@longtimelurker wrote:
@Beefy1212 wrote:Have you considered the USB altitude go/connect? some one correct me if I am wrong but those points are transferable.
The points are not transferable to partners. This is also true of the Altitude Reserve. Points can be used in the portal etc, but there is no equivalent to Chase/Citi/Amex/Cap One etc transfer to partner programs.
Sorry I meant in relation to wthin the USB OP mentioned you couldn't use the other penfed points cards to gain more points to then spend on travel, I was saying alt go points could be used on the travel card like how Freedom points can be used on the CSP/R.
@longtimelurker wrote:
@Beefy1212 wrote:
@longtimelurker wrote:
@Beefy1212 wrote:Have you considered the USB altitude go/connect? some one correct me if I am wrong but those points are transferable.
The points are not transferable to partners. This is also true of the Altitude Reserve. Points can be used in the portal etc, but there is no equivalent to Chase/Citi/Amex/Cap One etc transfer to partner programs.
Sorry I meant in relation to wthin the USB OP mentioned you couldn't use the other penfed points cards to gain more points to then spend on travel, I was saying alt go points could be used on the travel card like how Freedom points can be used on the CSP/R.
Oh. Then it's worth pointing out that Go/Connect points can be combined up to some yearly max, but cannot be transferred to Altitude Reserve to get a bonus multiplier. So not really like Freedom -> CSP/R but yes, a little flexibility.
I am surprised they would draw the line at the Reserve... I mean Altitude is clearly a franchise of cards why stop at the flagship 400 annual fee card. Either way this is why I am firmly on team Cashback. Yes the redemption rate is lower but I dont have to try to figure out how to book a flight in the middle of the night on a wednesday booked off season for a vactation I have to come back on a tuesday that I paid for with points through a collection of transfer partners, more complicated than laundering money for a colombian drug cartel.
@longtimelurker wrote:
LTL Bank's "Money So Clean It Sparkles" and
I Can't Believe It's Not Dirty" divisions have teams of skilled experts who have "processed" money from a wide variety of sources and currencies for a number of worthy enterprises, including organized crime, narco-terrorists, politicians and royalty. (References NOT available on request). All for a competitive rate and from the comfort of your own home.
OMG just the service I need where can one sign up.... uh no questions asked!
@Aim_High wrote:
@phantasm wrote:I recently got the PenFed Pathfinder card as an honors advantage member. Among others, some standout perks are:
- 50K SUB ~ $425-$500
- 4X points on all travel categories including things like EZ Pass, Ferries, etc
- Reimbursement for Global Entry/TSA Precheck up to $100
$100 Annual "domestic air ancillary travel" statement credit - has some limitations like cabin upgrades
- Priority Pass membership (discounted use); I think you can use the credit above for this
... Is this the best general purpose travel card out there or is there something better I should take a look at?
Thanks for the tag, @SouthJamaica. The problem with OP's question (Is this the best general purpose travel card out there?) is that the value with travel cards depends a lot on the cardholder's spending patterns and methods of redemption as well as need or value-added of various perks. Those can all drastically change the scenario. And ultimately, OP (or anyone else) must do their own careful evaluation to see what works best for them.
@phantasm, I've looked into the PenFed Pathfinder card and especially for those like you and me who qualify for Honors Advantage, it makes a compelling value case. That's not to say there aren't other potentially valuable cards as well. You lay out some nice advantages in your opening statement.
I'm not sure of the 1 cpp valuation you mentioned (is that approximate value on travel purchases?) but I've often heard the 0.85 cpp valuation. I've assumed the 3.4 cpp value was closer to realistic.
Where I see Pathfinder deficient, depending on travel card priorities:
- No direct cash redemption option. Some competitive cards (in the $0 to $99 AF range) that offer rewards redemption at 1 cpp for cash (or statement credit - as/if cash) include NFCU Flagship, Chase Sapphire Preferred, US Bank Altitude Connect, CITI Premier, CITI Costco, and Wells Fargo Autograph. Personally, I greatly value the flexibility to redeem rewards for cash, in-portal, or transfer to partners. Merchandise and gift cards are a PITA.
- While points may be worth more when redeemed for travel via PenFed (+) which effectively mimmics the 25% points magnification on cards like CSP, there isn't an option to earn enhanced points for paid bookings through the travel portal such as on CSP or USB Altitude Connect.
- One big deficit is the ability to transfer points to travel partners such as is available on CSP, where points can be worth 1.5 to 2.0 cpp. In other words, even though CSP earns only 2 points per dollar for general travel purchases versus 4 points per dollar on PFP, those points could also be worth 4% if redemption method is via partners.
- Meanwhile, depending on what other cards are in a wallet, PFP pays 1.5 points per dollar on any purchases other than travel, which might be worth less than 1.5% value. But some competitors pay well in other categories. (CSP: 3x dining, takeout, online grocery, streaming. CITI Premier: 3x Airfare, hotels, restaurants, gas, supermarkets. CITI Costco: 4% gas, 3x dining and travel. WF Autograph: 3x travel, transit, gas, dining, streaming, cell phone. USB AC: 4x travel and gas. 2x grocery, streaming, dining. NFCU FSR: 3% travel; 2% everything else.) To me, this makes PFP more of a niche travel card and not as flexible. It earns best when you BUY a lot of travel on the card and plan to use the points towards future travel.
- It's true that Honors Advantage members get the AF waived and then get the air travel credit and TSA GE/Precheck credit, so they start out way ahead! And then they also earn the 4x points on travel. However, even though some competitors have AFs, some of them also offer credits against those including, as you mentioned the NFCU FSR's GE credit. Also Chase offers an annual $50 hotel credit on CSP, lowering the effective AF to $45. CITI Premier a $100 annual hotel credit which can fully reimburse the AF and put your net positive $5.
- US Bank Altitude Connect includes (4) free annual Priority Pass lounge visits as opposed to PFP's reduced fee access, and then a reduced fee schedule for additional visits. One single factor like this could completely change the equation for a cardholder who makes frequent use of lounge visits.
- Do you rent cars and ever pay the CDW coverage? CSP is rare in including PRIMARY CDW coverage which would more than pay for itself if you ever needed it. It would mean no claim against your primary insurance, no need to pay the deductible, and no worry about an accident affecting your personal insurance rates. Coverage on most of the other comparable cards is secondary, if available at all.
- I couldn't find a discussion of travel insurances on the Pathfinder, but if travel protections are important, a card like CSP might come out ahead. CSP includes Trip Cancellation/Delay coverage and Baggage Delay coverage. I believe USB AC has similar coverages.
- And yes, Chase has a very generous definition of travel to include crusies, tolls, and ferries. So while I don't know about all the other competitors, I do know that Chase/CSP is very inclusive.
"Merchants in the travel category include airlines, hotels, motels, timeshares, car rental agencies, cruise lines, travel agencies, discount travel sites, campgrounds and operators of passenger trains, buses, taxis, limousines, ferries, toll bridges and highways, and parking lots and garages. Merchants that provide transportation and travel-related services are not included in this category; for example, real estate agents, educational merchants arranging travel, in-flight goods and services, on-board cruise line goods and services, sightseeing activities, excursions, tourist attractions, boat rentals, merchants within hotels and airports, and merchants that rent vehicles for the purpose of hauling."
- Even the $150 AF AMEX Green might be a strong competitor in the same travel-card niche, depending on situation. It earns 3x MRs on Restaurants, Transit (including trains, taxicabs, rideshare services, ferries, tolls, parking, buses, and subways), and Travel (including airfare, hotels, cruises, tours, car rentals, campgrounds, travel purchases on third party travel websites, and travel purchases on Amextravel.com). Depending on MR valuation, those points can be worth up to 6% return when transferred to partners. And if the motivation for the TSA credit is for expedited domestic security screening and your home airport has CLEAR, there is a $189 annual CLEAR credit as well as $100 in Lounge Buddy credits. Both of these credits more than refund the AF.
Overall, PenFed Pathfinder can be a very competitive travel card for the right person, spend, and redemption plans. But ultimately, doing the "personal math" on travel card value is an unavoidable part of evaluating them for yourself. YMMV.
Thank you for your thoughtful and detailed response. There are few items in your post that I can help clarify:
- No direct cash option - while true you cannot get a statement credit, nor a direct deposit into an account like Fidelity, rewards can be redeemed for a Visa gift card. If you use services like Paypal, Amazon, or Venmo, this is almost as good as cash
- Enhanced points through a travel portal - I don't have much insight into the travel portal that PenFed uses. Frankly, this was one of the reasons that attracted me to the card was that I didn't have to use their travel portal to redeem points
- Transfer to travel partners - Correct. There is no option to exchange to travel partners. If transferring points to a travel provider is your goal then the PFP is not a viable option
- PFP pays 1.5 points for non-travel purchase - I agree and wouldn't recommend PFP as a general use card. My AOD FCU 3% CB is my general use card where I can't get more than 3% CB in specific categories like travel. For restuarants and gas the RedStone FCU Visa has 5% CB and 3% on groceries.
- No Annual Fee for Honors Members - For me, I don't like to have to work to get my AF covered. The only card I now have with an AF is the Amex Bonvoy with a $95AF which results in 6X points for Marriott but more importantly a 35K point certificate for a hotel stay. 35K Marriott points are worth ~$175 max from my experience. I did have the Amex BB before the AF was raised and they changed it to $25/m restaurant reimbursement. I'm not opposed to AF cards but, for me, it has to be very easy to recover the AF.
- Annual Priority Pass Lounge Visits - The PFP provides a yearly $100 ancillary travel credit which can be used for priority pass reimburesement or gift cards towards some limited airlines. This equates to approximately 3 priority passes based on the discounted rate. For me, I would take the flexibility of how to use the $100 reimbursement vs having 4 passes that I had to use. You are correct, however, that if lounge passes are frequently used by yourself and your family that there are better options.
- Car insurance coverage - PSP provides no coverage for car rental according to the Travel Benefits Guide
- Travel Insurance - PSP provides quite a number of Travel Benefits including:
- Baggage Delay Reimbursement
- Emergency Card Replacement and Emergency Cash Disbursement
- Lost Luggate Reimbursement
- Purchase Security
- Roadside Dispatch (pay-per-use)
- Travel Accident Insurance
- Travel and Emergency Assistance Services
- Trip Delay Reimbursement
- PenFed "Travel" definition includes: Airfare, Hotel, Car Rental, Cruise, Travel Agency, Commuter Transportation, Taxi/Uber/Lyft, Bus Lines, Tour Operators, and Tolls. MCC Codes: 4111, 4112, 4121, 4131, 4411, 4511, 4722, 4784, 7011, 7033, 7512, 7513, 7519, 7991, 4789, 5962
I do agree with you that there are other cards out there that are better if you have more specific use cases, but for my travel, my goals are pretty straight forward to obtain the highest CB on travel purchases:
- CB or statement credits > Visa GC > partner points
- No vendor travel portals for redemption (I can't use these)
- Global Entry / TSA Precheck reimbursement or equivalent statement credit
- No AF or AF that is recaptured with little effort
Formerly, I was using my AOD for most travel and, quite frankly, I may end up switching back to it because of the easy end of billing cycle statement credit. Any time, you are applying a reward towards a future purchase, you lose out on the CB that purchase provides. Additionally, there is a cost of waiting to capture the reward. Even if I do, I will likely hold on to the PFP as a drawered card for when I use the ancillary credit or the Global Entry reimbursement. So to my original question, I still don't feel like I have a definitive answer but through all the comments I am thinking the PFP is just part of an overall travel reward strategy than a single solution.
Starting Score: 800In my journey to extract the maximum amount of rewards from travel purchased, I stumbled on the Greenstate FCU World Mastercard that offers 5% CB (via points) for Air Travel and Hotels. It's a relatively narrow list of MCCs compared to the PenFed Pathfinder but you can redeem points as a statement credit. I will keep the PenFed around for other travel needs including the TSA/Global Entry reimbursment and for spend on Amtrak and EZ-Pass but definitely excited for this card.
@longtimelurker wrote:
@phantasm wrote:In my journey to extract the maximum amount of rewards from travel purchased, I stumbled on the Greenstate FCU World Mastercard that offers 5% CB (via points) for Air Travel and Hotels. It's a relatively narrow list of MCCs compared to the PenFed Pathfinder but you can redeem points as a statement credit. I will keep the PenFed around for other travel needs including the TSA/Global Entry reimbursment and for spend on Amtrak and EZ-Pass but definitely excited for this card.
Looks good, but is it clear that points are 1c for cashback. The giftcard redemptions are a lower rate (although $100 gift cards are nearly there at 10,500 points). But this wouldn't be the first place offering worse rates on gift cards than on cash!
One of the only members I've known to have this card was @credit_is_crack. He was approved >here< but he didn't keep the card. He closed it in his "Off With Their Heads!" spree. But he might be a good member to answer that question. Perhaps it wasn't all he expected.
