Understanding Late Payments

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

I came across a post where somebody was breaking down how lates work and how the score impact decreases over time as a percentage for each one, 30 60 and 90 but now I cannot find it for the life of me, I did a google search but the wording I'm using doesnt bring it up, does somebody have that info please?

bettercreditguy1 · ‎05-10-2017

basically one 30 or one 60 day late fades fast and does not materially impact your score after two years. (it can be less time than that if you have a thick file, no bk, charge offs, or collections). A single 90 day late will impact your scores upto 7 1/2 years as it is in a similiar bucket to bankruptcy, tax liens, etc. With one 30 day late and an otherwise clean file, you can obtain and enter the 800 plus club. Good luck in your journey as Fico does not rebucket you into a dirty bucket for scoring purposes with one late.

Updated scores 3/7/21 TU 849, EQ 829, Ex 818 (all Fico scores) Remember the Three P's: Pay early in Full, Pay on Time, Patience

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

Also, as another data point I don't believe anyone with a 90+ day late present on their report has reported a FICO 08 score above the 760's.

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

So if a 60 behaves like a 30 could you still enter 800 with one of each? I have them back to back on an installment and they are in their last quarter before turning 2 years old.

I was denied a GW letter when the account was alive maybe I should try another one now that it has been PIF for over 6 months.

Revelate · ‎05-10-2017

I don't believe the hype regarding lates fading and no longer counting.

They may count less, but they are still a negative mark and they still relegate you to dirty scorecard... the maximum score possible in that bucket may not reach 800; I know this is the case with 30/60D lates past the 6 year mark just based on my own file as the #1 reason code was still missed payments after my tax lien wandered away temporarily. I don't think that it's possible under FICO 8 or FICO 04 or earlier to hit 800 with a late, though we did get one report on FICO 8 of a 790ish score with a 90D late nearing exclusion but that wasn't confirmed and the quality of the data is unknown (tradeline could've been in dispute for example, no reason codes got posted IIRC).

Also the fact that I apparently switched scorecards on EX on probably every model (FICO 9, 8, 04 maybe, 98) when my lates were completely excluded and just the tax lien is reported, they were still factoring up until the day they got whacked.

It's something I'm going to look at when my truly stupid 30D late sitting only on TU ages and that's the only negative outside of unpretty installment utilization on that file and I expect the file to stay like that for a while outside of a possible mortgage app sometime next year.

ETA: 30/60D lates are in a different category than PR's and I wouldn't bet on a 90D being different either personally: I'm not certain that scorecard assignment is determined by severity, and I suspect it is likely by type.

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

@Anonymous wrote:
So if a 60 behaves like a 30 could you still enter 800 with one of each? I have them back to back on an installment and they are in their last quarter before turning 2 years old.

It depends. If they are back to back, that's really 1 late payment. For example, if your report shows in January you were 30 days late and in February you were 60 days late, that 60 day late is just the 30 day late from January going another month. My understanding has always been that in a string of lates, it is viewed and scored based on the last, most severe level of lateness. Now, if you had a 60 day late on the account and then months later had a 30 day late on the same account (or a different account, for that matter) it would be viewed as 2 different delinquencies. The more you have present on your reports, the more of a history you are showing you have with late payments which of course looks worse under manual review. Interestingly, though, the additional of more late payments usually doesn't impact score all that much as the biggest hit is taken when the first delinquency lands on your report. This also goes for the removal of late payments. If you have several present, there have been reports of one being removed resulting in anything from 0 to 1 to 5-10 points, which doesn't seem significant... where when the final late payment comes off, depending on it's severity, one can see an increase of 30-40 points or even upwards of 100.

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

@Revelate wrote:
I don't believe the hype regarding lates fading and no longer counting.

They may count less, but they are still a negative mark and they still relegate you to dirty scorecard

Every time my file is updated I have the "serious delinquency" remark and that has been consistent throughout so I'm to starting doubt it myself, that sucks.. the only consolation is that EQ doesnt report it.

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

@Anonymous wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
So if a 60 behaves like a 30 could you still enter 800 with one of each? I have them back to back on an installment and they are in their last quarter before turning 2 years old.

It depends. If they are back to back, that's really 1 late payment. For example, if your report shows in January you were 30 days late and in February you were 60 days late, that 60 day late is just the 30 day late from January going another month. My understanding has always been that in a string of lates, it is viewed and scored based on the last, most severe level of lateness. Now, if you had a 60 day late on the account and then months later had a 30 day late on the same account (or a different account, for that matter) it would be viewed as 2 different delinquencies. The more you have present on your reports, the more of a history you are showing you have with late payments which of course looks worse under manual review. Interestingly, though, the additional of more late payments usually doesn't impact score all that much as the biggest hit is taken when the first delinquency lands on your report. This also goes for the removal of late payments. If you have several present, there have been reports of one being removed resulting in anything from 0 to 1 to 5-10 points, which doesn't seem significant... where when the final late payment comes off, depending on it's severity, one can see an increase of 30-40 points or even upwards of 100.

I hope this is the case and my 60 day doesnt cap me, I would feel much better though if I saw living proof that 800s can be achieved with back to back 30 and 60.

Revelate · ‎05-10-2017

@Anonymous wrote:
@Revelate wrote:
I don't believe the hype regarding lates fading and no longer counting.

They may count less, but they are still a negative mark and they still relegate you to dirty scorecard

Every time my file is updated I have the "serious delinquency" remark and that has been consistent throughout so I'm to starting doubt it myself, that sucks.. the only consolation is that EQ doesnt report it.

That's a handy bureau to not have it on as a lot of CU's are EQ only. How bad are your lates and from when?

For some comparison from my files:

With lien I had this on an EX 8 with 30/60 lates 6+ year old, and all earlier models: You have missed payments or derogatory indicators on your credit accounts, almost always at the bottom of the list.

Without the lien that went straight to #1 reason code on FICO 8, #2 on FICO 9 models, and still near the bottom on FICO 04 and earlier.

Transunion with a more recent <2 year old 30D and the 2010 30/60 lates: You recently missed a payment or had a derogatory indicator reported on your credit report. On virtually every model.

So reduced damage as a function of age I can see assuming reason codes are 1:1 between bureaus which AFAIK they are, since at least for my file there's some age boundary and presumably recent lates is a worst negative than missed payments anywhere, but it doesn't stop counting altogether. I'll try to take note of when my 30D stops being recent and switches to the other reason code.

Anonymous · ‎05-10-2017

Revelate wrote:

That's a handy bureau to not have it on as a lot of CU's are EQ only. How bad are your lates and from when?

Yup it's a big consolation. I have a 30 and a 60 back to back for the months of Aug and Sep 2015 on an installment auto loan that was PIF Jun 2016.

This remark is #1 for every FICO version on both TU and EX: "You have a serious delinquency (60 days past due or greater) or derogatory indicator on your credit report."

This other remark varies in position but it's also present on many versions on both TU and EX as well: "You recently missed a payment or had a derogatory indicator reported on your credit report."

The other remarks are AAoA and Util related, at which point does a new account stop triggering this remark? "You opened a new credit account relatively recently."