App Every Six Months Tactic Question

[Aim_High]

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@AverageJoesCredit wrote:
 ... there are actually cards out there that i would like to have but just cant get due to either circumstances ( previous burning of issuer) , profile ( too many cards) or just plain low income. .. unfortunately no amount of gardening will get me these 3 cards no matter how long i try

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Hmmmm ...

So tell us, AJC. 

What are your three card wishes? 

[EdMan63]

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@Anonymous wrote:

I definitely can see that, Aim High! All of which gave me plenty of insight. Other than the fact that I just want to reach my garden goal, I just really don't need a new card yet. Sure, I could apply today and most likely be approved, but if there's no use for it now, why bother.

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That is how I look at credit. Even though I put myself in the garden and say I'm gardening, I'm really just living. I don't feel the need to refrain from apping for credit cards because there is not that much I need that will serve my purpose. I think if you truly match your credit cards to your spending needs through a little patience and homework, you will find there are only so many cards available to suit your needs. After that its just chasing SUB's and making it a hobby. There's nothing wrong with that if it floats your boat but that shouldn't be a strategy for everyone. Many people right here on this forum are recovering from financial mistakes and getting in debt chasing rewards can backfire if you're not careful. Making good decisions and patience is definitely the way to go in my book. 

[Revelate]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Remedios wrote:

If you're doing it because calendar said it's been six months, you're doing it extra wrong 

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I think it might be due to reading half the info on various blogs. Though there is the fact that new accounts that age over the 6 and 12 month mark presumably get a score boost, that is what could be enticing some people to operate on a 6 month cycle. And don't quite have the willpower to wait 12 months. 

I'm sure there are people out there who are less confident in their profile to feel comfortable apping out of the blue when the mood strikes.

Thus they feel a strategy to boost scores is in order.

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Problems with that analysis though.  First for mature files doesn't seem like there's a 6 month benefit at all under FICO 8 and not for inquiries either on any scorecard that I'm aware of on any FICO algorithm.

Let's just say for the sake of the argument we look at the 1 every 6 months rule: you will never get out of the new accounts scorecard on any FICO model. Zip, zero, all of them are at least a year and sometimes longer (mortgage scores).  Nor will you ever be inquiry free.

Secondly, it's just too conservative to the point of silliness in the modern market.  Any card that you could get six months from now you could still get right now without material changes in the file.   Any way you cut it doing both at once is mathematically correct, and that holds through N cards until you get to denials... but even then since inquiries count just for a year?  Who cares if you're waiting 12 or even 13 months, and as long as you spread it 13 months out between apps even you never fall afoul of Chase 5/24 either as long as you're doing 4 or less cards at a time.  The only exception to that is when Chase does something like release a CSR and meh, no bonus for me.

Anyway sloppy AAOA math and this is assuming you have a use for the cards (I've had a use for every single one of my cards at that time with the exception of the Amex SCP which they gave me on a targetted pre-approval and I couldn't turn it down), and I'll just let N=3 for the example.

Every six months math:

Day 1: 1 card, 1 inquiry 0 months AAOA

Day 183ish: 2 cards, 2 inquiry 3 months AAOA

Day 366ish: 3 cards, 2 inquiries, 6 months AAOA

Every 366 day math:

Day 1: 3 cards, 3 inquiries, 0 months AAOA

Day 183ish: 3 cards, 3 inquiries, 6 months AAOA

Day 366ish: 3 cards, 0 inquiries, 12 months AAOA

The simple fact is the only constant in FICO algorithms is that time passes... so you want to take any negative, no matter how minor, as early as possible.  This includes new accounts, and while inquiries can go on different bureaus it doesn't negate the analysis.

I've never done a massive spree nor do I advocate for massive sprees because they're almost always for junk tradelines; I built over the long haul to a plan applying for between 2 and 4 tradelines every time I stepped from the garden... and I've never gotten any AA whatsoever from anyone even with all the missteps I've made over the last 8 years credit wise.  Don't be skeered. 

[AverageJoesCredit]

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@Aim_High wrote:

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@AverageJoesCredit wrote:
 ... there are actually cards out there that i would like to have but just cant get due to either circumstances ( previous burning of issuer) , profile ( too many cards) or just plain low income. .. unfortunately no amount of gardening will get me these 3 cards no matter how long i try

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Hmmmm ...

So tell us, AJC. 

What are your three card wishes? 

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Lol, Rev 

Nothing really special. 

1st card would just to get a cc from my local Bank, Banco Popular.  They blacklist for life it seems... That would truely complete my comeback/ rebuild. 

2nd card, too many cards , would be the UMB DC Powervisa Superman card. Purely aesthetics but hey its Superman

3rd card, no matter what would be a Penfed card. I know i dont need it but dang  the utter rejections makes me crave it even more  lol. 

Donde esta el Gardening Club?

[Anonymous]

So Revelate, are you saying it would be better to add new accounts earlier rather than later?

[Anonymous]

Apping now or later... both has its advantage, both has its drawbacks, depending on your profile.

Waiting for accounts to age and your score to go up could make you look more favorable, leading to a better APR or higher SL etc.  But waiting 12 months vs. 6 months won't make that much of a difference.  You either take the ding now or later.  Take the ding now, and your score will be higher in a year than it would if you waited 6 months and then took the ding.  If in a year your car blows up and you need a loan to buy a new one, you'd be in a better place if you apped for that shiny new card now rather than in 6 months... but we can't predict the future.

There's no point in setting a calendar entry for 6 months and when you hear the "ding", run out and app for that card.  App for the card when you're ready to, whether it's today, 6 months, a year, or 10 years.  Gardening is easier when you aren't "trying".

I'm in the garden, with my youngest accounts just about to hit 6 months.  Am I going to run out and app for something Feb 1 because I hit the magic "6 months?"  Heck no.  I'm good with what I have now.  My "goal card" (and this is a very loose goal) is a CSP.  Loose because I may or may not ever bother to app for it... I only will if I start traveling more... and I won't be doing that until I have some savings built up, which will take another year at least.  Plus, I would need to spend $4k to reach that card's SUB, so I need to be in a position where (a) I can afford to spend that much in 3 months, and (b) I have something TO spend that on over the 3 months.... so I'll probably time the eventual app so I can put my house/car insurance and property tax bill on the card to help reach the SUB.  That probably won't be until end of year 2021.  By then I'll be at 0/24 and diamond spade, so that's what I set my "gardening goal" to.

No other cards interest me at this time, so one I get the CSP (or if I don't get it), I'll probably be gardening indefinitely (other than if I move, refi or buy a car).

[Anonymous]

IMHO Yes, so they can age. As long as you have an account under 12 months, you’re in a new account scorecard which lowers your score and magnifies any negatives, Plus the inquiries hold you down and magnify other things. Plus every time you open an account it lowers your average age. The sooner it’s open the sooner it can begin to age.

Ideally you want to get to a point where you don’t have to open up any more new accounts or take any more inquiries. And the sooner you get to that the sooner you can stay in the garden and the scores will rise.

Just my two cents.

But that’s only if you have the need for more cards.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:
IMHO Yes, so they can age. As long as you have an account under 12 months, you’re in a new account scorecard which lowers your score and magnifies any negatives, Plus the inquiries hold you down and magnify other things. Plus every time you open an account it lowers your average age. The sooner it’s open the sooner it can begin to age.

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This.  Last time I gardened for a year after apping my scores went up quite a bit after hitting the 1 year mark.  I look forward to August so I can see that happen again.

[Anonymous]

Three of my CC’s, one of those retail have low CL’s and seem to not be going anywhere no matter how much I try. Plus, I applied for the three within the first 6 months of my credit journey, so I think I’m permanently in the bunker with those. This is why I want to thicken my profile with a couple cards which will be of use to me.

[Anonymous]

American Express isn’t showing you any love? Capital one can definitely bucket you from what I’ve read.

You’re definitely in a great place whenever you choose to app, but I would try a CLI with American Express first if you’re eligible. Plus it’s usually a SP.

Are you eligible for Navy? They’re known to give out nice SLs if they like your profile.