TU4 length of revolving accounts threshold found!

Anonymous · ‎03-17-2021

So I've had the same 2 negative reason statements on my TU4 score for what feels like years...

1 - Length of time accounts have been established

2 - Length of time revolving accounts have been established

I just noticed through my mortgage lender that my TU4 score updated (on 3/9/21) and for the first time the second negative reason statement has dropped off, leaving only the first one I mentioned above. In doing so, my score increased 1 point from 819 --> 820.

I feel very confident in saying that the factor that caused this change was my AoORA hitting 20 years on 3/1/21.

Anonymous · ‎03-17-2021

Congrats! On the milestone and figuring it out. 20 years is a long time and 1point? I'm sick of FICO...smh.

Anonymous · ‎03-17-2021

Yeah, 1 point isn't much. Proof though that a negative reason statement only needs to be worth a single Fico point to be present. It does make me wonder how much the top negative reason statement is worth. What's the top score possible on TU4 again? I know it's under 850, but can't remember exactly... maybe 835 or so? Whatever that top score is, has anyone ever reported hitting it, or is TU4 one of those models that's essentially impossible to get a perfect score on?

If it is possible to get a perfect TU4 score, I suppose whatever the top score is minus 820 could potentially be what my remaining negative reason statement is worth.

Anonymous · ‎03-18-2021

@Anonymous wrote:
Yeah, 1 point isn't much. Proof though that a negative reason statement only needs to be worth a single Fico point to be present. It does make me wonder how much the top negative reason statement is worth. What's the top score possible on TU4 again? I know it's under 850, but can't remember exactly... maybe 835 or so? Whatever that top score is, has anyone ever reported hitting it, or is TU4 one of those models that's essentially impossible to get a perfect score on?

If it is possible to get a perfect TU4 score, I suppose whatever the top score is minus 820 could potentially be what my remaining negative reason statement is worth.

@Anonymous wow congratulations that's a big find. AoORA maxes at 20 years. What was AAoRA? You know it is a two part Factor, you have to be above both.

I'd like to know where the threshold is for the first one too. Well now we've got something to add to the Primer. You can see the maximum for the mortgage Scores in my signature.

congrats! Seems like 1 point is a little cheap.

Anonymous · ‎03-18-2021

19 points.

Curious_George2 · ‎03-18-2021

@Anonymous wrote:
Yeah, 1 point isn't much. Proof though that a negative reason statement only needs to be worth a single Fico point to be present. It does make me wonder how much the top negative reason statement is worth. What's the top score possible on TU4 again? I know it's under 850, but can't remember exactly... maybe 835 or so? Whatever that top score is, has anyone ever reported hitting it, or is TU4 one of those models that's essentially impossible to get a perfect score on?

If it is possible to get a perfect TU4 score, I suppose whatever the top score is minus 820 could potentially be what my remaining negative reason statement is worth.

Congrats! And thanks for sharing.

I'm not sure I share the conclusion bolded above. Isn't it also possible you just went from, say, a 5 point penalty to a 4 point penalty and the rule is that factors are suppressed if they cost less than 5 points?

I'm pulling those specific numbers out of thin air, but can we really rule out the possibility that you are still getting a penalty that is one point lower than it was at AoORA<20?

K-in-Boston · ‎03-18-2021

FICO Risk Score Classic 04 range is 309-839.

Anonymous · ‎03-18-2021

@Curious_George2 wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Yeah, 1 point isn't much. Proof though that a negative reason statement only needs to be worth a single Fico point to be present. It does make me wonder how much the top negative reason statement is worth. What's the top score possible on TU4 again? I know it's under 850, but can't remember exactly... maybe 835 or so? Whatever that top score is, has anyone ever reported hitting it, or is TU4 one of those models that's essentially impossible to get a perfect score on?

If it is possible to get a perfect TU4 score, I suppose whatever the top score is minus 820 could potentially be what my remaining negative reason statement is worth.
Congrats! And thanks for sharing.

I'm not sure I share the conclusion bolded above. Isn't it also possible you just went from, say, a 5 point penalty to a 4 point penalty and the rule is that factors are suppressed if they cost less than 5 points?

I'm pulling those specific numbers out of thin air, but can we really rule out the possibility that you are still getting a penalty that is one point lower than it was at AoORA<20?

@Curious_George2 i've never heard a theory before about a reason code only appearing if it's worth 5+ points. Is there any documentation for anything like that?

Anonymous · ‎03-18-2021

@Anonymous wrote:

@Anonymous wow congratulations that's a big find. AoORA maxes at 20 years. What was AAoRA? You know it is a two part Factor, you have to be above both.

I'd like to know where the threshold is for the first one too. Well now we've got something to add to the Primer. You can see the maximum for the mortgage Scores in my signature.

congrats! Seems like 1 point is a little cheap.

Good call on AAoRA; that moved from 6y11m to 7y0m. That could be a threshold point as well, so tough to tell. The good news is that in the next month or two I plan on opening up a couple of revolvers, which will drop me back down to 6yXm AAoRA, but AoORA will still be > 20 years of course. If the reason code stays away, it proves AAoRA can be under 7 years. If it returns, it means 7 years was the threshold and not 20 years AoORA after all. Good call on look at both pieces of that negative reason statement.

Actually on second thought, I'm going to go back and recalculate AAoRA and report back. I have 1 revolver on EX that isn't on TU/EQ and I can't remember if that shift from 6y11m --> 7y0m was on EX or on the other 2B. If it was on EX, I would have already been over 7 years on TU before 3/1/21.

Anonymous · ‎03-18-2021

@Anonymous wrote:
@Curious_George2 i've never heard a theory before about a reason code only appearing if it's worth 5+ points. Is there any documentation for anything like that?

That is something new to me as well. My understanding was always that if a negative reason code goes away, that means that factor is no longer impacting your score adversely at all. By go away I should clarify that means there's no chance of that code being there (on a profile like mine) since there are only a couple of codes. On a weaker profile that has 4 codes visible at all times, there can be adverse scoring impact codes that aren't visible (5th slot, 6th slot, etc) but they're still of course impacting score.