cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when Carecredit is AZEO card on clean/aged/thick/new

Your FICO® Scores can impact your loan interest rates, terms, approvals and more.
Established Contributor

CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when Carecredit is AZEO card on clean/aged/thick/new

UPDATE: When my PLCC posted a balance, I received 5 points back from the no revolving penalty, rather than the entire 13 points. This is 8 points less than when my profile is AZEO with a major cc. ....................................

Ok, I've done some prior testing that has caused me to believe Carecredit is treated differently at TU when used as the AZEO card, and another member, @Duke_Nukem received the no revolving penalty when it was his AZEO card, which caused me to ponder.

So, let me review the evidence. I was at AZ at all 3 CRAs. I reported a balance at all 3 CRAs on my Carecredit PLCC. EQ +13, TU +5, EX +15.

When a major card posted a balance, I gained 8 points at TU. So, I did not receive all of my no revolving penalty points back from Carecredit, and I did not receive the remainder until a Major CC reported. I also have an unexplained +5 at EQ in all fairness.

So, the only way to resolve this with any sense of certainty is to do a re-test, as my intial test was admittedly not totally clean and interference free. Plus, I've been sloppy in the past, and I am trying to learn from the vets and do a better job. Actually drafted this and all.

So, here is the deal, I'm back at AZ, EQ-13, TU-13, EX-15. Carecredit just reported a balance. I am interference-free and believe I can acquire clean DPs. EX has just reported a +15, again, as expected. Now to see if I only get +5 @ TU when Carecredit posts a positive balance again at TU. If I do, I believe I will have confirmed the Carecredit "Retail" PLCC does NOT offer maximum AZEO points at TU and is in fact treated differently. However, I think my previous theory that there is a retail penalty at TU is incorrect; I now theorize "retail" or certain cards simply do not offer maximum points when used as the AZEO card. This buttresses the established wisdom that using a major card is best for AZEO.

So, We shall see what happens. Also, I have a choice: 1. I can have an AU retail card report a balance to see the results, however it is flagged, so I don't think it'll affect Classic 8 except utilization, but it would affect mortgage scores and EX BC3; 2. I could let Carecredit report a 0 balance and go back to AZ losing the 5 points I expect to gain when it reports; 3. I could let a major CC report and probably realize the other 8 points like last time; 4. I could let my other retail card report; 5. Any variation or combination, such as returning to AZ to watch the expected 5 point loss and then a major reporting for +15, or have a major report probably giving +8, then have Carecredit report a 0 balance, which I would not expect to have an effect.

Anyway, I would like advice/opinions/feedback. Thank you.




Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
14 REPLIES 14
Community Leader
Senior Contributor

Re: Less TU8 AZEO points when using Carecredit? (Retesting)

AUs are confusing and unpredictable. One of the things you're looking for is predictibillity. Run whatever tests you want on primary user cards first. Once you're satisfied with your primary card testing, play with AUs.

 

This may take a while if there are a number of things you want to look at. Take your time, and resist the tempation to try to test two things at once. Smiley Happy If this takes a few months, you might want to check in at true AZEO with a major card at some point. That's just to see if anything other than what you're trying to test has changed.

Message 2 of 15
Established Contributor

Re: Less TU8 AZEO points when using Carecredit? (Retesting)

HO Thank you for the advice. I've been checking in regularly at AZEO and even gained 1 point on the penalty at one CRA when I added a card.




Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Message 3 of 15
Highlighted
Established Contributor

Re: Less TU8 AZEO points when using Carecredit? (Retesting)

Well fellow MF members, I am pleased to announce that I have discovered something. My theory has been confirmed. When Carecredit posted a positive balance as the AZEO card, I received my 15 points back at EX and my 13 points back at EQ, however I have only received 5 points back at TU.

This is an absolutely clean data point nothing else going on or possible. This is the second time I’ve ran this test to confirm it because the first time was it admittedly not a clean data point. However, as Revelate would state, this is gold standard.

Now I need to determine what steps to take next. Does this apply to all retail cards at TU? Or only synchrony backed retail cards? Why did member @Duke_Nukem receive the full no revolving penalty when he used it as his AZEO card? But yet I only received an 8 point no revolving penalty instead of a 13 point no revolving penalty.

Thoughts anyone?




Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Message 4 of 15
Moderator Emeritus

Re: Less TU8 AZEO points when using Carecredit? (Retesting)

Was this FICO 8 on TU?

 

I can't argue the datapoint as you say, seems well isolated and controlled.

 

Just for giggles on the myFICO TU monitoring service you should get reason codes on "Your Score Changed" alerts; did you get any of those alerts during this process and if so by chance do you have the reason codes for when your Carecredit was the only revolver with a balance?

 

Weird, I would like to see the test redone on another store card (and not an AU as already metnioned) but certainly looks concrete.




        
Message 5 of 15
Established Contributor

Re: Less TU8 AZEO points when using Carecredit? (Retesting)

@Revelate Yes FICO 8 TU. Although if you recall, I had different point spreads on EX BC3 as well I think. However, that could be due to different balances at the time. I need to rule that out. And I also need to review EX BC3 for the present changes.

Yes I do have the reason codes from MF and they are simply balance changes and score changes, both tests/times. Yes I will pull the reason codes for you from EX CW, if you like. Have to wait, I’m on mobile.

As you wish, I will bring the carecredit to zero, (AZ) and then report a balance on a different non-AU retail card. (In all honesty, I screwed up testing the AU card because I missed an inquiry. I was sloppy. The AU card is not counting at TU and does not affect age. The Carecredit test was separate and afterwards, but I had to redo it totally clean and without interference to confirm.) I can complete this by the end of the month. But then I’ll be stuck for a month, because Citibank (Macy’s) does not off cycle update very easily..... it won’t stop me from trying tho.




Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Message 6 of 15
Frequent Contributor

Re: CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when AZEO with Carecredit as compared to a major CC

azeo_book.png

27 FICO Scores + 3 VS3. MTG (Mortgage), AUT (Auto), and BKC (Bankcard) are scores 5,4, and 2 from the top.
Message 7 of 15
Established Contributor

Re: CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when AZEO with Carecredit as compared to a major CC

😂😂😂
You are awesome CassieCard!😊😊




Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Message 8 of 15
Moderator Emeritus

Re: CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when AZEO with Carecredit as compared to a major CC

"Yes I do have the reason codes from MF and they are simply balance changes and score changes"

 

What I mean is look at the score charge alert's for TU, if you expand it out (least in the web interface) it comes with reason codes.

 

You should absolutely get a reason code for AZ in my experience, the question is if the reason codes are different with just the Carecredit reporting a balance vs. a national bank card.

 




        
Message 9 of 15
Established Contributor

Re: CONFIRMED! TU FICO 8 gives 8 points less when AZEO with Carecredit as compared to a major CC

Wow @Revelate! I never knew those reason codes were there, I thought everyone got them from EX CW! Wow, hang around with you much, I’m gonna learn A LOT! LOL! Sorry it took me so long, but was on a road trip and they were inaccessible via mobile.

So, I mailed Synch their change today, and it will update in roughly a week. Shortly thereafter, I will allow Macy’s (Citi Retail) to post a positive balance and observe the effects on TU FICO 08.

As requested, here’s the reason codes from both experiments:


Experiment #1

I. >AZ from major CC -14:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Too many inquiries last 12 months.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.

II. INQ falling off +5:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.
• No recent bank/national revolving balances.

III. AZ>AZEO with Carecredit +5:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.
• No recent bank/national revolving balances.

IV. AZEO>AZE2 with major CC +8:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.
• Too many inquiries last 12 months.


Experiment #2


V. AZE3>AZ -13:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.
• No recent bank/national revolving balances.

VI. AZ>AZEO with Carecredit +5:
• Lack of recent installment loan information.
• Time since most recent account opening is too short.
• Length of time revolving accounts have been established.
• No recent bank/national revolving balances.


TBD:
Experiment #3


VII. AZEO>AZ -5


VIII. AZ>AZEO with Macy’s +?





Considering BBVA and 5% cards. (Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Message 10 of 15