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@Anonymous wrote:Opposed to everyone that's downgrading, I just upgraded to the CSR from a freedom just for the 1.5 PYB cash out.
Turns out GRUBHUB+ can also be considered a free perk since it comes with Lyft pink now.
I should be able to get 2 travel credits with 1 annual fee. Not bad.
Congrats.
Count me skeptical you will get two CSR travel credits from one card cycling, without paying two AF.
If you are saying you had a CSR, got the travel credit, downgraded to one no-AF card, then upgraded a second no-AF card to CSR, that may get a second TC. But expect the $550 fee on the upgraded CSR.
Just a quick comment to say that I really enjoyed the dialog upthread between @Aim_High and @Loquat. I had engaged in a similar, but far less thorough dialog with @Aim_High a couple of months ago when I announced my intention to downgrade my CSR to a CFU after the annual fee posted on Sept 1. I came away from that earlier discussion with the conclusion that the CSR is still a good card if you do enough travel and dining. @Aim_High travels and dines, despite the pandemic, but I do not. That means that the CSR continues to be a good deal for him, but it no longer was for me (after I had liquidated my point balance through Pay Yourself Back). My experience is quite similar to that of @Loquat, and I thank him for expressing this point of view so eloquently.
Will I ever go back to the CSR? Probably not. I loved the CSR when it first came out because both the $300 travel credit and the 3x points earnings were based solely on generic spending categories. There were no Amex-style merchant-specific spending incentives whatsoever. Chase seems to have decided that the Amex model is not so bad after all, and they're now linking the value proposition of the card to spending at specific merchants. I left Amex for Chase several years ago for a reason, but if Chase is going to become a second Amex, then I'll stick to cash back cards. I'm willing to reconsider if Chase updates the CSR to make it more like the 2016 original (and the pandemic ends so I can dine and travel again), but I don't see Chase doing that.
@UpperNwGuy wrote:Chase seems to have decided that the Amex model is not so bad after all, and they're now linking the value proposition of the card to spending at specific merchants. I left Amex for Chase several years ago for a reason, but if Chase is going to become a second Amex, then I'll stick to cash back cards. .
I think lenders have realized that they can offer these merchant specific deals at a far lower cost than just generic rewards, and on paper, you're still getting "value". Some consumers will be fine with it, but those who analyze it will realize it may not be worth it. But as the rewards race has intensified over the years this seems like unfortunately a natural progression. You can only go so high with point multipliers before it just doesn't make sense from a profitability standpoint. So issuers are left with offering more niche benefits, but in the process it erodes the value proposition for many, since if you do not use the niche benefits, you may as well get a cheaper/free cash back card for the same/similar multipliers.
Unfortunately, I think we've pretty much seen the peak of multipliers and will continue to see more merchant specific "benefits" as there is really nowhere else for issuers to go.
@kdm31091 wrote:
@UpperNwGuy wrote:Chase seems to have decided that the Amex model is not so bad after all, and they're now linking the value proposition of the card to spending at specific merchants. I left Amex for Chase several years ago for a reason, but if Chase is going to become a second Amex, then I'll stick to cash back cards. .
I think lenders have realized that they can offer these merchant specific deals at a far lower cost than just generic rewards, and on paper, you're still getting "value". Some consumers will be fine with it, but those who analyze it will realize it may not be worth it. But as the rewards race has intensified over the years this seems like unfortunately a natural progression. You can only go so high with point multipliers before it just doesn't make sense from a profitability standpoint. So issuers are left with offering more niche benefits, but in the process it erodes the value proposition for many, since if you do not use the niche benefits, you may as well get a cheaper/free cash back card for the same/similar multipliers.
Unfortunately, I think we've pretty much seen the peak of multipliers and will continue to see more merchant specific "benefits" as there is really nowhere else for issuers to go.
The general rule of thumb for the multipliers that's developing.
2%-All inclusive CB
3%-Regular Category spend.
5%-Bonus multipler.
*Subscription or fee rebate.
For a heavy food/delivery/ride share user you'll get outsized value with a subscription service.
The question is can you be smart enough about the bonus spend to really take advantage. It can be tough for the average consumer to do that.
I wouldn't be opposed to merchant specific credits if it weren't for tehm being at place I don't have, I don't live in a metropolis where there's plenty of Shake Shak, Ruth Chris, Big Mamma's, Cheescake Factory, etc. to choose from. I barely am able to get the crdit via Grub Hub only because one place I actually eat at has partnered with them. If not for that I would have canceled my Gold Card long ago, and it that partnership were to ever end I would then be forced to as I have no other way to recoup the AF.
That said i don't need them to make it 100% easy to get recoup the whole amount, just easier than it is to see at least a 50% recoup. lol
@Loquat wrote:
I don't mind merchant credits but I'm also not willing to go out of my way to use one. For example, the Amex Platinum and the Saks credit. I'm not a Sak's customer, never have been, and don't want to have to find something to buy in efforts justify the use of the credit.
I understand for the lenders who negotiate with these merchants it's a win-win...because the merchant is probably eating most of the cost but from a consumer standpoint it's just another hurdle to justify an AF.
I'd probably use about half the Saks credits naturally. It doesn't really bother me because I can get free shipping. It's just clothing and sales tax. One $100 credit would be nicer than two $50 ones, naturally. I figure I'd have a Platinum anyway so can get some socks if nothing else. I kind of like browsing to see what odd stuff I can get for $50 (okay, $60 in reality).
It's not like some other dining and delivery credits where there are a lot of dubious (non-tip) fees that can easily constitute 25% of the total purchase.
@Loquat wrote:
I don't mind merchant credits but I'm also not willing to go out of my way to use one. For example, the Amex Platinum and the Saks credit. I'm not a Sak's customer, never have been, and don't want to have to find something to buy in efforts justify the use of the credit.
I understand for the lenders who negotiate with these merchants it's a win-win...because the merchant is probably eating most of the cost but from a consumer standpoint it's just another hurdle to justify an AF.
I just make a point of checking my offers every time I log into Chase, and checking any ones that are for places I might be spending money at sometimes soon, and then promptly forget about them. I make no attempt to remember or keep track of them whatsoever. Most of the time the offer just expires before I spend any money there, but occasionally I get suprised with an "offer redemption" bonus in my account. According to Chase, I've gotten about $60 or so back this year from that, from merchants that I was already shopping at anyways.
It's definitely not worth shopping anywhere that you weren't already planning to. As I always had a lot of difficulty explaining to my ex-wife, "You're not actually saving any money when it's something you weren't planning to buy before you saw it in the sale flyer."
But it's easy enough to click through the offers when I'm already logged into Chase anyways, so I just make a habit of doing it, even knowing that I'll only ever score a redemption maybe 5% of the time.
@wasCB14 wrote:
@Loquat wrote:
I don't mind merchant credits but I'm also not willing to go out of my way to use one. For example, the Amex Platinum and the Saks credit. I'm not a Sak's customer, never have been, and don't want to have to find something to buy in efforts justify the use of the credit.
I understand for the lenders who negotiate with these merchants it's a win-win...because the merchant is probably eating most of the cost but from a consumer standpoint it's just another hurdle to justify an AF.I'd probably use about half the Saks credits naturally. It doesn't really bother me because I can get free shipping. It's just clothing and sales tax. One $100 credit would be nicer than two $50 ones, naturally. I figure I'd have a Platinum anyway so can get some socks if nothing else. I kind of like browsing to see what odd stuff I can get for $50 (okay, $60 in reality).
It's not like some other dining and delivery credits where there are a lot of dubious (non-tip) fees that can easily constitute 25% of the total purchase.
Yes, but while it may be easy enough to use, the real question is the actual value. Are you getting (near) $60 of value in stuff that you would be anyway. My guess is that usually equivalent stuff can be had quite a bit cheaper, so while using the offer is even cheaper, it doesn't deduct at full value from the AF.
I do the same thing, as well, with Southwest and United Dining. They both use the same 3rd-party service, but I have one card on United and another on Southwest (can't use the same card on more than 1 dining portal). Anyways, they have partner restaurants where if you dine there and use your card, you automatically get SW/UA points/miles for it, in addition to whatever points your credit card earns there.
Since it's all automatic, and can result in free miles, there's no reason not to do it... but I certainly am not on the United/Southwest dining websites to see which restaurants I should be eating at to earn miles. I eat where I want to eat - if it ends up scoring me some miles, great. (So far it hasn't, yet, but I only signed up recently and haven't been dining out much for obvious reasons)