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General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread, pub.5.17.20

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Valued Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20


@Birdman7 wrote:
Hey Community, I did a little updating and rearranging. Recommend you re-read Credit Mix at post 5. Also added a slide to post 1 regarding scorecards. A few other minor changes and a little rearranging to make room. Enjoy! And as always thanks to @CassieCard for all the assistance!

@Birdman7: A lot of people think a mortgage is necessary to get an 850, or that not having one hurts their score.

 

We know from the AMA that both statements are false, so I think that should be under Credit Mix somewhere.

 

Tom Quinn (FICO, VP of Scores):  "There is no characteristic in FICO Scores that penalize a user for not having a mortgage loan." ( Link )

...and...

Tom Quinn: "There is no requirement to have an open mortgage to get an 850 score." ( Link )

 

Coming along very nicely!

27 FICO Scores + 3 VS3. MTG (Mortgage), AUT (Auto), and BKC (Bankcard) are scores 5,4, and 2 from the top.

Keeper of the Scrolls of ResilienceEQ FICO Resilience Index Score Leaderboard

48 forum members have shared this new credit score. Share yours today!

Message 231 of 275
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Super Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20


@CassieCard wrote:

@Birdman7 wrote:
Hey Community, I did a little updating and rearranging. Recommend you re-read Credit Mix at post 5. Also added a slide to post 1 regarding scorecards. A few other minor changes and a little rearranging to make room. Enjoy! And as always thanks to @CassieCard for all the assistance!

@Birdman7: A lot of people think a mortgage is necessary to get an 850, or that not having one hurts their score.

 

We know from the AMA that both statements are false, so I think that should be under Credit Mix somewhere.

 

Tom Quinn (FICO, VP of Scores):  "There is no characteristic in FICO Scores that penalize a user for not having a mortgage loan." ( Link )

...and...

Tom Quinn: "There is no requirement to have an open mortgage to get an 850 score." ( Link )

 

Coming along very nicely!


@CassieCard Done! 😊 And thank you, wouldn't be possible without you! And a big thank you to all who contribute! You make it possible Community! And thanks to MyFICOforums for having us!

-Our Community’s updated scoring wisdom: Link to Scoring Primer.
-For Negative Reason Codes see: CassieCard’s Score Factors thread.
-ccquest’s workbook to calculate metrics for you: Link to Workbook.

Oct 2020 New Account Scorecard.Nov 2020, No New Account Scorecard (reassignment conflated with aging. EX9 not updated yet. Oldest/avg varies. Estimates above.)
Real world mortgage maxes are: EQ5-818, TU4-839, EX2-844.


RIP:
(Everything said is JMHO and is not endorsed by FICO or MF. I have no affiliation with either, just a grateful member.)
Message 232 of 275
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Super Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20

Community, CassieCard has been nice enough to create 8 and 5/4/2 HTML negative reason code charts for you at the following thread:

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Understanding-FICO-Scoring/Score-Factors/m-p/6170415/highlight/true...

-Our Community’s updated scoring wisdom: Link to Scoring Primer.
-For Negative Reason Codes see: CassieCard’s Score Factors thread.
-ccquest’s workbook to calculate metrics for you: Link to Workbook.

Oct 2020 New Account Scorecard.Nov 2020, No New Account Scorecard (reassignment conflated with aging. EX9 not updated yet. Oldest/avg varies. Estimates above.)
Real world mortgage maxes are: EQ5-818, TU4-839, EX2-844.


RIP:
(Everything said is JMHO and is not endorsed by FICO or MF. I have no affiliation with either, just a grateful member.)
Message 233 of 275
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Valued Member

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread, pub.5.17.20

I look dirty/mature, D3. I'mma bust a hoard of new cards before my BK falls off after next November. Booya?





Message 234 of 275
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Valued Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread, pub.5.17.20


@LP007 wrote:

I look dirty/mature, D3. I'mma bust a hoard of new cards before my BK falls off after next November. Booya?


hahaha

27 FICO Scores + 3 VS3. MTG (Mortgage), AUT (Auto), and BKC (Bankcard) are scores 5,4, and 2 from the top.

Keeper of the Scrolls of ResilienceEQ FICO Resilience Index Score Leaderboard

48 forum members have shared this new credit score. Share yours today!

Message 235 of 275
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Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread, pub.5.17.20

Many, many thanks to @CassieCard and @Birdman7 for the design, development, publishing and improvements to these posts in this thread.

 

 

Payment history: 100%; no lates, records, or derogs. Utilization: always under 8.99%. Profile: 10+ cards. Mix: closed card, mortgage and car loan accounts. AoOA: > 20 years. Total credit line: >$300K. Scores: all FICO8s > 800. Goals: higher scores, CL, and knowledge
Message 236 of 275
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Frequent Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20


@CassieCard wrote:

@Birdman7: A lot of people think a mortgage is necessary to get an 850, or that not having one hurts their score.

 

We know from the AMA that both statements are false, so I think that should be under Credit Mix somewhere.

 

Tom Quinn (FICO, VP of Scores):  "There is no characteristic in FICO Scores that penalize a user for not having a mortgage loan." ( Link )

...and...

Tom Quinn: "There is no requirement to have an open mortgage to get an 850 score." ( Link )

 

Coming along very nicely!


Thank you so much, @CassieCard, for your hard, thoughtful and meticulous work in curating and analyzing so much helpful info! You are a treasure. 

 

Reading through your Score Factors thread made me think back to the post quoted here. I'm curious whether and how you think we can reconcile Tom Quinn's bolded statement with the existence of score factor 79 on the EX8 and TU8 tables? Just to save people a few clicks, the text for score factor 79 is "Lack of recent reported mortgage loan information."


Message 237 of 275
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Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20


@Curious_George2 wrote:

@CassieCard wrote:

@Birdman7: A lot of people think a mortgage is necessary to get an 850, or that not having one hurts their score.

 

We know from the AMA that both statements are false, so I think that should be under Credit Mix somewhere.

 

Tom Quinn (FICO, VP of Scores):  "There is no characteristic in FICO Scores that penalize a user for not having a mortgage loan." ( Link )

...and...

Tom Quinn: "There is no requirement to have an open mortgage to get an 850 score." ( Link )

 

Coming along very nicely!


Thank you so much, @CassieCard, for your hard, thoughtful and meticulous work in curating and analyzing so much helpful info! You are a treasure. 

 

Reading through your Score Factors thread made me think back to the post quoted here. I'm curious whether and how you think we can reconcile Tom Quinn's bolded statement with the existence of score factor 79 on the EX8 and TU8 tables? Just to save people a few clicks, the text for score factor 79 is "Lack of recent reported mortgage loan information."


From my own experience, I was able to maintain an 850 score after I paid off my mortgage.  So in that respect, it wasn't necessary to have an open mortgage tradeline to achieve an 850 score.  However, I noticed that any new inquiry or account created bigger swings in my score than when I had an open mortgage tradeline.  For example, an inquiry with an open mortgage cost me zero points and a new account cost 4 points.  After paying off my mortgage, an inquiry cost 1 point and a new account cost 9 points.  Both of these examples started with an 850 EX score and dropped from there.  Of course there could have been other factors at work in the algorithm, but none were obvious to me.

November 2020 Snapshot -

FICO8:
VantageScore3:
Inquiries:
New Accounts: 1/24, 1/12, 0/6
AAoA: 10+ years
AoOA=AoORA: 33+ years
AoYA=AoYRA: less than 1 year



Total Credit Card Limits: $355k (includes $42k AU and $32k business)
Utilization: less than 1%

Installment Loans: none open
(all mortgages, auto loans, and student loans FINALLY paid off, though 5 closed tradelines are still reporting)
Message 238 of 275
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Super Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20

@Curious_George2 That’s not a difficult question. You can reach 850 and still have an imperfect file. Negative reason codes signal that something can be improved. Contrary to popular belief, 850 does not mean the file is perfect!

Therefore a mortgage is not necessary for a perfect score. However even with the 850, a perfect score, there is still room for improvement, although it would not be reflected in the score. Remember, there is a buffer.

-Our Community’s updated scoring wisdom: Link to Scoring Primer.
-For Negative Reason Codes see: CassieCard’s Score Factors thread.
-ccquest’s workbook to calculate metrics for you: Link to Workbook.

Oct 2020 New Account Scorecard.Nov 2020, No New Account Scorecard (reassignment conflated with aging. EX9 not updated yet. Oldest/avg varies. Estimates above.)
Real world mortgage maxes are: EQ5-818, TU4-839, EX2-844.


RIP:
(Everything said is JMHO and is not endorsed by FICO or MF. I have no affiliation with either, just a grateful member.)
Message 239 of 275
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Super Contributor

Re: General Scoring Primer and Version 8 Master Thread rev.5.17.20

@Curious_George2 and another thing to keep in mind is, you're not being penalized for the lack of the installment loan; it's simply signaling that you could be awarded bonus points if you had the loan and at proper utilization levels.

-Our Community’s updated scoring wisdom: Link to Scoring Primer.
-For Negative Reason Codes see: CassieCard’s Score Factors thread.
-ccquest’s workbook to calculate metrics for you: Link to Workbook.

Oct 2020 New Account Scorecard.Nov 2020, No New Account Scorecard (reassignment conflated with aging. EX9 not updated yet. Oldest/avg varies. Estimates above.)
Real world mortgage maxes are: EQ5-818, TU4-839, EX2-844.


RIP:
(Everything said is JMHO and is not endorsed by FICO or MF. I have no affiliation with either, just a grateful member.)
Message 240 of 275
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