Wells Fargo taking applications for new BILT card

[Rockysocks]

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@wasCB14 wrote:

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@longtimelurker wrote:

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@Rockysocks wrote:

You beat me to making this post by two minutes lol! Thanks for making it. I wonder if product change is an option to this card?...

DP: I'll probably honestly apply now and use it for cell protection because it's AMAZING. According to the Bilt site:

"Reimbursement is limited to the repair or replacement of your original cell phone, less a $25 deductible with an allowable maximum of two paid claims per 12-month period. Each approved claim has a benefit limit of $800."

$1,600 A YEAR, WOOOOO!!!! What other $0 af cards have that??

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On the other hand:

Note: Electronic issues, such as inability to charge, mechanical or battery failure, where there is no evidence of
physical damage, are not covered under this program.

On the plus side though, I don't see the usual language about not covering "cosmetic" damage, which includes large cracks that doesn't prevent the phone from making and receiving calls (And making calls is at least 99% of what we use smartphones for! )

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What is not covered?
This benefit will not provide reimbursement for the following:
• Cell phone accessories other than standard battery and/or standard antenna provided by the manufacturer
• Cell phones purchased for resale, professional, or commercial use
• Cell phones that are lost or “mysteriously disappear,” meaning that the phone vanished in an unexplained manner
without evidence of a wrongful act by a person or persons
• Cell phones under the care and control of a common carrier (including, but not limited to, the U.S. Postal Service,
airplanes, or delivery service)
• Cell phones stolen from baggage unless hand-carried and under Your personal supervision, or under supervision
of Your traveling companion
• Cell phones which have been rented, borrowed or are part of prepaid or “pay as you go” type plans
• Cosmetic damage to the cell phone or damage that does not impact the cell phone’s capabilities and
functionalities
• Damage or theft resulting from abuse, intentional acts, fraud, hostilities of any kind (including, but not limited to,
war, invasion, rebellion, or insurrection), confiscation by the authorities, risks of contraband, illegal activities,
normal wear and tear, flood, earthquake, radioactive contamination, or damage from inherent product defects
• Damage or theft resulting from misdelivery or voluntary parting with the cell phone
• Taxes, delivery and transportation charges, and any fees associated with the cellular wireless service provider
• Losses caused by or resulting from a Cyber Incident

The exclusion is there. It's just concealed under many layers of weaselese.

Start on the WF homepage.

Follow the link to the Bilt website.

Click + to expand Cell Phone Protection.

Click the link to footnote 7.

Follow the link back to Wells Fargo and download the PDF.

Look near the bottom of page 2.

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I wonder if all WF cards with cell coverage are equally restrictive, or is this just "a Bilt thing"? I saw this list earlier today when poking around Bilt's website, and it kept me from apping.

[wasCB14]

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@Rockysocks wrote:

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@wasCB14 wrote:

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@longtimelurker wrote:

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@Rockysocks wrote:

You beat me to making this post by two minutes lol! Thanks for making it. I wonder if product change is an option to this card?...

DP: I'll probably honestly apply now and use it for cell protection because it's AMAZING. According to the Bilt site:

"Reimbursement is limited to the repair or replacement of your original cell phone, less a $25 deductible with an allowable maximum of two paid claims per 12-month period. Each approved claim has a benefit limit of $800."

$1,600 A YEAR, WOOOOO!!!! What other $0 af cards have that??

---

On the other hand:

Note: Electronic issues, such as inability to charge, mechanical or battery failure, where there is no evidence of
physical damage, are not covered under this program.

On the plus side though, I don't see the usual language about not covering "cosmetic" damage, which includes large cracks that doesn't prevent the phone from making and receiving calls (And making calls is at least 99% of what we use smartphones for! )

---

What is not covered?
This benefit will not provide reimbursement for the following:
• Cell phone accessories other than standard battery and/or standard antenna provided by the manufacturer
• Cell phones purchased for resale, professional, or commercial use
• Cell phones that are lost or “mysteriously disappear,” meaning that the phone vanished in an unexplained manner
without evidence of a wrongful act by a person or persons
• Cell phones under the care and control of a common carrier (including, but not limited to, the U.S. Postal Service,
airplanes, or delivery service)
• Cell phones stolen from baggage unless hand-carried and under Your personal supervision, or under supervision
of Your traveling companion
• Cell phones which have been rented, borrowed or are part of prepaid or “pay as you go” type plans
• Cosmetic damage to the cell phone or damage that does not impact the cell phone’s capabilities and
functionalities
• Damage or theft resulting from abuse, intentional acts, fraud, hostilities of any kind (including, but not limited to,
war, invasion, rebellion, or insurrection), confiscation by the authorities, risks of contraband, illegal activities,
normal wear and tear, flood, earthquake, radioactive contamination, or damage from inherent product defects
• Damage or theft resulting from misdelivery or voluntary parting with the cell phone
• Taxes, delivery and transportation charges, and any fees associated with the cellular wireless service provider
• Losses caused by or resulting from a Cyber Incident

The exclusion is there. It's just concealed under many layers of weaselese.

Start on the WF homepage.

Follow the link to the Bilt website.

Click + to expand Cell Phone Protection.

Click the link to footnote 7.

Follow the link back to Wells Fargo and download the PDF.

Look near the bottom of page 2.

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I wonder if all WF cards with cell coverage are equally restrictive, or is this just "a Bilt thing"? I saw this list earlier today when poking around Bilt's website, and it kept me from apping.

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The "cosmetic damage not covered" weakness also applies to Active Cash, Reflect, and Hotels.com cards. Not sure about their older cards that no longer seem to be offered on their website. (I've not followed WF changes lately.)

[Aim_High]

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@wasCB14 wrote:

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@Rockysocks wrote:

I wonder if all WF cards with cell coverage are equally restrictive, or is this just "a Bilt thing"? I saw this list earlier today when poking around Bilt's website, and it kept me from apping.

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The "cosmetic damage not covered" weakness also applies to Active Cash, Reflect, and Hotels.com cards. Not sure about their older cards that no longer seem to be offered on their website. (I've not followed WF changes lately.)

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I'm not an expert on cellphone coverage options, @Rockysocks, but from my understanding the cosmetic damage exclusion is the standard industry rule with most plans rather than the exception.  Most of these plans are pretty restrictive in what they will or will not cover.  They are also secondary coverage to other options such as homeowner's insurance, renter's insurance, or cell phone provider plans.   And then there are the deductibles.  Since I tend to take care of my phones and keep them in a secure Otterbox case, IMO for many consumers it may be a better choice to just get the best card rewards available on cellphone payment and pocket the proceeds knowing you might have to fork over part of it later for equipment replacement. 

[Rockysocks]

Thank you both for replying!

[wasCB14]

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@Aim_High wrote:

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@wasCB14 wrote:

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@Rockysocks wrote:

I wonder if all WF cards with cell coverage are equally restrictive, or is this just "a Bilt thing"? I saw this list earlier today when poking around Bilt's website, and it kept me from apping.

---

The "cosmetic damage not covered" weakness also applies to Active Cash, Reflect, and Hotels.com cards. Not sure about their older cards that no longer seem to be offered on their website. (I've not followed WF changes lately.)

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I'm not an expert on cellphone coverage options, @Rockysocks, but from my understanding the cosmetic damage exclusion is the standard industry rule with most plans rather than the exception.  Most of these plans are pretty restrictive in what they will or will not cover.  They are also secondary coverage to other options such as homeowner's insurance, renter's insurance, or cell phone provider plans.   And then there are the deductibles.  Since I tend to take care of my phones and keep them in a secure Otterbox case, IMO for many consumers it may be a better choice to just get the best card rewards available on cellphone payment and pocket the proceeds knowing you might have to fork over part of it later for equipment replacement. 

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Correct. In general, cosmetic damage is not officially covered. What's covered in practice can be a bit YMMV.

I use an Otterbox, but that doesn't protect against everything (like having someone sit in your lap).

I take the approach of paying the phone bill (which I use to communicate with tenants and contractors as well as family and friends) with Business Platinum for the $10 monthly credit. If and when I claim, maybe I'll get some of the damage covered.

And if not, at least I can be pretty confident the claims process will be simple. The minor lap sitting damage predates the Business Platinum, but maybe I'll upgrade from an iPhone 11 to a 14 when it comes out.

[unsungivy]

I took a quick skim of this card the other day, even though I don't currently rent.

One thing that jumped out at me is that the landlord/company you paying rent to might need to be a member of the "Bilt Alliance"

"Anyone can join the Bilt Rewards program for free, but holding the Bilt Mastercard will supercharge your rewards. If you live in a rental unit that’s part of the Bilt Alliance (as more than 2 million units across the U.S. managed by The Blackstone Group, Equity Residential and more are), you can pay your rent directly in the Bilt Rewards app and earn points for doing so.

If you don’t live in a Bilt-affiliated property, you can still use the app to pay your rent, free of charge, and your landlord will receive a paper check in the mail from Bilt. But you won't earn rewards this way unless you also have the Bilt Mastercard. (More on the rewards structure below.) If you don't live in a Bilt-affiliated property and don't hold the Bilt Mastercard, you won't earn any rewards."

Maybe? Not sure. But that spooked me. Hopefully the "unless" part means that them handing your landlord a check still gets you the initial points (even if it's not a double dip).

[imaximous]

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@unsungivy wrote:

I took a quick skim of this card the other day, even though I don't currently rent.

One thing that jumped out at me is that the landlord/company you paying rent to might need to be a member of the "Bilt Alliance"

"Anyone can join the Bilt Rewards program for free, but holding the Bilt Mastercard will supercharge your rewards. If you live in a rental unit that’s part of the Bilt Alliance (as more than 2 million units across the U.S. managed by The Blackstone Group, Equity Residential and more are), you can pay your rent directly in the Bilt Rewards app and earn points for doing so.

If you don’t live in a Bilt-affiliated property, you can still use the app to pay your rent, free of charge, and your landlord will receive a paper check in the mail from Bilt. But you won't earn rewards this way unless you also have the Bilt Mastercard. (More on the rewards structure below.) If you don't live in a Bilt-affiliated property and don't hold the Bilt Mastercard, you won't earn any rewards."

Maybe? Not sure. But that spooked me. Hopefully the "unless" part means that them handing your landlord a check still gets you the initial points (even if it's not a double dip).

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It says that if the landlord is not part of the Bilt network, you still the 1% as long as you have the credit card. If you don't have the credit card, then you don't get any points.

[longtimelurker]

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@Aim_High wrote:

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I'm not an expert on cellphone coverage options, @Rockysocks, but from my understanding the cosmetic damage exclusion is the standard industry rule with most plans rather than the exception.  . 

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Yes, that's certainly the case, with some variations. I've seen specifics about how long a crack can be before it is covered, and the thing about the threshold is the ability to make and receive calls.  This one talks about damage that does not impact the cell phone’s capabilities and functionalities, which could be very permissive, or not, depending on underwriter pushback.    

But I only brought that up because I didn't see it there it until @wasCB14 showed it.   My more critical point was the "electronics" section

Note: Electronic issues, such as inability to charge, mechanical or battery failure, where there is no evidence of
physical damage, are not covered under this program.

And as an internationally recognized* expert on cell phone insurance, I haven't seen that sort of broad exclusion before.  You can imagine filling out a form that the phone is no longer/cant.....  and the underwriter says "Oh, that's them electronics...."

*Internationally Recognized by LTL "We Make YOU an Expert" Program.  (TM pending) For a reasonable (not small, but arguably reasonable) fee, one of our clerks in another country, Canada or the US, as appropriate, will declare you an expert in whatever you wish.

[Remedios]

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@longtimelurker wrote:

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@Aim_High wrote:

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I'm not an expert on cellphone coverage options, @Rockysocks, but from my understanding the cosmetic damage exclusion is the standard industry rule with most plans rather than the exception.  . 

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Yes, that's certainly the case, with some variations. I've seen specifics about how long a crack can be before it is covered, and the thing about the threshold is the ability to make and receive calls.  This one talks about damage that does not impact the cell phone’s capabilities and functionalities, which could be very permissive, or not, depending on underwriter pushback.    

But I only brought that up because I didn't see it there it until @wasCB14 showed it.   My more critical point was the "electronics" section

Note: Electronic issues, such as inability to charge, mechanical or battery failure, where there is no evidence of
physical damage, are not covered under this program.

And as an internationally recognized* expert on cell phone insurance, I haven't seen that sort of broad exclusion before.  You can imagine filling out a form that the phone is no longer/cant.....  and the underwriter says "Oh, that's them electronics...."

*Internationally Recognized by LTL "We Make YOU an Expert" Program.  (TM pending) For a reasonable (not small, but arguably reasonable) fee, one of clerks in another country, Canada or the US, as appropriate, will declare you an expert in whatever you wish.

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Forensic Mobilology for me, plz. 

[wasCB14]

Just as a general caution, some towns have better post offices than others. My local one is pretty poorly run. Enough mail gets lost or misdelivered that almost all tenants prefer to hand-deliver a check to a drop box rather than take their chances with first-class mail.

So if you use this service to pay a low-tech landlord, you'll want to pay well in advance to allow for a second (even possibly third?) check to arrive before any late penalties kick in.

ETA: While the same problems affect services like Plastiq, renters on average have less cash in checking accounts than many CC SUB chasers do. So writing a personal check for ~$2000 while waiting for a ~$2000 refund from a CC or a debit from Bilt could be a challenge for renters.