@CreditCuriosity wrote:This is going to get into politics quickly I can see.. Edge on side of caution please everyone.
Just to refresh your recollection that it was you who started the conversation down that path:
"Hopefully gov't doesn't try to intervene with this like so many other things..."
@CreditCuriosity wrote:
@SouthJamaica wrote:
@CreditCuriosity wrote:This is going to get into politics quickly I can see.. Edge on side of caution please everyone.
Just to refresh your recollection that it was you who started the conversation down that path:
"Hopefully gov't doesn't try to intervene with this like so many other things..."
Lets stop while we are all ahead.
You got it 
Junk debt buyers are rubbing their hands right about now.
@PullingMeSoftly wrote:This article discusses 8 signs of an imminent debt crisis as indicated by the U.S. credit card market.
The TLDR:
- The total amount of credit card debt in the United States has surpassed the one trillion dollar mark and is now at the highest level ever recorded.
- The average rate of interest on credit card balances has now risen to a new all-time record high of 20.63 percent.
- 47 percent of all U.S. cardholders are now carrying balances from month to month.
- The average credit card debt level in the United States continues to grow.
- Most Americans are not running up credit card debt because they are making frivolous purchases.
- The number of credit card delinquencies in the U.S. has surged dramatically over the past two years.
- One recent survey discovered that many Americans that actually use personal loans to consolidate credit card debt end up quickly running up new credit card balances close to their previous levels.
- At a time when economic conditions are slowing down all over the nation, Americans are becoming increasingly dependent on their credit cards.
Interest isn't 20.63%, APR is that would make monthly interest about 1.72%
I am also curious how they came up with card holders carrying a balance, is that reported balance or an actual balance carried month to month? I am also curious how it treats consumers with 15 cards with balances you might be able to say 47% of credit card accounts are carrying a balance but I highly doubt anyone has the granular data to scrub out people with no balance vs people with 15 balances vs people with multiple balance being carried intentionally under zero apr deals all three of these numbers would paint a very different picture.
These numbers sound dire and a trillion dollars is absurd for an individual, but this population level numbers not an individual, it is across 84% of all adults in the US and foreigners holding US credit, and business credit cards according to wallet hub there are about 1.25 billion credit cards and to reach this new 1.03 trillion milestone (45 billion increase) average balances increased a whole 36 dollars.
I highly doubt anyone would be concerned if instead of saying credit card debt has risen to 1.03 trillion they said average monthly balance has increased from 788 to 824 dollars.
https://wallethub.com/edu/cc/number-of-credit-cards/25532#:~:text=There%20were%20about%20572%20milli....
We are still several hundred million fewer credit cards than the 1.5 billion in cirrculation in 2007
I would also challenge the this debt isn't driven by frivolous purchasing, overpaying for new cars, 1000+ dollar phones and houses people can't afford and didn't particularlly need, drive deep into peoples budgets and that then can't afford to buy things like food and clothes they are putting on credit. I live in a lower income area and the number of people driving tesla's in borderline ghetto areas is laughable. If the general public spent money in a reasonable manner they likely won't be carrying debt at the level they are. Americans are addicted to overspending, no one needs a 6-7 dollar coffee at starbucks, if people were not buying these drinks there wouldn't be a starbucks in every shopping center and at nearly every freeway exit. If people were not overspending apple wouldn't sell 1000+ dollar iphones every year.
Yes the economy is bad right now, yes inflation is on the rise, yes prices are bad, yes givernment printing of money/prime rate manipulation/stimulas&bailouts are contributing to all of this but lets not forget the prime rate was at one point 21.5% (1980) and today it is "just" 8.5% we have simply been spoiled by 2ish percent prime rates for a long time.
@Anonymalous wrote:
@Beefy1212 wrote:I am also curious how they came up with card holders carrying a balance, is that reported balance or an actual balance carried month to month? I am also curious how it treats consumers with 15 cards with balances you might be able to say 47% of credit card accounts are carrying a balance but I highly doubt anyone has the granular data to scrub out people with no balance vs people with 15 balances vs people with multiple balance being carried intentionally under zero apr deals all three of these numbers would paint a very different picture.They cite (link) this Bankrate article as a source for how many people are carrying a balance:
https://www.bankrate.com/finance/credit-cards/credit-card-debt-survey/#key-insights
It comes from a survey, where cardholders said whether they were carrying a balance from month. So it doesn't rely on the incomplete information from the credit bureaus, for instance.
I missed the link when I was reading the article, thanks for pointing that out...
They asked just under 2,500 people less than 2,000 of which actually had a credit card... The error of margin of that before even factoring for lying/errors is through the roof.
"Total sample size was 2,486 adults, among whom 1,919 were cardholders"
that is a ratio of roughly 1:651,400 people to credit card accounts
Surveys are one of the lowest quality sources of data on anything.