cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit reporting

tag
Downto0
Regular Contributor

CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit reporting

I've never heard of such a law where a collector must notify a debtor that they may place a negative tl on my cr.  Here's what they wrote:

 

As required by law, you are hereby notified that a negative credit report reflecting your credit record may be submitted to a credit reporting agency if you fail to fulfill the terms of your credit obligations.  But we will not submit a negative credit report to a credit reporting agency about this credit obligation until the experation of the time period described on the fron ofthis letter.

 

My first question is, "What law?"  My answer is that there is no such law.  My thoughts are that they threw the "as required by law" as a suggestion that somehow legal action may be imminent.  Collectors do this sort of thing because it works.  

 

My next question is about the "experation of the time period described on the front of this letter" (the negative reporting notification is on the back).  I'm not completely sure but I think they are suggesting that I have the same time allotment as with the request for verification...30 days after receipt of the letter.  This is confusing and overshadows my validation rights.  It would be better if they wrote "thirty days from the receipt of this letter" right with the negative reporting notification.  That way I would not have to go to the front of the letter and try to find another experation date. They listed their phone number for paying the debt 4 times but only listed one experation date and that was for validation.

 

So, my two questions are (1) What law? and

 

(2) aren't they overshawdowing my validation rights when they muddle the negative credit reporting with my validation rights?

 

 

Message 1 of 16
15 REPLIES 15
Roarmeister
Frequent Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

They are talking about THEIR responsibility TO you by providing notification to you that your credit rating may be negatively impacted.  It would be some sort of consumer protection entrenched in regulations.  They are not threatening you with legal action, nor do they have something to lord over you.  The law is there FOR you.

 

By all means make sure your bill is paid or at least make the min. payment required to avoid impacting your credit score.

Starting Score: EQ 732 October 2007; Current Score: EQ 839; TU 865, July 2022;
Oldest Reporting EQ Account: 20.4 years; EQ AAoA: 9.9 years;
ACTUAL Oldest account 40.1 years; ACTUAL AAoA 19.3 years.





Message 2 of 16
RobertEG
Legendary Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

I am presuming that what you have received is a so-called "dunning notice" from a debt collector, which is a required notice under FDCPA 809(a) of their collection on the identified debt?

 

 

 

Message 3 of 16
Downto0
Regular Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

It may be embedded in one of the consumer protection laws...possibly the FCRA.  I'd like to find what law the collector is referring to.  At this point I don't think there is such a law and the collector is attempting to intimidate consumers that legal action is somehow involved.  You know, most people throw dunning letters away but sit up and take notice when legal action is implicated.  

 

And, without going into detail, I've tried to reason with the creditor but they are using strong arm tactics, such as closing my account prematurely and sending a debt collector.  I'm ready to send the case into my consumer protection attorneys and let them take a wack at them.  

 

Robert, you must be referring to the law requiring that the debt collector inform me of my maxi-Miranda rights.  However, the negative credit reporting was in a separate section on the back of the letter while the dv section was on the front.  While there is some connection because I am told to look at the dv section for the timeline, I don't see where the collector would be required, by law, to inform me specifically that they may place a negative tl on my cr.  

 

Seems like clear intimidation to me that the law is somehow involved and that the consumer should pay up or face legal action.  Why else would they bring up "by Law"? 

 

Message 4 of 16
RobertEG
Legendary Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

The FCRA has no requirement that any party must report or give notice of potential reporting to a CRA.

The FCRA requires only that anything reported must not knowingly be inaccurate, not that any item be reported.

 

The FDCPA, however, requires a debt collector to send notice to a consumer once they have had any initial communication with the consumer regarding a debt.

That requirment is unrelated to credit reporting under the FCRA, it is a debt collection practices requirment under the FDCPA

I would speculate they are meeting their dunning notice requirement, but incorrecting referencing a credit reporting requirement.

 

Regardless, they have provided notice.

Message 5 of 16
Downto0
Regular Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

That's the way I see it. 

 

809 has a list of things the collector must do after initial communication and a request for dv.  However, I cannot see where 809 requires that a collector must notify the consumer that they may place a derogatory tl on the consumer's cr if they don't pay up.  They are incorrectly referencing a credit reporting requirement.  Was that by accident or by design to intimidate?

 

Would a judge buy an argument where the collector used the affirmative defense that they made a bona-fide error when they included a warning about negative credit reporting as being required by law?  I do believe that mistakes of law are not bona-fide errors.

 

I think they violated 1692e(10)

Message 6 of 16
RobertEG
Legendary Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

Notice that they may report is clearly not inaccurate nor prohibited.

Thus, I would not expect an inaccuracy in statement of supporting rationale for the notice to be prejudicial of actionable.

Message 7 of 16
Downto0
Regular Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

If that is what they said then yes but that's not the case here.  They said "as required by law" which is an inaccurate statement because once the creditor has given notice to the debtor then there is no more requirement by law to give such notice. I did some research and found that the "as required by law" statement is from FACTA which is an amendment to the FCRA:

 

``(A) Notice to consumer required.--
``(i) In general.--If any financial
institution that extends credit and regularly and
in the ordinary course of business furnishes
information to a consumer reporting agency
described in section 603(p) furnishes negative
information to such an agency regarding credit
extended to a customer, the financial institution
shall provide a notice of such furnishing of
negative information, in writing, to the customer.

``(ii) Notice effective for subsequent
submissions.--After providing such notice, the
financial institution may submit additional
negative information to a consumer reporting
agency described in section 603(p) with respect to
the same transaction, extension of credit,
account, or customer without providing additional
notice to the customer.

 

Creditors are required by law to inform consumers the first time they report derogatory information on the consumer's account.  After that, no such notice is required by law.  

 

 I found a case which is helpful in explaining the "as required by law" statement.  In Cruz v MRC Receivables the court said:

 

Cruz argues that because the original creditor, HSBC, and Defendants had both previously submitted negative credit reports to credit reporting agencies, the notice contained in the letters was not required. Therefore, Cruz concludes, it is false to say that the notice was "required by law," so Defendants violated sections 1692e and 1692e(10).


Defendants argue that the notice they included was permitted under both federal and California law. Mot. at 8. Whether the notice was permitted and whether it
was required are distinct questions. Generally speaking, both state and federal law require that when a creditor submits negative information to a credit-reporting agency, it must provide notice to the debtor. See Cal. Civ.Code § 1785.26(b); 15 U.S.C. § 1681S-2(a)(7)(A)(i). However, both the California and federal statutes have provisions making subsequent notice unnecessary once the initial notice has been sent. See Cal. Civ.Code § 1785.26(b) ("After providing this notice, a creditor may submit additional information to a credit reporting agency respecting the same transaction or extension of credit that gave rise to the original negative credit information without providing additional notice.") (emphasis added); see also 15 U.S.C. § 1681S-2 (a)(7)(A)(ii) (same).

 

Cruz did not prevail on her claim because she did not establish that notice was previously sent.  Even if she had, this court would have still made an unfavorable judgment because the court saw "required by law" as "permitted by law" which would make the notice legal because future notices of derogatory reporting are "permitted by law". 

 

However, this case had verbatim language as my dunning letter except that my collector added a few sentences which is entirely another subject.  I have not had the time to research the cases which cited the Cruz's case but I'll wager that there is some consumer friendly court somewhere which did find that subsequent notices of negative reporting are not required by law and to say they are is false.

 

I'm preoccupied in other areas of research and simply don't have the time to follow up.  If someone else comes across an instructive case then I'm all ears.

 

Message 8 of 16
RobertEG
Legendary Contributor

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

They have chosen to provide notice that they can report to a CRA.  Whether or not such a notice is required by law seems to me to be kinda academic, as no harm to the consumer results from providing such notice.  Their notice is accurate. 

They can report at any time, including after sending dunning notice, up to the point that the consumer sends a timely DV.  FDCPA 809(b) makes it clear that there is no cease collection bar during the 30-day period set in a dunning notice.

"Collection activities and communications that do not otherwise violate this title may continue during the 30-day period referred to in subsection (a) unless the consumer has notified the debt collector in writing that he debt, or any portion of the debt, is disputed or that the consumer requests the name and address of the original creditor."

 

They have stated that, even though they could report during the 30-day period, they have chosen not to do so.

Their notice is thus beneficial, not prejudicual, to the consumer, and I would not make a legal case out of the ""As requires by law" phrase.

Message 9 of 16
Anonymous
Not applicable

Re: CA tells me that "as required by law" that I am notified of possible negative credit r

I agree with RobertEG, you would merely be quibbling over phrasing which is not in any way harming you nor is it threatening you. Trying to make this into some sort of violation by them would get you nowhere fast, IMO.

If its a legitimate debt, pay it if you can in order to keep it off your record. Thats something a lot of us don't ever get the opportunity to do.

Message 10 of 16
Advertiser Disclosure: The offers that appear on this site are from third party advertisers from whom FICO receives compensation.