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@USMC_Winger wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:Absolutely can do that. I only have two letters in front of me currently, so I'll provide those. This is from C1:
- too many recent inquiries...working on this. I had some random car lots running my information last year which accounted for probably 30 credit checks when I was not looking for a vehicle in any capacity. So that 100% makes sense, but something I'm working on.
Normally, fixing excessive inquiries would be a low priority, because they age off on their own, but Cap1 seems to be putting it at the top of the list of reasons for your denial. Is it possible your friend at the Ford dealership ran the inquiries on your behalf last December so you would know which finance company to deal with once you were ready to purchase a car? If so, you may have more difficulty disputing these inquiries at the CBs, because your friend could have used all the correct info needed to verify that the inquiries are legit.
- credit limits are too low (2K and 1K currently on my two cards, those are the original opening balances)
(Ha! Cap1 is one to talk!) Navy Fed nRewards cards don't report as secured, so it could be that Cap1 expects you to have higher CLs on unsecured CCs, given your income and the length of your credit history. While you're eligible to increase your CLs on your nRewards cards at $50 increments on each card, I don't think that's the best use of your money right now.
- too many chaged-off past or present credit obligations (1, paid in full, but of course doesn't go away).
- too many charged-off past or present revolving credit obligations (1, paid in full, but of course doesn't go away).
The COs are going to be a problem.
This is from NFCU for unsecured:
Since your Navy Fed financial relationship has the most potential, this is where you should concentrate your efforts to get into Navy Fed's good graces.
- not enough debt management or property owner experience (not a clue on this)
I'm guessing, but I think it's an internal Navy Fed assessment, not a CR assessment, meaning you don't have enough transactional credit history with Navy Fed for them to give you a "passes minimum requirements" rating.
- high interest rate loan application (my financed vehicle...sh*t credit = sh*t interest rate, go figure)
You used a "lender of last resort." History shows that people who use lenders of last resort are in the highest risk category: in imminent danger of default.
- # of alternative credit lenders too high
Again, "lenders of last resort." Other, more experienced folks can correct me if I'm wrong, but I think you may be able to fix these two negative reasons by refinancing your vehicle with a reputable lender. However, your current CRs will probably prevent that in the near term. Is it possible to pay off the loan or else sell the car, pay the loan in full, and replace the vehicle with a cheaper, used car that you buy with your own savings?
If you do pay off the auto loan and all your SLs are already paid back, you will no longer have an open installment loan. Get a Navy Fed SSL to replace the auto loan and pay it down to 9.4% or less to get the most FICO points for credit mix and aggregate installment loan utilization. The Navy Fed SSL is superior to almost all self-lender loans, because there are no HPs, no fees, it's very low interest, you don't have to wait till the end of the loan to get your secured deposit back, and you can pay it down immediately to a low balance and still retain the length of the loan term to maximize your FICO score for the entire length of the loan. About 4 days after you make each Navy Fed SSL payment, an equal secured amount is released from hold, and you can immediately spend that money any way you wish.
- insufficient short-term/small dollar lending data.
I remember reading your thread the other day in the "Rebuilding Your Credit" forum. (Your FICO scores have come a long way in the last four months, so you should be congratulated!) In addition to the two nRewards cards, you have two closed pledge loans. How old are each of the nRewards cards and have you been using both CCs multiple times each month with significant dollar amounts? (It doesn't have to be 30% to 50% of your CL, but $10 once per month doesn't cut it when you have a trunk full of baddies on your CR to overcome.) Are you paying each nRewards card in full every month, preferably more than once per month to increase your Navy Fed positive transaction history? What were the term lengths and dollar amounts of your two pledge loans?
I know I'm being nosy, but it helps to know how close you are to reaching the "sufficient positive lending data" stage when you apply for your next Navy Fed CC or refinance your auto loan, so we can make recommendations to help you and future credit rebuilders get there successfully.
"any suggestions or is it best to just wait it out during my rebuild?"
Using the AZEO method with 3 CCs instead of 2 CCs would yield a few more points on your scores, but it's not enough to overcome the baddies on your CRs. Your FICO scores will still be low, and your 3rd CC would most likely be from a sub-prime lender and bucketed with a low CL. For now, concentrate on cleaning up your CRs and aging your current credit accounts with perfect payment histories.
WOW I truly appreciate this extensive reply. Give me a few to go through this and touch everything you were so kind to reply.
1) With the dealership, there is a zero percent chance of that having happened. I wasn't even looking for a vehicle then. And a lot of the inquiries are through the low-level car lots themselves, and not actualy banks. Like they do some sort of in-house financing is my guess on that, but nothing more than a guess.
2) I do have the one charge off, an open sky card from 6 years ago that's at $0 balance and will thankfully fall off at shortly. But yeah I understand that one hurts a lot.
3) I've been trying to leverage my 6 year relationship with NFCU but it hasn't gone anywhere. I had the 2 SSL I completed. I also had a secured card for 2Y 3M that I closed out (stupid I know, but I was frustrated it never graduated). I always kept that one below 30% and didn't miss a payment. My current cards are 1 year 6 months and 1 year 0 months. I use both cards, and would pay them down to less than 5% before each statement. Now I'm paying one down to 3% and one down to $0 to utilize the AZEO.
The two pledge loans were both 2 years, one was for 5K and one for 2.5K.
4) The car was 15K, I don't have a hope of a SSL for that. However, like you said and like my guy said, come back in a year when my credit will be better (look how much it's increased since I got it as you mentioned) and re-finance it and that's 100% my strategy.
5) I believe I can get one more secured card from a local CU, and it'll be a $500 one. Worth it?
@Anonymous
In one of your threads, you mention and ex spouse. Is it possible that they could have been car shopping with your info? Identity theft is actually most common with family members and close acquaintances.
Ex's have all your information because you filed taxes together etc... I still have my ex's SSN memorized and we've been separated 10 years. (Im probably safe from him because he couldn't remember my birthday or our anniversary 😂)
As @USMC_Winger @mentioned, focus on building your relationship with Navy. Put all your direct deposits there. you don't even have to leave the money there. I send my direct deposit to Navy then move it to my local CU where all my bill pays come from... but just the fact that they are seeing consistent deposits will help.
Open one of their easy saver CDS and move 50 bucks a pay period in there and watch it grow. Use your secured cards instead of your debit cards and pay in full every month. In about 3-6 months of doing this, see if you might qualify for an auto refi to replace guido the loan shark. Then after 3-6 months of that, THEN try applying for an unsecured credit card with them.
Do not be even a minute late paying on anything with them. Study @philadelphia's post on the Navy thread to learn how to be the model Bavy member.
If you hang tight for a year doing this, I suspect Navy will start showing you love, the skies will open, angels will sing and you'll be on your way.
Good luck!
@Anonymous wrote:
4) The car was 15K, I don't have a hope of a SSL for that. However, like you said and like my guy said, come back in a year when my credit will be better (look how much it's increased since I got it as you mentioned) and re-finance it and that's 100% my strategy.
Sorry, I wasn't clear on the amount. A Navy Fed SSL of any amount, paid down to a balance below 9.5% will suffice for max FICO points on credit mix and aggregate installment loan utilization categories when you have no other open installment loans. For easy reference:
Thanks to @spikeman768, here's a list of the loan amounts required for each loan term length @ 2.25% APR:
$250-$500 - max 6 month term
$501-$1000 - max 12 month term
$1001-$1500 - max 18 month term
$1501-$2000 - max 24 month term
$2001-$3000 - max 36 month term
$3001+ - max 60 month term
And thanks to @folks19, here are the loan amounts required for longer loan term lengths @ 3.25% APR:
$25,000 minimum loan amount for 61 to 84 months
$30,000 minimum loan amount for 85 to 180 month
5) I believe I can get one more secured card from a local CU, and it'll be a $500 one. Worth it?
If it graduates to a "keeper," like the Navy Fed secure nRewards CC and Discover IT Secured CC, with a non-trivial CL that won't be bucketed in the low CLs, then it would be worth applying for AFTER you've cleaned up your CRs some more and improved your FICO scores. I don't know which FICO score your local CU uses for approval, but before applying, I would aim for the equivalent to a 640 or better FICO 8 score (which ranges from 300 to 850), so that you have very good chances of both approval and graduation within 1 year or so.
I'll post again later to respond to more of your post.
@Anonymous wrote:3) I've been trying to leverage my 6 year relationship with NFCU but it hasn't gone anywhere. I had the 2 SSL I completed. I also had a secured card for 2Y 3M that I closed out (stupid I know, but I was frustrated it never graduated). I always kept that one below 30% and didn't miss a payment. My current cards are 1 year 6 months and 1 year 0 months. I use both cards, and would pay them down to less than 5% before each statement. Now I'm paying one down to 3% and one down to $0 to utilize the AZEO.
The two pledge loans were both 2 years, one was for 5K and one for 2.5K.
The good news is you have perfect payment histories with 5 Navy Fed credit products and 21 months average payment history on each one. Keep up the good work!
But ... Navy Fed isn't just focusing on your Navy Fed credit transactions for some of your denial reasons, as I initially thought. Navy Fed checks our CRs every month to see how we're doing with our other credit accounts. The "not enough debt management or property owner experience" denial reason when you have credit accounts more than 11 years old and many accounts opened since then likely indicates "not enough POSITIVE debt management or property owner experience."
So, continue doing what you're doing: PFD and GW every adverse item you can, especially on your TU and EQ CRs, let the rest of the paid adverse items age off your CRs, and show positive debt management on all of your open credit accounts. Show Navy Fed that your financial problems are in the past, and they don't have to worry about not getting paid in the future by having perfect payment histories on all of your credit accounts (not just Navy Fed accounts) and no adverse items reporting for at least the recommended 2 years.
More good news is that Navy Fed uses FICO 9 scores to evaluate new CC applicants (using the TU CR) and graduate secured nRewards CC holders (using the EQ CR). Your paid 3rd-party collections don't negatively impact your FICO 9 scores.
Keep in mind that it's harder to graduate the nRewards CC than to get approved for a new Navy Fed CC, so expect to get approved for a 3rd Navy Fed CC before your nRewards CCs graduate. It appears that this is due to Navy Fed using 2 different computer algorithms to determine whether to graduate the secured nRewards CC and to approve new CCs.
More (future) good news is that you can request early exclusion (EE) of any adverse items on your CRs, 6 months early removal for TU, 3 months early for EX, and 1 month early for EQ.
Now, about the 3rd CC for the AZEO method: I've seen increased scores reported in the range of 6 to 30 points with FICO 8 scores, depending upon the credit profile. One of the FICO categories the AZEO method optimizes is percentage of revolving accounts with a balance. So, if you have only 2 bankcards (VISA, M/C, AMEX, and Discover) and one of them reports $0 and the other reports a small balance, you should expect to get a small score boost. You'll see the rest of the score boost when you add a 3rd CC and use the AZEO method, but it's not a whole lotta points more. That's why everyone is advising you to continue to clean up your CRs to raise your FICO scores, and not get stuck with sub-prime CCs to weigh down your chances of getting approved for better CCs with higher CLs in the future.
Don't kick yourself for closing out your first secured nRewards CC. Most importantly, it has a long, perfect payment history. Back then you didn't know what you needed to graduate. Now you do: perfect payment histories, get rid of as many adverse items on your CRs as possible, knowledge that Navy Fed is watching your CRs for new adverse items reporting, and the passage of time.
Hopefully, the good news cheers you up and helps you stay the course on your journey to good credit.
@designated_knitter wrote:@Anonymous
In one of your threads, you mention and ex spouse. Is it possible that they could have been car shopping with your info? Identity theft is actually most common with family members and close acquaintances.
Ex's have all your information because you filed taxes together etc... I still have my ex's SSN memorized and we've been separated 10 years. (Im probably safe from him because he couldn't remember my birthday or our anniversary 😂)
As @USMC_Winger @mentioned, focus on building your relationship with Navy. Put all your direct deposits there. you don't even have to leave the money there. I send my direct deposit to Navy then move it to my local CU where all my bill pays come from... but just the fact that they are seeing consistent deposits will help.
Open one of their easy saver CDS and move 50 bucks a pay period in there and watch it grow. Use your secured cards instead of your debit cards and pay in full every month. In about 3-6 months of doing this, see if you might qualify for an auto refi to replace guido the loan shark. Then after 3-6 months of that, THEN try applying for an unsecured credit card with them.
Do not be even a minute late paying on anything with them. Study @philadelphia's post on the Navy thread to learn how to be the model Bavy member.
If you hang tight for a year doing this, I suspect Navy will start showing you love, the skies will open, angels will sing and you'll be on your way.
Good luck!
Thank you for the extensive reply as well. To touch on a few of your points.
ive been a NFCU me ever since 2015 and do all my banking through them. Until last week I never had a second bank account. So DD has been with them since I opened the account.
also, that's exactly how I use my NFCU cards, and that's like a charge card essentially. I use them for everything. Then, a few days before my statement date, I make sure the balance is at 2-3%. And as mentioned now pay the second one down to 0%.
yes I fully plan on re-fi through them next year. Until then I will deff look into the cds. First time that's been mentioned to me so I'll absolutely be researching that. I'll also take a look at Philadelphia's post as well so I appreciate that point in the right direction.
@Anonymous, you probably already know this, but just in case you don't, the secure nRewards card graduates to the cashRewards card with 1.5% cash back. You only earn 1% cash back while your card is still secured, but at the time of graduation, whatever balance you have in points will be converted to 1.5 times as many points.
Just something else to look forward to as a reward for your hard work and patience. Good luck!
@USMC_Winger wrote:@Anonymous, you probably already know this, but just in case you don't, the secure nRewards card graduates to the cashRewards card with 1.5% cash back. You only earn 1% cash back while your card is still secured, but at the time of graduation, whatever balance you have in points will be converted to 1.5 times as many points.
Just something else to look forward to as a reward for your hard work and patience. Good luck!
That's kind of a cool feature, a retroactive point bump after graduation. The secured card I used last year paid 1% while secured, and then graduated to 3% for dining, 2% for groceries, and 1% for everything else, however, the cash rewards I earned in the six months my card was secured didn't grow.
Chapter 13:
I categorically refuse to do AZEO!
@USMC_Winger wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:3) I've been trying to leverage my 6 year relationship with NFCU but it hasn't gone anywhere. I had the 2 SSL I completed. I also had a secured card for 2Y 3M that I closed out (stupid I know, but I was frustrated it never graduated). I always kept that one below 30% and didn't miss a payment. My current cards are 1 year 6 months and 1 year 0 months. I use both cards, and would pay them down to less than 5% before each statement. Now I'm paying one down to 3% and one down to $0 to utilize the AZEO.
The two pledge loans were both 2 years, one was for 5K and one for 2.5K.The good news is you have perfect payment histories with 5 Navy Fed credit products and 21 months average payment history on each one. Keep up the good work!
But ... Navy Fed isn't just focusing on your Navy Fed credit transactions for some of your denial reasons, as I initially thought. Navy Fed checks our CRs every month to see how we're doing with our other credit accounts. The "not enough debt management or property owner experience" denial reason when you have credit accounts more than 11 years old and many accounts opened since then likely indicates "not enough POSITIVE debt management or property owner experience."
So, continue doing what you're doing: PFD and GW every adverse item you can, especially on your TU and EQ CRs, let the rest of the paid adverse items age off your CRs, and show positive debt management on all of your open credit accounts. Show Navy Fed that your financial problems are in the past, and they don't have to worry about not getting paid in the future by having perfect payment histories on all of your credit accounts (not just Navy Fed accounts) and no adverse items reporting for at least the recommended 2 years.
More good news is that Navy Fed uses FICO 9 scores to evaluate new CC applicants (using the TU CR) and graduate secured nRewards CC holders (using the EQ CR). Your paid 3rd-party collections don't negatively impact your FICO 9 scores.
Keep in mind that it's harder to graduate the nRewards CC than to get approved for a new Navy Fed CC, so expect to get approved for a 3rd Navy Fed CC before your nRewards CCs graduate. It appears that this is due to Navy Fed using 2 different computer algorithms to determine whether to graduate the secured nRewards CC and to approve new CCs.
More (future) good news is that you can request early exclusion (EE) of any adverse items on your CRs, 6 months early removal for TU, 3 months early for EX, and 1 month early for EQ.
Now, about the 3rd CC for the AZEO method: I've seen increased scores reported in the range of 6 to 30 points with FICO 8 scores, depending upon the credit profile. One of the FICO categories the AZEO method optimizes is percentage of revolving accounts with a balance. So, if you have only 2 bankcards (VISA, M/C, AMEX, and Discover) and one of them reports $0 and the other reports a small balance, you should expect to get a small score boost. You'll see the rest of the score boost when you add a 3rd CC and use the AZEO method, but it's not a whole lotta points more. That's why everyone is advising you to continue to clean up your CRs to raise your FICO scores, and not get stuck with sub-prime CCs to weigh down your chances of getting approved for better CCs with higher CLs in the future.
Don't kick yourself for closing out your first secured nRewards CC. Most importantly, it has a long, perfect payment history. Back then you didn't know what you needed to graduate. Now you do: perfect payment histories, get rid of as many adverse items on your CRs as possible, knowledge that Navy Fed is watching your CRs for new adverse items reporting, and the passage of time.
Hopefully, the good news cheers you up and helps you stay the course on your journey to good credit.
Thank you once again for the extensive reply. Yeah I'm trying to keep positive as I completely understand it's a marathon and not a sprint.
I did try and use my continued fight on debt in my reconsideration letter to NFCU and they did respond with "