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The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

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Moderator Emeritus

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

Hrm.  

 

Citi card opened on 4/1/19 as listed on Experian (think actual open was 4/28), pulled report early this morning (7/1 ~12:30 am PDT) no change at all from 6/30.  Top 8 scorecard, no deliquency, AAOA < 5 years, AOOA > 11 years, 20 open tradelines, 33 total... inquiries and 4 open accounts < 1 year, 2 specifically < 6 months.

 

Saw some people suggest that the 2nd day of the month was the shift, will see tomorrow, maybe just some idiosyncratic thing 3 months + 1 day?

 

I know I saw a gnarly drop when the Citi card reported but as further data showed it might be tied into the length of revolving history reason code (as myFICO reports it) but will see tomorrow one way of the other.  I'm going to really hate it if breakpoints around this are profile specific, **bleep** it FICO!




        
Message 81 of 109
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Established Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment


@Revelate wrote:

Saw some people suggest that the 2nd day of the month was the shift, will see tomorrow, maybe just some idiosyncratic thing 3 months + 1 day?

 

I know I saw a gnarly drop when the Citi card reported but as further data showed it might be tied into the length of revolving history reason code (as myFICO reports it) but will see tomorrow one way of the other.  I'm going to really hate it if breakpoints around this are profile specific, **bleep** it FICO!


I hope you see some points from it. I received the points on the 1st at both breakpoints: AoYA 3mo and AoYA 6mo. The 6mo jump happened on a weekend too - June 1st, Saturday.

 

And +1 for using the word 'gnarly', which I just heard a few days ago on TV because 'Fast Times at Ridgemont High' was showing on cable.

Message 82 of 109
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Senior Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

Mine have also been on the 1st....maybe its nonaged scorecards only?










(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Scores updated DEC'19.

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (aged/nonaged), AoYR-Age of Youngest Revolver (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/aged/new accounts, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just list whether you have any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AoYR and whether you have a loan on record.
For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment. please.
Message 83 of 109
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Moderator Emeritus

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment


@CassieCard wrote:

@Revelate wrote:

Saw some people suggest that the 2nd day of the month was the shift, will see tomorrow, maybe just some idiosyncratic thing 3 months + 1 day?

 

I know I saw a gnarly drop when the Citi card reported but as further data showed it might be tied into the length of revolving history reason code (as myFICO reports it) but will see tomorrow one way of the other.  I'm going to really hate it if breakpoints around this are profile specific, **bleep** it FICO!


I hope you see some points from it. I received the points on the 1st at both breakpoints: AoYA 3mo and AoYA 6mo. The 6mo jump happened on a weekend too - June 1st, Saturday.

 

And +1 for using the word 'gnarly', which I just heard a few days ago on TV because 'Fast Times at Ridgemont High' was showing on cable.


Laugh, yeah showing my age.

 

Nothing on 7/2 either, and I did see my AAOA breakpoint exactly on the 1st too which was why I was so surprised seeing people on the forums suggest it moved on the 2nd... and generally your datapoints seem way better than most reported here but trying to give everyone the benefit of the doubt, well you know how that goes.

 

Anyway appears to be nothing on EX at least, TU is the only other one I have good data for really and that's on a derogatory scorecard where AOYA isn't even a thing in my experience at least FICO 4/8, not sure on 9.

 

So quite possibly to Birdman's point it might just be the proposed new credit file scorecard, or it might be a pattern of accounts.  I can't exactly explain why I lost more than 20 points for a new revolver when I had recent (<6 mo) installment loans opened but if it's just revolving as Birdman's prior data suggests, then I just haven't hit whatever breakpoint is needed.

 

Went from Jan 2017 to a new revolver in April 2019, so I was at 2 years and 3 months going to 1 month, plenty of room for breakpoints there just not at 3 months apparently on my profile/scorecard.  I may wind up refinancing my mortgage which would reset installment AOYA to near zero when it reports, would be interesting then to track increases between the two and of course AAOA over the next few years.

 

Given that credit card benefits and probably soon rewards too appear to be in process of being scaled back, may have opened my last credit card for a while.




        
Message 84 of 109
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Established Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment


@Revelate wrote:

Given that credit card benefits and probably soon rewards too appear to be in process of being scaled back, may have opened my last credit card for a while.


It looks like the scaling back has been on their minds for quite a while now:

Capital One, Discover tighten credit limits, close dormant accounts

 

That's from October 2018, with a link inside to a Federal Reserve survey of loan officers from the second quarter of 2018 that also shows similar sentiment.

 

Things are still nice and cozy with my Citi Costco card though. They didn't cut nearly as many benefits from this card as the others.

 

Also, I just got a SP CLI of $2500 this morning on it. So now my total credit limit across 2 cards is $11,000, which is basically a Happy Meal without-the-toy to most people on here. lol

 

Message 85 of 109
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Moderator Emeritus

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment


@CassieCard wrote:

@Revelate wrote:

Given that credit card benefits and probably soon rewards too appear to be in process of being scaled back, may have opened my last credit card for a while.


It looks like the scaling back has been on their minds for quite a while now:

Capital One, Discover tighten credit limits, close dormant accounts

 

That's from October 2018, with a link inside to a Federal Reserve survey of loan officers from the second quarter of 2018 that also shows similar sentiment.

 

Things are still nice and cozy with my Citi Costco card though. They didn't cut nearly as many benefits from this card as the others.

 

Also, I just got a SP CLI of $2500 this morning on it. So now my total credit limit across 2 cards is $11,000, which is basically a Happy Meal without-the-toy to most people on here. lol

 


Hah yeah.  

 

Most of the protections lost were things I never bothered with anyway so I wasn't worried about it, and the weakness in the subprime space has been seen since 2017 based on my Lending Club default rate which skyrocketed back then.   Actually it's to the point now LC won't even lend to those people anymore haha, but I've already been pulling my money out over the last two years now anyway.

 

I think there's a chance though as interest rates continue to fall and alternative payment methods start making more inroads (the various Fintech plays) that the straight rewards programs will get cut and since I'm near the top of the pyramid for what I could rationally use now, seems like going down is inevitable in which case, no need for more accounts other than maybe testing purposes and I'm far more likely to open up an installment loan to do that rather than a bunch of revolvers which don't really move the needle meaningfully for me either numbers or percentage wise.

 

 




        
Message 86 of 109
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Established Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

AZEO with only 2 cards is good for some decent points on the EX 2's.

 

I had no changes on any EX scores from the 1st through 4th.

Then this morning - the 5th - both of my cards updated at Experian: 1 at $0, 1 at $35. [Aggregate change 4% to 1%]

 

EX 2, +6 [739]

EX Auto 2, +5 [714]

EX Bankcard 2, +6 [745] My first real 'Very Good' rating....even though it's worthless. lol

 

Those points are the exact number of points I lost back in February going from 1 card with a balance to 2 cards with a balance.

(See here: February 9, 2019 report with 28 FICO scores )

I still have the 'Too many accounts with balances' reason.

 

For the first year of having credit cards at least, the maximum points can be attained by keeping utilization between 0 and 4% (3pts better than between 4 and 9 on this scorecard) and a balance on only 1 card.

Message 87 of 109
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Senior Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

Hi CassieCard what made you determine the cause includes utilization as well as the number of accounts? What if your utilization was in the higher bracket(4-8.9), but with only one Card?










(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Scores updated DEC'19.

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (aged/nonaged), AoYR-Age of Youngest Revolver (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/aged/new accounts, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just list whether you have any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AoYR and whether you have a loan on record.
For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment. please.
Message 88 of 109
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Established Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment


@Birdman7 wrote:
Hi CassieCard what made you determine the cause includes utilization as well as the number of accounts? What if your utilization was in the higher bracket(4-8.9), but with only one Card?

Good question. In the higher bracket I would lose 3 points on EX/EQ 8, and 1 point on TU 8. 

 

Proof of that is here: EX has a 4% aggregate utilization threshold (0,4]

(In the replies to that, I posted updates to EQ and TU as they came in.)

 

This month's change in aggregate utilization is from 3.89% (June) to 0.32%, so utilization didn't contribute anything to the increases I have observed so far.

 

On my February report linked above, quite a few of the 28 FICO scores went down around 5 points with a change from 1 to 2 cards with a balance. And now I am getting those exact number of points back moving from 2 to 1. I expect so see a lot more scores move up a little with the final myFICO 3B report on the 10th.

 

 

Message 89 of 109
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Senior Contributor

Re: The 'All At Just Under 8.99% Utilization' experiment

Yes I do recall that thread but I need to go refresh my recollection. You have definitely uncovered a lot of good information CassieCard!!










(Forgive typos, mobile.)(Everything said is Just IMHO.)
Scores updated DEC'19.

In order to better answer your questions and record your DPs, please provide your profile stats: Any baddies? (clean/dirty), Number of accounts open and closed on CRs (thick/thin), AoOA? (aged/nonaged), AoYR-Age of Youngest Revolver (new accounts/no new accounts)? Open/closed loan on CR?
For example, mine is clean/thick/aged/new accounts, with open loan on record.
If you don't know where you fall, just list whether you have any baddies, your number of open and closed accounts, AoOA, AoYR and whether you have a loan on record.
For utilization questions, list individual and aggregate utilizations, revolving and installment. please.
Message 90 of 109
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