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Mortgage payout

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Valued Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@SouthJamaica wrote:

@glacier3 wrote:

Ok, found it. Before the mortgage payout the Fico Score 2 for mortgage was 817.


Awesome. This is valuable information you just provided.

 

You paid off your only open installment loan.

EX FICO 8 dropped 23 points.

EX FICO 2 dropped only 2 points.

 

Great data point. Thank you.

 

 

 


I agree.  This is great info for us!

 

Year 2012: All Scores in the 520 range, during a foreclosure, CC Settlement and high UTIL. Very ugly days...
Oct 2019: EX8: 850; EQ8: 850; TU8: 850 -- Middle Mortgage Score: 824
In My Wallet: Discover $73.7K; Cap1 Venture $39.7K; Amex ED $38K; Amex Optima $2.5K; Amex Delta Gold $18K; Citi Costco $16.5K; Cap1 Plat $8.4K; Barclay $7K; BoA Plat $21.6K; Citi TY Pref $19K; US Bank $4K; Dell $5K; Care Credit $6.5K. Total Revolving CL: $270K
My UTIL: Less than 1% - Only allow about $10 a month to report, on one account. .
Message 11 of 20
Moderator Emeritus

Re: Mortgage payout

Couple questions Smiley Happy.  And to echo the others, thank you for the datapoint.

 

What was original balance on the mortgage and what was the open date (month/year), and are there any other open installment loans and similar request for the information on those even if the mortgage undoubtedly dominated the calculation from the FICO 8 result?

 

And since I guess might as well ask for it all from the Experian service, there's reason codes, that look like

1 3

2 4 

 

On each of the additional scores, for completeness could you give before / after on those too? Smiley Happy  FICO 8 is pretty well characterized, FICO 2 is not.




        
Message 12 of 20
New Member

Re: Mortgage payout

The original mortgage balance from Jan 2004, was around 120K. When the mortgage was refinanced at a lower rate in 2012, the balance was around 90K.

 

As I wrote above, I don't have any other installment accounts now and have not had them for quite a while. The only other installment account that I ever had was for an auto loan in 2007 (for about 10K), which was paid off in 2010. 

 

Regarding the reason codes: I looked again at the Experian site, and I don't see any codes there for the Fico Score 2 (either for the current one or for the achrived versions). The only thing I see there is a notation below the score itself which says "What's harming your score? You have no negative factors impacting your Score."

Message 13 of 20
Super Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@glacier3 wrote:

The original mortgage balance from Jan 2004, was around 120K. When the mortgage was refinanced at a lower rate in 2012, the balance was around 90K.

 

As I wrote above, I don't have any other installment accounts now and have not had them for quite a while. The only other installment account that I ever had was for an auto loan in 2007 (for about 10K), which was paid off in 2010. 

 

Regarding the reason codes: I looked again at the Experian site, and I don't see any codes there for the Fico Score 2 (either for the current one or for the achrived versions). The only thing I see there is a notation below the score itself which says "What's harming your score? You have no negative factors impacting your Score."


That demonstrates how good your FICO 2 score is. If there were any, they would be appearing under "What's harming your score?"

 

When a FICO score stops giving you negative reason codes.... you've arrived Smiley Happy


Total revolving limits 720500 (594000 reporting) 10/2/19 FICO 8 scores: EQ 744 TU 782 EX 746
Message 14 of 20
Frequent Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@SouthJamaica wrote:

@glacier3 wrote:

Here is what I can see about the scoring models. I am signed up for credit monitoring separately with Experian and with TransUnion. Each time I login there, they display my credit score.  On the Experian website it says "Fico Score 8" next to that score. It went down from 849 before the house sale to 826 now (so it was 23 points down, not 26, sorry about that). On the Transunion page it says "Based on VantageScore 3.0". The score there was 828 before the house sale and is 832 now. 

 

No, I don't have any other installment loans, that was the only one. I do have several credit cards, with the oldest one being about 26 years old. The mortgage loan was refinanced at some point (I think in 2012), to bring down the interest rate. I don't remember the precise amount of the loan at that time, I think it was something in the 90K range.   


1. OK so disregard the TU score, it is a Vantage 3.0 score which is not a FICO score and is meaningless for our purposes.

 

2. On installment loans I was asking only about open loans. So the answer to that is no, the mortgage you just paid off was your only open installment loan, and now you have none.  The FICO 8 scoring models penalize people for having no open installment loans.  So the drop in your EX FICO 8 is totally predictable. You have probably experienced a similar drop in TU FICO 8 and EQ FICO 8, you just don't know it yet since you don't have access to those scores.

 

3. The FICO 8 scores are not mortgage scores. Fortunately, the FICO mortgage scores either won't react to the payoff of the mortgage, or will react only slightly. On the Experian site you can check your FICO 2 score, under "FICO Scores > Mortgage Lending", to see what effect, if any, the mortgage payoff had on that. I'm guessing little or none, but I would be interested in your reporting back on that.

 

In view of your excellent scores, this has no real life impact on you at all.

 

BTW if you're wondering why some scoring models would penalize someone for being debt free.....  you're not alone.


Hi Glacier3, thanks for posting. I had the same situation end of year 2018 where I sold my home and closed out that mortgage loan. Most recent scores prior to the loan close-out were 723/724/737 for EQ/TU/EX respectively. My FICO 8 point drops were -26/-27/-28 for EQ/TU/EX. VERY painful. FICO 5/4/2 impact was across the board: +9/-2/+39 for EQ/TU/EX. I suspect there was something else (not sure what) impacting the out-sized EX F2 score increase. And with respect to your follow on question @SouthJamaica, I had a total of 8 open mortgage/installment accounts at the time (including the mortgage loan that ended): 2 Mortgage; 2 Auto; 1 Pers Fin; 3 School Loans. All in good standing.

 

Can you shed light on what factors are considered in one FICO score dropping so precipitously,a nd others not? And, any sense of how long the point drop will linger or have a negative impact on my scores?

 

Interestingly, DW, whose scores are a bit stronger than mine, in the 750+/- range, saw very MIMIMAL impact to FICO 8 scores (did not check her FICO 5/4/2). I guess her experience was closer to that of Glacier3, except she does have several installment accounts like me.

 

Thanks for any help you can provide.



Current Scores Jul 2019 – FICO 8
Message 15 of 20
Highlighted
New Member

Re: Mortgage payout

@soupy5: Thanks a lot for your comparison info! I am just learning about all these different scores myself, so I don't really understand yet which factors affect which scores, and for how long. I'll start checking all of my scores more regularly to see what if anything changes, and in what direction.

 

The only other thing that I noticed now, after your post, is that my Fico Auto Score (with Experian) experienced a really dramatic drop after my mortgage payout. Before the house sale, for the Jan 17 report, my Fico Auto Score 2 was 837. Now it has gone down to 798, a drop of 39 points. Similarly, Fico Auto Score 8 was 873 before and it is 834 now, also a drop of 39 points. 

 

For the credit card scores from Experian, Fico Bankcard Score 2 was 844 and it is 847 now (+3 points), Fico Bankcard Score 3 was 803 and it is 792  now (-9 points), and Fico Bankcard Score 8 was 876 before and it is 850 now (-26 points).  

 

All of this is pretty mysterious to me... But I guess it is a good thing that I am not looking for an auto loan now -Smiley Happy

 

Message 16 of 20
Super Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@glacier3 wrote:

@soupy5: Thanks a lot for your comparison info! I am just learning about all these different scores myself, so I don't really understand yet which factors affect which scores, and for how long. I'll start checking all of my scores more regularly to see what if anything changes, and in what direction.

 

The only other thing that I noticed now, after your post, is that my Fico Auto Score (with Experian) experienced a really dramatic drop after my mortgage payout. Before the house sale, for the Jan 17 report, my Fico Auto Score 2 was 837. Now it has gone down to 798, a drop of 39 points. Similarly, Fico Auto Score 8 was 873 before and it is 834 now, also a drop of 39 points. 

 

For the credit card scores from Experian, Fico Bankcard Score 2 was 844 and it is 847 now (+3 points), Fico Bankcard Score 3 was 803 and it is 792  now (-9 points), and Fico Bankcard Score 8 was 876 before and it is 850 now (-26 points).  

 

All of this is pretty mysterious to me... But I guess it is a good thing that I am not looking for an auto loan now -Smiley Happy

 


Actually I'm pretty sure you'd get the best rate anyway Smiley Happy


Total revolving limits 720500 (594000 reporting) 10/2/19 FICO 8 scores: EQ 744 TU 782 EX 746
Message 17 of 20
New Member

Re: Mortgage payout

@SouthJamaica: Thanks! I hope you are right, but I am also glad that I don’t need to try it. However, I am somewhat worried about what will happen this summer when I have to look for a new apartment to rent. Most landlords and real estate companies now run a credit check on the applicants (although I don’t know which psrticular score they use). I’ll probably generate at least 2-3 new credit inquiries on my credit report, which will drag my score further down...
Message 18 of 20
Frequent Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@glacier3 wrote:

@soupy5: Thanks a lot for your comparison info! I am just learning about all these different scores myself, so I don't really understand yet which factors affect which scores, and for how long. I'll start checking all of my scores more regularly to see what if anything changes, and in what direction.

 

The only other thing that I noticed now, after your post, is that my Fico Auto Score (with Experian) experienced a really dramatic drop after my mortgage payout. Before the house sale, for the Jan 17 report, my Fico Auto Score 2 was 837. Now it has gone down to 798, a drop of 39 points. Similarly, Fico Auto Score 8 was 873 before and it is 834 now, also a drop of 39 points. 

 

For the credit card scores from Experian, Fico Bankcard Score 2 was 844 and it is 847 now (+3 points), Fico Bankcard Score 3 was 803 and it is 792  now (-9 points), and Fico Bankcard Score 8 was 876 before and it is 850 now (-26 points).  

 

All of this is pretty mysterious to me... But I guess it is a good thing that I am not looking for an auto loan now -Smiley Happy

 


I'm relatively new to this credit scoring game myself - I only wish my profile was less susceptible to these wild point swings than it is. Interesting how the different scores are impacted in different ways by certain events. How awesome it would be to truly understand and (heaven forbid) predict the changes brought about by these algorithms. I think probably only second to hacking/cracking the codes to the US nuclear missle launch protocol is the FICO scoring algortihm :-)



Current Scores Jul 2019 – FICO 8
Message 19 of 20
Super Contributor

Re: Mortgage payout


@glacier3 wrote:
@SouthJamaica: Thanks! I hope you are right, but I am also glad that I don’t need to try it. However, I am somewhat worried about what will happen this summer when I have to look for a new apartment to rent. Most landlords and real estate companies now run a credit check on the applicants (although I don’t know which psrticular score they use). I’ll probably generate at least 2-3 new credit inquiries on my credit report, which will drag my score further down...

I think, when one is doing an apartment search, one would get the credit inquiry only after putting in an application. So I think you'll only get one hard pull on one bureau.


Total revolving limits 720500 (594000 reporting) 10/2/19 FICO 8 scores: EQ 744 TU 782 EX 746
Message 20 of 20
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