PenFed SSL (Shared Secured loan)

[SlimShady66]

Sorry for the post after post.

Will acknwledge that a mortage didn't seem to operate the same way as an SSL.

In Oct 2023 was at 27% UTI on my mortgage, EX 847 / TU 850 / EQ 850

I thought for sure once I hit the below 9% UTI on mortgage I would get those extra 3 points on EX for the trifecta. Nope!

It is the only active installment loan I have

Currently I am at 4.8% UTI on mortgage and EX FICO8 didn't budge.

Now gents, I didn't pay down the mortgage to change my score, just want it off the plate. But I was keeping an eye on the scores as I past the below 9% threshold and surprised  EX score didn't muster up 3 additioal points.

Is what it is, I suppose.

[GZG]

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@SlimShady66 wrote:

Sorry for the post after post.

Will acknwledge that a mortage didn't seem to operate the same way as an SSL.

In Oct 2023 was at 27% UTI on my mortgage, EX 847 / TU 850 / EQ 850

I thought for sure once I hit the below 9% UTI on mortgage I would get those extra 3 points on EX for the trifecta. Nope!

It is the only active installment loan I have

Currently I am at 4.8% UTI on mortgage and EX FICO8 didn't budge.

Now gents, I didn't pay down the mortgage to change my score, just want it off the plate. But I was keeping an eye on the scores as I past the below 9% threshold and surprised  EX score didn't muster up 3 additioal points.

Is what it is, I suppose.

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mortgages have different utilization rules I think

[Thomas_Thumb]

I watched my 15 year mortgage as it dropped from 50% => 40%=>30%=>20%=>10%=>5% and down to 0. Fico 8 scores were stable all way and no score boosts anytime during the paydowns. In fact, my only TU bankcard Fico 8 900s happened to be when B/L ratio was in the 40% to 50% range.

Fico has stated explicitly that mortgages are categorized seperately. You will not find a magic score boost at a single digit utilization with a mortgage.

Why? Mortgages are long term installment loans and payment history is the key factor. Without a mortgage, low aggregate installment B/L comes into play as a scoring factor. With SSL and Auto loans the score boost at 9% has been well documented.

[SlimShady66]

Yes you must be correct aboout the mortgage loan being caluclated differently.

Even though I have a 15 year mortgage and will be paid in less five years, same effect as you indicatated.

Actually it was a 30yr term  for two years, then refi to 15yr term. However same effect once the new tradlines reached 6 to 12 months I believe.

Little flctuation in scores in general. I have taken hits 847 to 820ish going 30% UTI on one CC during the last 4 years a few times. Speficically EX. I was not paying a lot of attention to TU or EQ at the time.

My file is not thick, 10 or 11 accounts. Could be the reason for fluxuation considering your was retively stable, and I assume double the account load. Other than those three or four times hitting 30% on one CC, it was stable.

[Thomas_Thumb]

I'd consider a drop from 847 to 820 based on one card increasing to 30% UT rather substantial. If that is the only thing that changed on your file, your score was not stable with respect to moderate changes in card utilization. Perhaps you were on a new accounts scorecard with a new mortgage.

My last post about mortgages was they are evaluated differently with respect to remaining balance to loan ratio (sometimes referred to as installment utilization). If a mortgage is your only open loan and it has a long payment history - say 5 or more years - then you won't see the "big" score boost when B/L drops below 9%. The same would be true if you had multiple open loans with an open mortgage being part of the aggregate.

I would expect changing loan terms from 30 yr to 15 yr to close the original mortgage and reset payment history to zero for the revised mortgage. Yes?

FWIW - I have 5 open cards, one open AU card and one closed loan. The primary difference when my scores were bullet proof was the mortgage loan was open. Two or three closed cards and a prior closed mortgage fell off part way thru that time period.

Bullet proof Fico 8s 2015 -2020: 8-11 total accounts with 1 open mortgage.

Less stable Fico 8s 2021- present: 7 total accounts with mortgage closed.

[SlimShady66]

Fair enought Thomas

Have: 6 CC reporting 0 UT, 1 AU CC 0 UT which F8 ignores I believe, 1 active mortgage at 4.85 UT, it appears to be reporting as 13 months old even though it was transferred by lender. 

Closed: 2 mortgage loans (original and refi), 1 SS loan, 1 CC

AAoA: 9yrs 10 months

AOOA: 37yrs 10 months

Most resent account opened: 3yrs 4months

No baddies at all.

My score just dropped from F8 EX dropped from 847 to 824

I can only think because CC UT is reporting 0. Carzy huh?

The one thing different on my EQ and TU reports is the 1CC that is closed on EX, is reporting 3CC closed on EQ and TU (same card just different levels or changes).

Only thing I can think of that is significant difference between the two.

[SlimShady66]

1 year timeframe

[Horseshoez]

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@SlimShady66 wrote:

Fair enought Thomas

Have: 6 CC reporting 0 UT, 1 AU CC 0 UT which F8 ignores I believe, 1 active mortgage at 4.85 UT, it appears to be reporting as 13 months old even though it was transferred by lender. 

Closed: 2 mortgage loans (original and refi), 1 SS loan, 1 CC

AAoA: 9yrs 10 months

AOOA: 37yrs 10 months

Most resent account opened: 3yrs 4months

No baddies at all.

My score just dropped from F8 EX dropped from 847 to 824

I can only think because CC UT is reporting 0. Carzy huh?

The one thing different on my EQ and TU reports is the 1CC that is closed on EX, is reporting 3CC closed on EQ and TU (same card just different levels or changes).

Only thing I can think of that is significant difference between the two.

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Sounds like you just hit the dreaded All-Zero penalty.

[Thomas_Thumb]

^ Agreed. That drop is not a revolving utilization penalty. It is a "no recent revolving activity" penalty. Unfortunately many people get hit with this penalty even though they have monthly revolving activity.

A better method for accessing activity would be to look at monthly payment activity instead of statement balances being zero vs non zero. However, card issuers are not required to report payment details.

A transferred mortgage should retain payment history. My understanding is a refi with different terms would be a different mortgage that starts a new time clock.

My contention is a newbie mortgage may not add score stability. An older open mortgage due to its lengthy payment history would. Specifically score fluctuations associated with #/% of accounts with balances and revolving utilization get muted (personal experience). Impact of derogs, no recent revolving activity and inquiries are not muted. Not sure about impact of new credit.

AoOA = 40 yr, AAoA = 23 yr, AoYA = 11.5 yr

[SlimShady66]

Those are solid numbers Thomas,

I could get on board with the "no recent revolving activity", however,  I would like to see EQ and TX move somewhat similar to jump over.

Will see what they report next free score check. EX is just janky and wacky for me anyway. I say something is just different on EX report or their "calculation" to move to such degree on little to no change. I understand a penalty on "no reported actvity" or "concurrent 0 balance reporting", 10-15 points max, but 24 is just rediculous.

EX Jan 02 (847) - Drop Jan 10 to (837) - Drop Jan 27 (824)
TU 850 - As of Jan 20
EQ 849 - As of Jan 23