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Valued Member
demitasse03
Posts: 46
Registered: ‎06-16-2007
0

Capital One won't pay/update CR

I have two issues going on with Capital One: 1. I have been paying their agent, Mann Bracken LLC, monthly on a 2005 judgment. I recently did some calculations and found that I'd overpaid them by almost $300. I sent them a letter via CMRRR indicating the overpayment, detailing every payment that had been made on this account. In response, they sent me a copy of a notice sent to the District Court indicating that this debt is now paid in full. I called them to discuss the small matter of the money they owe me and they started with their tactics - taunting, condescending, telling me to provide "validation" (i.e., check copies). 2. Given the fact that they at least acknowledged that the debt is paid in full, I disputed the past due item on my CR. The results came back as the same -- they show that I owe them $64. Any ideas how to approach regaining my $$ and getting this item properly updated on my CR? I can't wait to get this CapOne monkey off my back!!! Thanks.
Senior Contributor
Noah_Bodie
Posts: 4,635
Registered: ‎03-11-2007
0

Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR

First, PIF will simply report as a paid collection. You won't have any FICO score gain once it's reported as paid.
 
When you called, did you talk with Mann Bracken or Cap 1?
 
What state are you in? That's important in terms of what you can do next.
 
Valued Member
demitasse03
Posts: 46
Registered: ‎06-16-2007
0

Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR

I would be happy with the PIF showing as a paid collection - that is what I'm shooting for. I contacted Mann Bracken about the overpayment, but disputed the CapOne item on my CR. I live in Texas. Thanks in advance for your thoughts.
Senior Contributor
Noah_Bodie
Posts: 4,635
Registered: ‎03-11-2007
0

Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR

You wouldn't be happy with a paid collection for the next several years adversely affecting your credit.
 
Being in Texas, that's good news. First, you can record your phone calls with the CA, and you don't have to notify them or get their permission. Texas is what's known as a One Party State for the recording of calls.
 
If they are abusive, harassing or threatening when you talk with them, that's good news for you. You can pick up a telephone recording device, hook it up, and record your conversations with Mann Bracken.
 
I would call them, late at night when no one will answer, and leave a message asking them to call you at home regarding the account. When they call back the next day or two, switch on the recorder, and don't tell them you are recording. You don't have to tell them, so don't. This way they will mouth off in their usual abusive manner.
 
Try to get at least 3 different calls on tape. Same tactic. You call them, and try to get them to call you.
 
Get 3 calls on tape, with abuse, profanity, harassment, threats, and that's gold. Contact a consumer lawyer near you at either naca.net or myfaircredit.com
 
The abusive call is a FDCPA violation, and their choices are either:
A) Go to court, lose, pay you and your lawyer's bill
B) Delete the collection, and possibly still pay you
 
Valued Member
demitasse03
Posts: 46
Registered: ‎06-16-2007
0

Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR

You wouldn't be happy with a paid collection for the next several years adversely affecting your credit.
So, a paid collection is bad? I am new to all of this, and this concept doesn't seem logical, but I'm definitely open to learning. How can a paid collection/CO be any worse than an unpaid one? Great advice regarding recording calls. Also, what do you think about the idea of filing suit now. Do you think I'd get a favorable response (i.e, settling outside of court) based on my having evidence of payment? Thanks for your help.
Senior Contributor
Noah_Bodie
Posts: 4,635
Registered: ‎03-11-2007
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Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR



demitasse03 wrote:
So, a paid collection is bad? I am new to all of this, and this concept doesn't seem logical, but I'm definitely open to learning. How can a paid collection/CO be any worse than an unpaid one?


Yes, a paid collection is no better than an unpaid collection. I know. It does not seem logical.
 
I'm sure a couple of others will pipe up and say no-no, paid collection is far better than an unpaid collection.
 
I know from personal experience with 2 paid collections that your FICO scores don't improve. Immediately or over time. I've talked to dozens of folks over on CIC (one of the ECRFOWWMNS) who have paid collections and they saw no FICO score increase when it got paid. Some have even reported seeing small score DECREASES after a collection was paid. I've also talked to a number of people who've gotten paid collections removed, through various means, and their scores improved noticeably.
 
ECRFOWWMNS = 'Evil' Credit Repair Forums Of Whom We May Not Speak
 
Senior Contributor
Noah_Bodie
Posts: 4,635
Registered: ‎03-11-2007
0

Re: Capital One won't pay/update CR

[ Edited ]


demitasse03 wrote:
Great advice regarding recording calls. Also, what do you think about the idea of filing suit now. Do you think I'd get a favorable response (i.e, settling outside of court) based on my having evidence of payment?

You could possibly win if you filed now. But, this isn't the area of law where I practice--mostly because I'm not a lawyer.
 
Standard of proof is preponderance of evidence, not beyond a reasonable doubt. You don't need DNA or fingerprint evidence. The judge simply has to believe you more than the other person.
 
If you show a judge correspondence showing the amount that was agreed to be paid, or an old credit report showing the collection with the full amount when it was first reported, you have pretty solid proof for the amount owed. This way, the CA cannot lie and claim, "No-no, your honor, demitasse owed us another $64." Well, they could lie and they probably will, but the judge will then ask them for any correspondence showing a balance owed of $64 more than what you've paid to date.
 
If you've gone thru payments, canceled checks, bank statements, what have you, and confirmed the amount paid, then you've established how much was to be paid and how much was paid. The overpayment is rather solidly documented.
 
You could sue and win the $300 overpayment. But, if you catch 'em in violation on tape, that's worth a $1000 to you (under the FDCPA) plus attorney's fees. A consumer lawyer would want to talk with you if you catch them in violation on tape. The CA will very likely wanna delete the collection, and perhaps pay you a little something, to avoid going to court.
 
What they say is what's important. I've heard about cases where CAs threatened to put people in jail, they were recorded, and the person's lawyer began negotiations with the CA starting at $250K to settle. Settlement for less was certainly agreed to, but it still would likely be very substantial money.
 
Someone's gonna say, "C'mon Noah, that's B.S. No CAs ever threaten to put people in jail."
 
Oh yeah. Tell that to the Maine AG who sued Lenahan Law Offices for just such a thing.
 
 
Here's the law on the subject.
 
 
15 USC 1692d
 
A debt collector may not engage in any conduct the natural consequence of which is to harass, oppress, or abuse any person in connection with the collection of a debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:
(1) The use or threat of use of violence or other criminal means to harm the physical person, reputation, or property of any person.
(2) The use of obscene or profane language or language the natural consequence of which is to abuse the hearer or reader.
(3) The publication of a list of consumers who allegedly refuse to pay debts, except to a consumer reporting agency or to persons meeting the requirements of section 1681a(f) or 1681b(3) of this title.
(4) The advertisement for sale of any debt to coerce payment of the debt.
(5) Causing a telephone to ring or engaging any person in telephone conversation repeatedly or continuously with intent to annoy, abuse, or harass any person at the called number.
(6) Except as provided in section 1692b of this title, the placement of telephone calls without meaningful disclosure of the caller's identity.
 
http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/ts_search.pl?title=15&sec=1692e
 
15 USC 1692e
 
A debt collector may not use any false, deceptive, or misleading representation or means in connection with the collection of any debt. Without limiting the general application of the foregoing, the following conduct is a violation of this section:
(1) The false representation or implication that the debt collector is vouched for, bonded by, or affiliated with the United States or any State, including the use of any badge, uniform, or facsimile thereof.
(2) The false representation of -
(A) the character, amount, or legal status of any debt; or
(B) any services rendered or compensation which may be lawfully received by any debt collector for the collection of a debt.
(3) The false representation or implication that any individual is an attorney or that any communication is from an attorney.
(4) The representation or implication that nonpayment of any debt will result in the arrest or imprisonment of any person or the seizure, garnishment, attachment, or sale of any property or wages of any person unless such action is lawful and the debt collector or creditor intends to take such action.
(5) The threat to take any action that cannot legally be taken or that is not intended to be taken.
(6) The false representation or implication that a sale, referral, or other transfer of any interest in a debt shall cause the consumer to -
(A) lose any claim or defense to payment of the debt; or
(B) become subject to any practice prohibited by this subchapter.
(7) The false representation or implication that the consumer committed any crime or other conduct in order to disgrace the consumer.
(8) Communicating or threatening to communicate to any person credit information which is known or which should be known to be false, including the failure to communicate that a disputed debt is disputed.
(9) The use or distribution of any written communication which simulates or is falsely represented to be a document authorized, issued, or approved by any court, official, or agency of the United States or any State, or which creates a false impression as to its source, authorization, or approval.
(10) The use of any false representation or deceptive means to collect or attempt to collect any debt or to obtain information concerning a consumer.
(11) The failure to disclose in the initial written communication with the consumer and, in addition, if the initial communication with the consumer is oral, in that initial oral communication, that the debt collector is attempting to collect a debt and that any information obtained will be used for that purpose, and the failure to disclose in subsequent communications that the communication is from a debt collector, except that this paragraph shall not apply to a formal pleading made in connection with a legal action.
(12) The false representation or implication that accounts have been turned over to innocent purchasers for value.
(13) The false representation or implication that documents are legal process.
(14) The use of any business, company, or organization name other than the true name of the debt collector's business, company, or organization.
(15) The false representation or implication that documents are not legal process forms or do not require action by the consumer.
(16) The false representation or implication that a debt collector operates or is employed by a consumer reporting agency as defined by section 1681a(f) of this title.


Message Edited by Noah_Bodie on 07-04-2007 11:29 PM

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