum.    I don't ask issuers for things that don't benefit me, basically unneeded CLIs and APR reductions  (and as @Remedios knows, I think there is a potential downside to actually call an issuer!).   But I don't do things that cost me, such as making sure to put some spend on a non-optimal card to avoid having only high-category rewards.   Sure, the issuers would be happy for me to put a lot of 1% spend on their cards (or even 0%!)   But they would also be happy if I offered to pay more than the requested AF, or to pay interest even when I PIF "Here you go, and thanks for being a great issuer!".   (Well, actually their antiquated IT systems would probably not be able to handle that, but still!)   So, IMO, don't hurt yourself, but maybe also don't ask for things that aren't useful 

Message 41 of 63
Remedios
Credit Mentor

Re: Account Closures


@longtimelurker wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

And this brings up a point I've made repeatedly here, that I don't push my issuers hard for more CLIs, lower rates, SUB chasing, a bunch of new accounts, or using the card only for high category spend. I believe it hurts the cardholder over the long term.


If someone is purposely not trying to get the most out of their credit cards in a legitimate way then the banks win. Why should someone limit themselves that way to appease a bank? That blows my mind reading that


The issuers allow you to do things. It doesn't mean they like it. They are in the business to make money. If you squeeze them from every angle, you are less profitable. If you are less profitable, you have greater exposure to some kind of AA. If you are more risky, you also have greater exposure to AA.


By that logic AMEX and Chase must hate me a lot. Just as a few examples I'm going to reach the grocery cap on AMEX Gold card organically for foreseeable future since I'm supporting two households and on the Chase side me and fiancee have two CIP cards where we basically reach the cap for 3X because of advertising costs

 

I should be posting a closure thread any day now about that 😐


I'm tempted to call Chase after the email I got from them: Well done, you've earned points to the max. Congratulations, you've earned 7,500 bonus category points last quarter. You're a points pro.

 

I want to ask them if its so great, why don't I focus hard on doing that every quarter, and spending only on the 5% categories? They would love me even more, right? I can't see them making money off of me if they give me 5% cash back while collecting 2-3% from merchants.

 

If it were so profitable, there would be no caps.


As usual, I think there is a spectrum.    I don't ask issuers for things that don't benefit me, basically unneeded CLIs and APR reductions  (and as @Remedios knows, I think there is a potential downside to actually call an issuer!).   But I don't do things that cost me, such as making sure to put some spend on a non-optimal card to avoid having only high-category rewards.   Sure, the issuers would be happy for me to put a lot of 1% spend on their cards (or even 0%!)   But they would also be happy if I offered to pay more than the requested AF, or to pay interest even when I PIF "Here you go, and thanks for being a great issuer!".   (Well, actually their antiquated IT systems would probably not be able to handle that, but still!)   So, IMO, don't hurt yourself, but maybe also don't ask for things that aren't useful 


 

I'm not going to disagree with you, because you're right in so many ways, however I'm very cautious with cards and lenders that I want to continue symbolic relationship with. I dont poke bears.

 

Discover can do whatever they feel like doing. I dont owe them money. While I may skirt and cower around Chase, I'm going full Liberace with Disco. I wouldn't feel the loss, and they wouldn't either. Zero sum game.

 

Cards are a financial tool. I'm not going to spend any more time than necessary trying to anticipate how lender is going to react to my behavior or their responses to economic trends in general. 

Good news is, my checking/debit cannot be CLDed. I"ll be just fine. 

 

With that said, two instances that prompted this thread involved no calls, no requests for apr requests, no CLI requests, and two lenders who on surface appear quite different. Apples, oranges, and tofu. 

 

 

 

 

Message 42 of 63
Remedios
Credit Mentor

Re: Account Closures

Also, taking two very separate and distinct events then thinking sky is falling ...that's going to require some serious tin foil 

Message 43 of 63
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Account Closures


@longtimelurker wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:

And this brings up a point I've made repeatedly here, that I don't push my issuers hard for more CLIs, lower rates, SUB chasing, a bunch of new accounts, or using the card only for high category spend. I believe it hurts the cardholder over the long term.


If someone is purposely not trying to get the most out of their credit cards in a legitimate way then the banks win. Why should someone limit themselves that way to appease a bank? That blows my mind reading that


The issuers allow you to do things. It doesn't mean they like it. They are in the business to make money. If you squeeze them from every angle, you are less profitable. If you are less profitable, you have greater exposure to some kind of AA. If you are more risky, you also have greater exposure to AA.


By that logic AMEX and Chase must hate me a lot. Just as a few examples I'm going to reach the grocery cap on AMEX Gold card organically for foreseeable future since I'm supporting two households and on the Chase side me and fiancee have two CIP cards where we basically reach the cap for 3X because of advertising costs

 

I should be posting a closure thread any day now about that 😐


I'm tempted to call Chase after the email I got from them: Well done, you've earned points to the max. Congratulations, you've earned 7,500 bonus category points last quarter. You're a points pro.

 

I want to ask them if its so great, why don't I focus hard on doing that every quarter, and spending only on the 5% categories? They would love me even more, right? I can't see them making money off of me if they give me 5% cash back while collecting 2-3% from merchants.

 

If it were so profitable, there would be no caps.


As usual, I think there is a spectrum.    I don't ask issuers for things that don't benefit me, basically unneeded CLIs and APR reductions  (and as @Remedios knows, I think there is a potential downside to actually call an issuer!).   But I don't do things that cost me, such as making sure to put some spend on a non-optimal card to avoid having only high-category rewards.   Sure, the issuers would be happy for me to put a lot of 1% spend on their cards (or even 0%!)   But they would also be happy if I offered to pay more than the requested AF, or to pay interest even when I PIF "Here you go, and thanks for being a great issuer!".   (Well, actually their antiquated IT systems would probably not be able to handle that, but still!)   So, IMO, don't hurt yourself, but maybe also don't ask for things that aren't useful 


I agree. I don't ask for anything that won't benefit me. If they want to make my rate 19.99%, fine. I won't be carrying a balance anyway. If your CRs are excellent, that takes care of itself anyway.

 

I don't care about a couple of dollars a month by not maximizing rewards. Just as important is reporting a balance on each card each month. If you have an AF, you're prepaying some of the rewards back to the issuer, which is fine to do as well. And I NEVER tell them thanks for being a great issuer lol. I just try to stay off any potential targeted lists, if there are any.

 

Every bank is profit driven, so that's in the back of my mind. Calling a CSR everyday or a lot would be an issue for the bank. It costs them money to serve you, and if they were to find you are calling and wasting their time, they would notice. They would also notice if you keep calling them for a problem with the card or their website, which of course isn't your fault.

Message 44 of 63
red259
Super Contributor

Re: Account Closures

The people here are outside the norm. You have a mix of people who min/max their credit cards and have many more cards than average consumers and then you have people who are rebuilding that have a lot of negatives in their files. In terms of the economy the signs have actually been improving. The chances of recession in 2020 have dropped substantially. It can still happen but what is more likely at this point is just a slow down in the growth. Lenders will make adjusements to get rid of accounts that they find undersirable. I don't think it indicates anything out of the norm other than banks making adjustments the way they always have from time to time. 

;
Starting Score: EQ: 714, TU 684
Current Score: EQ: 725 7/30/13, TU 684 6/2013, Exp 828 5/2018, Last App 8/5/17
Goal Score: 800 (Achieved!) In garden until Sepetember 2019
Message 45 of 63
simplynoir
Community Leader
Mega Contributor

Re: Account Closures


@Remedios wrote:

Also, taking two very separate and distinct events then thinking sky is falling ...that's going to require some serious tin foil 


This was something I alluded to as well. The saying "correlation does not equal causation" applies here

Message 46 of 63
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Account Closures


@simplynoir wrote:

@Remedios wrote:

Also, taking two very separate and distinct events then thinking sky is falling ...that's going to require some serious tin foil 


This was something I alluded to as well. The saying "correlation does not equal causation" applies here


My sky is intact and expect it to remain that way.

Message 47 of 63
Aim_High
Senior Contributor

Re: Account Closures


@Anonymous wrote:  Calling a CSR everyday or a lot would be an issue for the bank. It costs them money to serve you, and if they were to find you are calling and wasting their time, they would notice. They would also notice if you keep calling them for a problem with the card or their website, which of course isn't your fault

While I agree that someone shouldn't purposefully abuse the customer service phone lines, who in their right mind wants to do that?  I have better things to do.  I call them when I need to talk to them about an issue or an question.  That's why they are there.  If I call them a lot, maybe they need to focus on fixing some internal issues instead of worrying about how often they are being called.  I doubt that would have the slightest impact on AA.  But if it did, I'm probably better off without them.  And in all likelyhood, I would be the one to end the relationship before they did since I'm obviously not satisfied. 


 


Business Cards


Length of Credit > 40 years; Total Credit Limits >$850K
Top Lender TCL - Chase 156.4 - BofA 99.7 - AMEX 95.0 - CITI 94.5 - NFCU 80.0
AoOA > 30 years (Jun 1993); AoYA (Aug 2023)
* Hover cursor over cards to see name & CL, or press & hold on mobile app.
Message 48 of 63
simplynoir
Community Leader
Mega Contributor

Re: Account Closures


@Anonymous wrote:

@simplynoir wrote:

@Remedios wrote:

Also, taking two very separate and distinct events then thinking sky is falling ...that's going to require some serious tin foil 


This was something I alluded to as well. The saying "correlation does not equal causation" applies here


My sky is intact and expect it to remain that way.


Yet you made this thread

 

Shrugs. Okies

Message 49 of 63
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: Account Closures


@Aim_High wrote:

@Anonymous wrote:  Calling a CSR everyday or a lot would be an issue for the bank. It costs them money to serve you, and if they were to find you are calling and wasting their time, they would notice. They would also notice if you keep calling them for a problem with the card or their website, which of course isn't your fault

While I agree that someone shouldn't purposefully abuse the customer service phone lines, who in their right mind wants to do that?  I have better things to do.  I call them when I need to talk to them about an issue or an question.  That's why they are there.  If I call them a lot, maybe they need to focus on fixing some internal issues instead of worrying about how often they are being called.  I doubt that would have the slightest impact on AA.  But if it did, I'm probably better off without them.  And in all likelyhood, I would be the one to end the relationship before they did since I'm obviously not satisfied. 


 


Normally, people wouldn't do it. I wouldn't. There are some people out there who could be given the "What About Bob?" label. Very few though. I would never think AA would result from it, unless it was very excessive. But I bet they track how many minutes/minutes per month that you called in.

 

Ever see checking accounts that come with a maximum of 3 teller visits per month? I had one. Translation: Don't cost us too much money to service you.

Message 50 of 63
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