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CSR updates coming 10/5?

Citylights18
Established Contributor

Re: CSR updates coming 10/5?


@Loquat wrote:

@Aim_High wrote:
  • My big questions to you are regarding points valuation.  I have heard the criticisms of websites such as The Points Guy and recognize that they get paid for links to card applications.   However, their points reviews are with the all largest players (lenders, airlines, and hotels)  and it would appear they are getting paid by ALL of them.  Their review don't appear to favor one lender 100% of the time, or one card 100% of the time.  The major general travel point systems (MR-UR-TY-Diner's Club) are all valued closely together at between 1.7 ccp to 2.1 ccp.   Except for a few outliers on either end, most of the airline rewards programs are valued at around 1.0 ccp to 1.5 ccp and most of the hotel rewards are approximately 0.5 ccp to 1.0 ccp.  And for many consumers like myself who are not already knowledgable veterans of multiple loyalty programs, these approximate valuations are a helpful general guide.   While I realize that points valuation can vary widely in practice, having a targeted or expected value for points is helpful when someone is deciding on a path before collecting them.  So I would like to know your perspective about which of these valuations is wrong and how you would change the valuation to be more impartial or accurate?   Thanks in advance for that feedback!

@Aim_High In my experience, TPG is way off.  Most of their valuations are based on the way they travel which is front of the house almost all the time.  There's absolutely no way I've ever gotten close to getting 1.7cpp on a domestic American route unless booking last minte at an inflated rate.  Is it possible to get 1.7cpp via AA miles...sure when you're always booking in First Class.  On the flip side they value Bonvoy points at 0.007cpp which I can't tell you if I've ever gotten a number that low.  

 

I know a lot of this is dependent upon when and how someone books...which is why I always encourage folks to run their own numbers because chances are it's not going to be the same as TPG or anyone else for that matter.  As for the fairness of their reviews...I won't speak too much to that because it's subjective.  However, in my opinion they tend to favor Chase and Amex way more than they do Citi and any other variants.  With that being said I understand that they are a business and want to generate revenue just like anyone else...and if Chase and Amex pays the most then they will continue to be featured.


Yes the best valuation is for business class flights but they are worth splurging on when you're traveling 8, 16 or more hours by air.

 

Chase points go get nice redemption value over at SWA. First off you can get $49 transcontinental flights, then you can redeem them Chase points as high as 1.7 or 1.8 for those flights so I costs you like $28 dollars worth of Chase points.

 

AMEX has a lot of transfer bonuses to airlines of 30% to 40% which stack with the points valuation of that flight relative to price. While 2.0 is a stretch you can definitely exceed 1. Move the points to British Airways and there are fantastic deals on short haul flights. 

Official travel point totals as of 1/21/20 (402,672 Total Points)
Chase Ultimate Rewards 147,239
World of Hyatt 92,558
Southwest Rapid Rewards 61,000
AMEX Membership Rewards 53,751
AA Advantage 15,244
United MileagePlus 13,316
British Airways Avios 11,332
Hilton Honors 2,081
NASA Platinum Rewards 1883
Citi Thank You 1,670
Marriott Bonvoy 1,350
Expedia Points 740
Jet Blue TrueBlue 285
Delta Sky Miles 123
Virgin Atlantic Virgin Points 100
Hotels.com Rewards 6/10 ($135.99)
Message 131 of 135
K-in-Boston
Moderator

Re: CSR updates coming 10/5?

TPG valuations are always based on an average expected return for F award fares.  It always brought a chuckle to me when I would see Starpoints at 1.8 cents and then Marriott at 0.6 cents because they could be converted to Starpoints 3:1, because I was consistently getting far more value from them, while getting far less value from MRs and URs (their two biggest referral partners) than they listed at the time.

 

It is all definitely in how points are redeemed.  The value also goes way up if you are selective in your redemptions.   I rarely get less than 2cpp for Marriott or SkyMiles redemptions.  At the same time, I get about 2cpp net from MRs, URs and Altitude Reserve points using the travel portals after taking into account FF mileage earning as those are considered revenue flights.  Pre-pandemic Delta ran very frequent sales, and it was pretty easy to get 8-10 cpm in Delta One on European and Asian routes with no hoops to jump through.

Message 132 of 135
Loquat
Moderator

Re: CSR updates coming 10/5?


@Citylights18 wrote:

@Loquat wrote:

@Aim_High wrote:
  • My big questions to you are regarding points valuation.  I have heard the criticisms of websites such as The Points Guy and recognize that they get paid for links to card applications.   However, their points reviews are with the all largest players (lenders, airlines, and hotels)  and it would appear they are getting paid by ALL of them.  Their review don't appear to favor one lender 100% of the time, or one card 100% of the time.  The major general travel point systems (MR-UR-TY-Diner's Club) are all valued closely together at between 1.7 ccp to 2.1 ccp.   Except for a few outliers on either end, most of the airline rewards programs are valued at around 1.0 ccp to 1.5 ccp and most of the hotel rewards are approximately 0.5 ccp to 1.0 ccp.  And for many consumers like myself who are not already knowledgable veterans of multiple loyalty programs, these approximate valuations are a helpful general guide.   While I realize that points valuation can vary widely in practice, having a targeted or expected value for points is helpful when someone is deciding on a path before collecting them.  So I would like to know your perspective about which of these valuations is wrong and how you would change the valuation to be more impartial or accurate?   Thanks in advance for that feedback!

@Aim_High In my experience, TPG is way off.  Most of their valuations are based on the way they travel which is front of the house almost all the time.  There's absolutely no way I've ever gotten close to getting 1.7cpp on a domestic American route unless booking last minte at an inflated rate.  Is it possible to get 1.7cpp via AA miles...sure when you're always booking in First Class.  On the flip side they value Bonvoy points at 0.007cpp which I can't tell you if I've ever gotten a number that low.  

 

I know a lot of this is dependent upon when and how someone books...which is why I always encourage folks to run their own numbers because chances are it's not going to be the same as TPG or anyone else for that matter.  As for the fairness of their reviews...I won't speak too much to that because it's subjective.  However, in my opinion they tend to favor Chase and Amex way more than they do Citi and any other variants.  With that being said I understand that they are a business and want to generate revenue just like anyone else...and if Chase and Amex pays the most then they will continue to be featured.


Yes the best valuation is for business class flights but they are worth splurging on when you're traveling 8, 16 or more hours by air.

 

Chase points go get nice redemption value over at SWA. First off you can get $49 transcontinental flights, then you can redeem them Chase points as high as 1.7 or 1.8 for those flights so I costs you like $28 dollars worth of Chase points.

 

AMEX has a lot of transfer bonuses to airlines of 30% to 40% which stack with the points valuation of that flight relative to price. While 2.0 is a stretch you can definitely exceed 1. Move the points to British Airways and there are fantastic deals on short haul flights. 


@Citylights18 I'll give it to you that Chase points can be valuable when transferring to Southwest.  I will also agree with you that the best valuation comes from long haul business class flights.  But as far as splurging, most of the time, even if you had the points to do so, you'd be hard pressed finding enough saver space to fly a family of 5 in business/first class. 

 

As for the Amex bonus transfers, like you, I appreciate the British Airways offers when they come around.  American dominates here so I'm on their metal most of the time and those short haul Avios are awesome.  But yes, I agree with you that it isn't terrible hard to get 1cpp for domestic routes, but 2cpp is definitely a stretch with the exception of first class or late minute bookings. 

Message 133 of 135
nyy101
New Contributor

Re: CSR updates coming 10/5?

So I have both the CSR and Unlimited.

 

With new Unlimited updates and the fact I am barely traveling right now, the CSR is basically useless for me unless I'm looking at the updates wrong. Might be time to PC to CSP however I think my AF is due in Nov so might not be worth it right now.

Message 134 of 135
MyFault
Valued Contributor

Re: CSR updates coming 10/5?


@nyy101 wrote:

So I have both the CSR and Unlimited.

 

With new Unlimited updates and the fact I am barely traveling right now, the CSR is basically useless for me unless I'm looking at the updates wrong. Might be time to PC to CSP however I think my AF is due in Nov so might not be worth it right now.


I just PC from CSP to CSR in June before CFF/CFU changes. My $550 AF hit this month. But i look at it this way. I used my $300 travel credit on groceries. That $300 was also 5x at the time. I've already used $60 DD credit, and will use the other $60 in the first of 2021. So my effective AF is actualy only $130, which is only $35 more than the CSP. Plus the 3x i earned on dining before my CFU changes, as well as the minimum 1.5cpp cash out for travel that i'll use to fund some of my honeymoon next year if i can't get a higher cpp with xfer partners.

 

Once i heard about the CFU changes it frustrated me, but i had to step back and realize that even at $550 it's only $35 more than my CSP was effectively and when i do travel next year, which will likely start in Q2, i'll be earning 3x (hopefully more, because hopefully they'll revamp the sapphire line in Q1 2021. 

Each person's scenario is different. But, if you can take advantage of the door dash credit without spending money you wouldn't otherwise, and use the CSR for groceries for the $300 travel credit until Dec 31st. I still think the CSR is worth holding on to. Especially if you're planning to PC to CSP.




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Message 135 of 135
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