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10, 17, 27 point losses - deleted AU card

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Regular Contributor

10, 17, 27 point losses - deleted AU card

Hi,  I'm comfused. I just lost 17 points on EX and 10 on EQ (update) and 27 on TU (TU reason is change of address).  The only changes were; change of address; HP in August for a BofA card; and most recently the Cap1 I was an AU on; The primary passed away; I asked them to delete the account completely per CK it lists as "terminated"; the  Cl was $2400/ 74 months age  opened 7/2014; no balance; 


I'm confused by this decrease; here are my other revolvers; shouldn't this deletion help my aaoa increase? Also I haven't ran my latest fico because I'm still waiting for alerts on a few things first. The amounts listed are cl; I don't carry balances except for <$200 on NFCU so it's not a utilization issue.  Any thoughts? Thanking you in advance! 

boa open 6/1982 $24k

Lafcu open 2/2012 $1k

Sams club /synchrony open 6/2014 closed 7/2018 au

Jpmc open 11/15 closed 10/2019 au $500

Amex gold open 12/16

Synchony bow flex opened 2/2017 $2500 (recently increased but not reported)

Nfcu opened July 2018 $28k

Amex Hilton opened 10/2019 $40k

 

 

 

FICO 8
1/2020 EQ714 TU736 EX719
2/2020 EQ718 TU744 EX736
5/2020 EQ723 TU741 EX730
7/2020 EQ725 TU750 EX755
8/2020 EQ725 TU746 EX744
9/2020 EX718 EQ715 TU722
Cards:
NFCU Visa Sig Cash Rewards $28k cl
Amex Gold
Amex HH Aspire $40k cl
Synchrony Bank -Bowflex $7500 cl
BoA Visa Cash Rewards $24k cl
Message 1 of 34
33 REPLIES 33
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Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card


@kkboom wrote:

Hi,  I'm comfused. I just lost 17 points on TU and 10 on EQ. The only changes were a HP in August for a BofA card; and most recently the Cap1 I was an AU on; The primary passed away; I asked them to delete the account completely per CK it lists as "terminated"; the  Cl was $2400/ 74 months age  opened 7/2014; no balance; 


I'm confused by this decrease; here are my other revolvers; shouldn't this deletion help my aaoa increase? Also I haven't ran my latest fico because I'm still waiting for alerts on a few things first. The amounts listed are cl; I don't carry balances except for <$200 on NFCU so it's not a utilization issue.  Any thoughts? Thanking you in advance! 

boa open 6/1982 $24k

Lafcu open 2/2012 $1k

Sams club /synchrony open 6/2014 closed 7/2018 au

Jpmc open 11/15 closed 10/2019 au $500

Amex gold open 12/16

Synchony bow flex opened 2/2017 $2500 (recently increased but not reported)

Nfcu opened July 2018 $28k

Amex Hilton opened 10/2019 $40k

 

 

 


@kkboom Looks like it reduced your AAoA and AAoRA, average age of revolving accounts, at first look without doing any calculations because all but two revolvers were newer. If it had no negative history why did you dump it?


Additionally, if it was removed from your report, it lowered the denominator for your ratio of revolvers and accounts with a balance. So now it will be harder to hit the lower thresholds.

For a collection of our current FICO scoring wisdom, updated as we learn, read the following. Watch the revision dates on the bottom of the first 8 posts as they are regularly updated: Link to Scoring Primer.


RIP:

Oldest/average age varies by bureau. Estimates above.


Updated Oct 2020, unless otherwise noted.

(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? Severity and recency? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts, both open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (Mature/young), AOYRA-Age of Youngest Revolving Account (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/mature/new account, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just detail any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AOYRA and whether you have a loan on record to start.

For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment, please.
Message 2 of 34
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Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

A good rule to go by this is: figure out what your average age is and what your average age of revolvers is, then compare to the age of the card you’re debating removing. If it’s older, you know it’s helping you; if it’s younger it’s hurting you.
For a collection of our current FICO scoring wisdom, updated as we learn, read the following. Watch the revision dates on the bottom of the first 8 posts as they are regularly updated: Link to Scoring Primer.


RIP:

Oldest/average age varies by bureau. Estimates above.


Updated Oct 2020, unless otherwise noted.

(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? Severity and recency? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts, both open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (Mature/young), AOYRA-Age of Youngest Revolving Account (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/mature/new account, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just detail any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AOYRA and whether you have a loan on record to start.

For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment, please.
Message 3 of 34
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Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

Use FICO scores, not Credit Karma VS 3.0 scores?

Message 4 of 34
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Community Leader
Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

Are you referring to your CK scores? If so, those are highly volatile and can be way off your true FICOs. I'm betting if you pull up your true FICOs, you won't see such a drastic change, if any.


Last App: 8/24/2020
NFCU Secured Card

Currently rebuilding as of 04/11/2019.

Starting FICO 8 Scores:




Current FICO 8 scores:


Message 5 of 34
Highlighted
Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

Are those CK scores?
For a collection of our current FICO scoring wisdom, updated as we learn, read the following. Watch the revision dates on the bottom of the first 8 posts as they are regularly updated: Link to Scoring Primer.


RIP:

Oldest/average age varies by bureau. Estimates above.


Updated Oct 2020, unless otherwise noted.

(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? Severity and recency? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts, both open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (Mature/young), AOYRA-Age of Youngest Revolving Account (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/mature/new account, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just detail any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AOYRA and whether you have a loan on record to start.

For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment, please.
Message 6 of 34
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Regular Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

@Birdman7 @AllZero @OmarGB9 

 

Sorry for not being clear. I'm on a new very demanding job and am exhausted by the time I get off. i hit send and then fell asleep


Score drop- is on fico 8; The reason provided was "all bank card  credit limit decreased"lowered from $97,900 to $95,500. Side note: 
my Synchrony bowflex card cl was just increased more than the $2400 but hasn't reported yet.

CK REFERENCE I checked CK only to see how update is listed in report; CK list status as "terminated" I'm wondering if the way it  is listed is contributing to loss of points.  Btw, only lost 2 points on ck. 

AAOA/AAORA - since I just scored big with the joint account of 38 years I thought my age was being lowered by having the card even though it is older than some of my other open accounts. The math I did is shown below, but perhaps I'm not using the proper calculation method. In my examples below, Example 1 with fewer cards has the higher AAoRA; Am I off base? 

Example 1)

Act 1: 458 months 

Act 2: 11 months

AAoRA =234.5

 

Example 2)

Act 1: 458 months 

Act 2: 11 months

Act 3: 60 months 

AAoRA =176.3 months 

 

AU removal- Account holder passed away; I notified bank and asked to have record deleted. Not sure if they deleted or as ck says "account terminated". Also not sure if that status matters to score. 

 

Any thoughts? 

 

FICO 8
1/2020 EQ714 TU736 EX719
2/2020 EQ718 TU744 EX736
5/2020 EQ723 TU741 EX730
7/2020 EQ725 TU750 EX755
8/2020 EQ725 TU746 EX744
9/2020 EX718 EQ715 TU722
Cards:
NFCU Visa Sig Cash Rewards $28k cl
Amex Gold
Amex HH Aspire $40k cl
Synchrony Bank -Bowflex $7500 cl
BoA Visa Cash Rewards $24k cl
Message 7 of 34
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Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card


@kkboom wrote:

@Birdman7 @AllZero @OmarGB9 

 

Sorry for not being clear. I'm on a new very demanding job and am exhausted by the time I get off. i hit send and then fell asleep


Score drop- is on fico 8; The reason provided was "all bank card  credit limit decreased"lowered from $97,900 to $95,500. Side note: 
my Synchrony bowflex card cl was just increased more than the $2400 but hasn't reported yet.

CK REFERENCE I checked CK only to see how update is listed in report; CK list status as "terminated" I'm wondering if the way it  is listed is contributing to loss of points.  Btw, only lost 2 points on ck. 

AAOA/AAORA - since I just scored big with the joint account of 38 years I thought my age was being lowered by having the card even though it is older than some of my other open accounts. The math I did is shown below, but perhaps I'm not using the proper calculation method. In my examples below, Example 1 with fewer cards has the higher AAoRA; Am I off base? 

Example 1)

Act 1: 458 months 

Act 2: 11 months

AAoRA =234.5

 

Example 2)

Act 1: 458 months 

Act 2: 11 months

Act 3: 60 months 

AAoRA =176.3 months 

 

AU removal- Account holder passed away; I notified bank and asked to have record deleted. Not sure if they deleted or as ck says "account terminated". Also not sure if that status matters to score. 

 

Any thoughts? 

 


@kkboom hey I fell asleep too. give me a little time and I'll do the calculations and see if we come up with the same. like I said I didn't do any calculations, I was just eyeballing it so I may or may not be right the math. And a 38 year joint is a tremendous score! Congratulations on that! Well done!

 

yeah I thought you were referring to version 8 and using CK as a reference, I understood that. But the question is, is it still on your report or not?

 

you may need to pull your ACR. Because if it's still on your report it's still contributing to aging whereas if they removed it, it is not. If it simply says terminated they may have simply put terminated in the responsibility field and left the history... hopefully. Well that is, if my eyeballing is right. 

 

I haven't even went back and reread post one yet but do you have any other AU accounts? if so do they have a balance? and do you know whether or not for sure this (or other) AU was counting? 

Give me a couple minutes and I'll do the math. You already know the reason that comes with it is not necessarily correlated to the actual cause of the score change. And Unless it caused you to cross the utilization threshold, the change in CL shouldn't of made a difference

For a collection of our current FICO scoring wisdom, updated as we learn, read the following. Watch the revision dates on the bottom of the first 8 posts as they are regularly updated: Link to Scoring Primer.


RIP:

Oldest/average age varies by bureau. Estimates above.


Updated Oct 2020, unless otherwise noted.

(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? Severity and recency? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts, both open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (Mature/young), AOYRA-Age of Youngest Revolving Account (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/mature/new account, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just detail any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AOYRA and whether you have a loan on record to start.

For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment, please.
Message 8 of 34
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Regular Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card

Thanks @Birdman7 ! Yep, I'm sure I need to pull all 3. I don't have any other AU accounts. Will be on standby for more feedback. Thanks! 

FICO 8
1/2020 EQ714 TU736 EX719
2/2020 EQ718 TU744 EX736
5/2020 EQ723 TU741 EX730
7/2020 EQ725 TU750 EX755
8/2020 EQ725 TU746 EX744
9/2020 EX718 EQ715 TU722
Cards:
NFCU Visa Sig Cash Rewards $28k cl
Amex Gold
Amex HH Aspire $40k cl
Synchrony Bank -Bowflex $7500 cl
BoA Visa Cash Rewards $24k cl
Message 9 of 34
Highlighted
Super Contributor

Re: 17 point loss - deleted AU card


@kkboom wrote:

Thanks @Birdman7 ! Yep, I'm sure I need to pull all 3. I don't have any other AU accounts. Will be on standby for more feedback. Thanks! 


OK I did the math and it looks like you're right, it did improve your average ages to dump the account. But my math doesn't agree with yours. 

first off I need to know if you have any loans because those will contribute to average age of accounts. If I assume you have no loans and the only thing you have listed on your credit report is what you listed in post one, then without that authorized user account, I get a total of 820 months across eight accounts for average age of accounts which comes to 102.5 months or 8 1/2 years. If I factor in the 74 month old authorized user account, that brings us to a total of 894 months divided by 9 accounts which gives us 99.3 months or 8.27 years AAoA. 


Now, on the other hand, when I go to average age of revolving accounts, I get 775 months across 7 accounts (because a charge card is not a revolver). That gives me 110.71 months which is 9.22 years, or if I add in the 74 month AU, I get 106 months which is 8.84 years.

 

so yes it did increase your average ages! We need to know if the account was removed from your credit report, you need to pull your ACR. I need to know if you have any loans on your CR. And one last question did the account have a balance on it?

For a collection of our current FICO scoring wisdom, updated as we learn, read the following. Watch the revision dates on the bottom of the first 8 posts as they are regularly updated: Link to Scoring Primer.


RIP:

Oldest/average age varies by bureau. Estimates above.


Updated Oct 2020, unless otherwise noted.

(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? Severity and recency? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts, both open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (Mature/young), AOYRA-Age of Youngest Revolving Account (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/mature/new account, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just detail any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AOYRA and whether you have a loan on record to start.

For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment, please.
Message 10 of 34
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