Scorecard change from young to mature?

[Snook_on_the_Line]

So I made the move to a clean scorecard this month.     My only remaining baddie was EE'd.    this brought a 78 point jump in my fico 8s.  Into the 750s 🤑     

my current AAoA is 2.3 years

the question is at what point do you move from a 'new' or 'young' scorecard to a 'mature' scorecard?

I thought I read here somewhere that it was at an AAoA of three years, with no new accounts.    Or was it five years AAoA?

im trying figure out when to app for some new cards.   

if it's three years then I'll wait till my AAoA is at 2 years 11 months. That way, by my logic at least, I'll have the best scores possible on the Young scorecard 

and I'll be apping before taking a hit from moving from the tip top of a young scorecard to the bottom of a Mature scorecard

thats my understanding at least 

any thoughts and insight are appreciated 

[TheKid2]

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@Snook_on_the_Line wrote:

So I made the move to a clean scorecard this month.     My only remaining baddie was EE'd.    this brought a 78 point jump in my fico 8s.  Into the 750s 🤑     

my current AAoA is 2.3 years

the question is at what point do you move from a 'new' or 'young' scorecard to a 'mature' scorecard?

I thought I read here somewhere that it was at an AAoA of three years, with no new accounts.    Or was it five years AAoA?

im trying figure out when to app for some new cards.   

if it's three years then I'll wait till my AAoA is at 2 years 11 months. That way, by my logic at least, I'll have the best scores possible on the Young scorecard 

and I'll be apping before taking a hit from moving from the tip top of a young scorecard to the bottom of a Mature scorecard

thats my understanding at least 

any thoughts and insight are appreciated 

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I have seen that AAoA at 6 years is the big breakpoint for me. I've read that there are other breakpoints along the way (maybe 2 years, maybe 4 years). It is a difficult thing to nail down. I do not believe there is a scorecard segmentation based solely on AAoA, for "mature".

If you search the forums you will find lots of reading on this.

[SouthJamaica]

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@TheKid2 wrote:

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@Snook_on_the_Line wrote:

So I made the move to a clean scorecard this month.     My only remaining baddie was EE'd.    this brought a 78 point jump in my fico 8s.  Into the 750s 🤑     

my current AAoA is 2.3 years

the question is at what point do you move from a 'new' or 'young' scorecard to a 'mature' scorecard?

I thought I read here somewhere that it was at an AAoA of three years, with no new accounts.    Or was it five years AAoA?

im trying figure out when to app for some new cards.   

if it's three years then I'll wait till my AAoA is at 2 years 11 months. That way, by my logic at least, I'll have the best scores possible on the Young scorecard 

and I'll be apping before taking a hit from moving from the tip top of a young scorecard to the bottom of a Mature scorecard

thats my understanding at least 

any thoughts and insight are appreciated 

---

I have seen that AAoA at 6 years is the big breakpoint for me. I've read that there are other breakpoints along the way (maybe 2 years, maybe 4 years). It is a difficult thing to nail down. I do not believe there is a scorecard segmentation based solely on AAoA, for "mature".

If you search the forums you will find lots of reading on this.

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I agree with @TheKid2 I too do not believe AAoA is a scorecard segment indicator.

Neither do I think 3 years is a big threshold.

@Thomas_Thumb  once posted that the first important thresholds in AAoA were 2 years and 5 years

[Thomas_Thumb]

AAoA is not a scorecard segmentation factor. AoOA and AoYA are segmentation factors along with file thickness for Fico 8. The AoOA segmentation value remains debateable. Some believe it is 3 years. Others think is is longer, say 8 years. AoYA is 12 months.

AAoA can impact score. The highest threshold of AAoA for enhancing score is believed to be 7.5 years.

[FicoMike0]

@Thomas_Thumb  I may have data on the AoOA segmentation. My situation is, I'm recovering from being credit retired. 18 months ago, I was unscorable. My oldest open account is 17 months. My fico8 is being propped up by old closed accounts. Three, total. One only appears on equifax, it's 20 years. The others are 8 years. My eq score is highest. I don't see any other big differences. I'll get the exact numbers and post.

All of those accounts are going to reach the 10 year point in less than 2 years. I'm expecting a score drop then. That's the main reason I went crazy and opened a ssl. I felt the 30-40 points would cover the drop. I'm also planning to go in the garden 12 months out. Then, my AoYA will turn 12 months and I'll be 0/12 on hps.

I'm old, I already own house, car, furniture, appliances, New roof and ac. I really have no good reason to care what my score is. It's become a hobby I guess.

[Thomas_Thumb]

Not a bad hobby to have. It's cheap

Thanks for the data.

Comparing scores between CRAs with different file data is used a lot.

However, it can be misleading. CRAs score certain factors differently from each other. As a result, scores can vary 20-30 point among the CRAs even when files are identical.

Nailing down age related thresholds is particularly tricky. Most difficult is the AoOA segmentation threshold. That threshold is typically experienced once only. The exception being the rare file where all well aged accounts are closed and drop off a report.  At best years go by before repeatability can be tested.

Ideally we observe a data point crossing a suspected threshold. Then see an associated change in reason codes and scores. Better yet is to see the same changes in reason codes across multiple CRAs.

Unlike scoring attributes, Scorecard segmentation factors are not customized by each CRAs. If files are the same, a scorecard reassignment would happen on all 3 CRAs at once and reason codes would change together. We see this going from a dirty to a clean scorecard. There is a wholesale change in the displayed reason code list along with the expected score boost.

Some clean => clean scorecard changes may not be indicated by an obvious score change. The not established to established credit segmentation is a case in point. The best/only tell may be a change in reason codes.

Side note: There is no AoOA related segmentation among dirty scorecards.

[Anonymalous]

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@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

AAoA is not a scorecard segmentation factor. AoOA and AoYA are segmentation factors along with file thickness for Fico 8. The AoOA segmentation value remains debateable. Some believe it is 3 years. Others think is is longer, say 8 years. AoYA is 12 months.

AAoA can impact score. The highest threshold of AAoA for enhancing score is believed to be 7.5 years.

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My AoOA is hitting 3 years next month. Anything in particular to watch?

[Snook_on_the_Line]

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@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

Not a bad hobby to have. It's cheap

Thanks for the data.

Comparing scores between CRAs with different file data is used a lot.

However, it can be misleading. CRAs score certain factors differently from each other. As a result, scores can vary 20-30 point among the CRAs even when files are identical.

Nailing down age related thresholds is particularly tricky. Most difficult is the AoOA segmentation threshold. That threshold is typically experienced once only. The exception being the rare file where all well aged accounts are closed and drop off a report.  At best years go by before repeatability can be tested.

Ideally we observe a data point crossing a suspected threshold. Then see an associated change in reason codes and scores. Better yet is to see the same changes in reason codes across multiple CRAs.

Unlike scoring attributes, Scorecard segmentation factors are not customized by each CRAs. If files are the same, a scorecard reassignment would happen on all 3 CRAs at once and reason codes would change together. We see this going from a dirty to a clean scorecard. There is a wholesale change in the displayed reason code list along with the expected score boost.

Some clean => clean scorecard changes may not be indicated by an obvious score change. The not established to established credit segmentation is a case in point. The best/only tell may be a change in reason codes.

Side note: There is no AoOA related segmentation among dirty scorecards.

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That is why I have no idea what is going to happen and when.     I've always had a dirty scorecard until now👍🏻

[Thomas_Thumb]

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@Anonymalous wrote:

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@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

AAoA is not a scorecard segmentation factor. AoOA and AoYA are segmentation factors along with file thickness for Fico 8. The AoOA segmentation value remains debateable. Some believe it is 3 years. Others think is is longer, say 8 years. AoYA is 12 months.

AAoA can impact score. The highest threshold of AAoA for enhancing score is believed to be 7.5 years.

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My AoOA is hitting 3 years next month. Anything in particular to watch?

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There are a few things you can do to help isolate the age effect:

Avoid major changes to your accounts on file for the month prior and month after the event.

 - No new accounts, no inquiries and no disputes during this time.

 - No closing of any accounts and no large changes in loan B/L ratios.

- Try to maintain aggregate utilization at a similar level before/after the age boundry is crossed. Preferrably both in the 2% to 5% range or 6% to 9% range. However, anywhere in the 1% to 9% range should suffice.

 - Utilizations on all cards with balances under 29%. Try to keep number of cards with balances the same within +\- 1. Avoid the "all zero" penalty.

It would be great if you can pull all 3 Fico 8 scores at the same time when collecting before/after data. The reports need to provide reason statements about factors negatively impacting your score. The list should ideally include 4 items per CRA.

It is important to have a full set of data for the.month before the 3 year mark. Then a second data set the month of and a 3rd set the month after for good measure. Do you subscribe to any Fico score monitoring plans that pull all 3 CBs?

As for what to look for:

1. Many reports list 4 negative reasons in some type of rank order. Look for a change in rank order as well as some statements dropping off and being replaced.

 - If your file is otherwise stable you should see changes in the code list the month 3 years is reached and shows as such on your report. However, no additional change the month after.

- Scores may change as well and they should be captured. How they change may depend on the specific values of scoring attributes in your file.

For example, the weight given to card utilization may vary by scorecard assignment. Let's say a mature/established scorecard is not as concerned with individual card UT.

Case 1 - AG utilization is 8% with highest card UT at 54%.

Case 2- AG utilization is 6% with highest card at 27%.

Now file ages to 3 years and utilization levels remain unchanged. In case 1 score might go up because penalty for high card UT has been reduced. Furthermore, in case 1 a reason statement about high utilization on revolving accounts may drop to a lower rank at the 3 year mark - assuming the list is rank order. In case 2 there may be no score change because there was no penalty in play to begin with.

[SouthJamaica]

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@Thomas_Thumb wrote:...... The highest threshold of AAoA for enhancing score is believed to be 7.5 years.

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And any idea what typically happens at 7.5 years? I'm approaching that one tomorrow, in 2 of my 3 bureaus.

Unfortunately I'm also approaching 12 months AoYA tomorrow, so the results will be murky.