Amex getting tougher on SUBS

[Kforce]

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@simplynoir wrote:

I think if you're a regular customer but you churn a card or two I *think* you should be okay staying off AMEX's radar but man that statement on their T&C is a real blanket statement to cover pretty much everything. Imagine applying for a card and them giving a generic "you're not eligible" statement like when banks give denials for CLIs. This is going to be interesting to say the least with future datapoints.

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+1

[simplynoir]

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@red259 wrote:

This language is confusing. When are they going to decide if you can have the SUB? After you have made all the required spend? If they don't want to give somebody another card fine or warn the person in advance they won't get the bonus. If its a situation where Amex is denying points after the spend is made then that crosses a major line. 

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That's my concern right there. I don't care that they're targetting a segement of their customer base that is not profitable (churners) but that sentence makes me feel uneasy regardless.

[Anonymous]

I somehow doubt that this new language is intended to deny "regular" cardmembers getting bonuses. With the massive amount of data that Amex has, it should be fairly easy to keep them out of the crossfire previously mentioned. Lenders are in the business of making profits, and developing a reputation as SUB deniers would send people flying to the competition, which is already stiff.

 I think (hope?) that this language is intended to give churners a clear heads up that their applications will be scrutinized, and Amex is covering their bases. Thankfully they are not doing wholesale account closures ala Chase and others.

Edit: Agree that denying SUB after spend is complete without prior notice would be concerning.

[Anonymous]

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@K-in-Boston wrote:

Big and bold now at the top of the offer terms:

... We may also consider the number of American Express Cards you have opened and closed as well as other factors in making a decision on your welcome offer eligibility.

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I think the terms are written poorly. The terms are extremely broad. If the bonus offer is advertised, you pay it or provide straight foward terms about who's ineligible. You don't make the cardholder guess, or wait until they reach the minimum spend before giving them the bad news. 

The new terms allow AMEX to make up an excuse to get out of paying the bonus. "You opened your one and only card with us two months ago, so we're not giving you the bonus for this card." 

[Gollum]

*shrug*

I just got charged my first annual fee ($95) for my Blue Cash Preferred.  I'll probably switch back to the Blue Cash Everyday eventually, but since they gave me a $250 sign-up bonus (SUB) for the BCP, I figure it's fair to keep/use the BCP until after I've been charged for two annual fees.

[JustcallmeTM]

I'm not worrried. The language is pretty simple to my understanding. They just eyeballing the things that have been explained in detail on the work around on applying, upgrading downgrading and etc... The same rules that people explain on here or on site in pure detail is what they are going to attack its that simple. 

This is what they are eyeing:

Open lowest card(ED,BCE,Delta, Hilton,etc..) for SUB and proceed to upgrade for SUB again. Close card. 

Since everyone knows you can double dip in this regard with annual fee cards.

Open next highest level card for SUB and then proceed to downgrade or close card. 

Find apps with no language for SUB and then proceed to downgrade or close. 

7/10 times its always within 12-13 months of having the card open to either avoid the charge altogether or to get a refund of the fee, it's like clockwork not just here but all these sites to find info. 

Let's keep it real, I read alot of posts, sounds like most on here who are frequent or these sites like DofC and find the same talk on there down even on the bottom from people who reply. 

If one opened a card like BCP/EDP or any of the top cards for the SUB and just for the SUB and have no plan to use it and toss it in the SD or downgrade, then yeah these are the ones they eyeballing. Same if they see you have opened all of there cards at one points milked all the SUBS and somehow your still getting them just to never keep the card or keep downgrading or closing then yeah I would keep tabs on you also. Most on here and alot of other sites just want the SUB but are die hard Chase lovers so they dont put spend on those cards after SUB has been milked.

Fair game from how I see it. People should know if they should mess with Amex again or not. If you had the SUB before and going to apply again because there was no language then your putting yourself out there. Same with those who upgrade just to downgrade within 12-13 months, that is a dead giveaway.

So the language to me isn't hard to accept, it's that there are those already trying to find a work around on the language to continue milking the cow that doesnt want to be milked. 

[JustcallmeTM]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@K-in-Boston wrote:

Big and bold now at the top of the offer terms:

... We may also consider the number of American Express Cards you have opened and closed as well as other factors in making a decision on your welcome offer eligibility.

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I think the terms are written poorly. The terms are extremely broad. If the bonus offer is advertised, you pay it or provide straight foward terms about who's ineligible. You don't make the cardholder guess, or wait until they reach the minimum spend before giving them the bad news. 

The new terms allow AMEX to make up an excuse to get out of paying the bonus. "You opened your one and only card with us two months ago, so we're not giving you the bonus for this card." 

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This is the where people got over on Amex. Just send them the codeID of the application and if it has the no language offer they had no choice. This language they added doesnt kill it off completely, what it does is keep the churners or abusers away. If you used the no language app they will know how many times, all applications have a code on it that will let them bring up the app with the offer that was presented. 

Learned this when my wife recieved a no language Delta offer for 60k and she had closed her Delta 6 months prior when she left her company that used Delta to fly to HQ. In short she never recieved the 60k and on chat they asked for the codeID on the app she used once I gave them that they found it and gave her the 60k points.

You see what they are trying to stop now. As long as there is no language that they can claw back the SUB in some form they had to give up the points, now they can scrutinze handing out SUBS just be prepared if your a churner or abuser to explain or have all the card shut.

[Anonymous]

While I am in no way a churner, or SUB chaser. I likely would not have applied for the PRG or Gold Delta if there hadn't been any SUB.

I'm curious if they'll deny any new SUB if you aren't utilizing your current cards in a way they feel it benfits them?

Not that I SD'd them, but I definitely don't use them exclusively. I feel like a schmuck pulling out the PRG to pay for a Mocha, feels like overkill. lol

[simplynoir]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Not that I SD'd them, but I definitely don't use them exclusively. I feel like a schmuck pulling out the PRG to pay for a Mocha, feels like overkill. lol

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What a curious feeling there lol. I don't feel the same when I use a card like the Platinum to pay for a bag of chips.

[MrDisco99]

So how am I supposed to know if I’m eligible for a bonus or not? I’m supposed to just app and hope for the best and just assume it’s my fault if they decide not to award me?

Oh well... it was fun while it lasted.