Apple Store CC Policy

[flyingmd]

Hi All,

Was up in NY this weekend and went shopping in the Apple Store at Palisades Mall. Was about 1200$ in merchanside. Went to pay with my AMEX and the sales girl looked at my card, saw it was unsigned and asked me if I wouldn't mind signing the card. I said no, but I would happily show her ID. She stated that the new law makes an unsigned credit card invalid and that she would not take the card. I asked to see the manager who confirmed that that is their policy (for all NY stores?), based upon the "new cc laws" required them to only take a signed credit card, regardless of ID. I was so pissed off I told them to take the merchandise and shove it, that I would go pick up what I needed at best buy, which of course took the unsigned cc and asked for ID, which I glady showed. Is this against American Expresses (or VISA/MC for that matter) merchant agreement? I geuss any store can refuse to sell anything to anyone (as long as it isn't discrimminatory) but is this a valid law??? I am un aware of it and fairly certain it is against the merchant agreement with the major CC issuers. Anybody have a similar experience?

[Creditaddict]

I would have asked them to kindly get American Express on the phone or perhaps corporate... I bet if you write e-mail to President of Apple and CC American Express you will get some very grouchy people at both companies for loosing that sale!!!

The only other company that I know of that does this and gets away with it is USPS... but I have signed them on the spot... I mean it really does not matter to me signed or unsigned... either way if stolen I don't feel like theives have any issues using the card based on it not being signed which seems to be the reason I hear most of why people don't want them signed.

[Anonymous]

I don't know about you guys, but any credit or debit card I've ever had specifically states "Card not valid unless signed".

[tsquad131]

its true techinally the card is not valid unless its signed and also in the visa/mc merchant agreements they are not supposed to ask for ID either because that is against their merchant agreement and can have their contract revoked for accepting that card if they violate that

[Anonymous]

I've heard of peole writing "please see ID" on the back instead of signing. Mostly, all of my cards are still unsigened though.

I have no problem signing the cards, just lazy. Really from an ID theft and privacy standpoint I should sign them. Clerks and such have no reason to know my b-day, and other personal identifiers listed on them.

As a side note, I get a huge kick out of the clerks in Europe asking to see my ID when presenting them with an unsigned card. How can they tell a fraudulent US state drivers license from a legitimate one, most clerks/bouncers here can't.

[bostonte]

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@tsquad131 wrote:

its true techinally the card is not valid unless its signed and also in the visa/mc merchant agreements they are not supposed to ask for ID either because that is against their merchant agreement and can have their contract revoked for accepting that card if they violate that

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No, that's not what it says in the agreement.

It says they can't "require" ID. They can ask. You can refuse. Then they have to follow suspicious card activty procedures if that is what they suspect, or continue processing the transaction as normal if they were just asking for no particular reason. If they do ask, and you choose to present, they are supposed to verify the ID matches.

That same agreement also prohibits them from accepting an unsigned card. If you are presented with one you are to ask for proof of ID and have the customer sign the card in front of you. Then proceed with the transaction. Whether or not merchants chose to do this is like most other things a YMMV situation -- but they are supposed to.

To the OP: what is the point of an unsigned card? So when you forget it someplace a theif just has to sign the back and not worry about merchants asking for ID because the signatures will match everyplace they check? I don't see how it can help you, but I admit I may be missing something.

What's worse is "ASK FOR ID" -- I get this all the time at my business, and then probably more than half of the customers who write this on their cards get snippy when one of my employees asks for ID and they demand to speak to me to "report them for violating Visa agreements by asking for ID". It's so frequent and absurd that it's got to be part of some scam that I don't understand. If you write "ASK FOR ID", aren't you requesting and expecting to be asked?

[clocktick]

Nice, I go to the Palisades Mall often.  I had no idea their Apple store would do that.  I am just curious why you simply didn't sign the card?  Was it based on principle that it's your card and you don't have to sign?

Just wondering.  Also, did you get a better deal in Best Buy?

[Anonymous]

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@flyingmd wrote:

Hi All,

Was up in NY this weekend and went shopping in the Apple Store at Palisades Mall. Was about 1200$ in merchanside. Went to pay with my AMEX and the sales girl looked at my card, saw it was unsigned and asked me if I wouldn't mind signing the card. I said no, but I would happily show her ID. She stated that the new law makes an unsigned credit card invalid and that she would not take the card. I asked to see the manager who confirmed that that is their policy (for all NY stores?), based upon the "new cc laws" required them to only take a signed credit card, regardless of ID. I was so pissed off I told them to take the merchandise and shove it, that I would go pick up what I needed at best buy, which of course took the unsigned cc and asked for ID, which I glady showed. Is this against American Expresses (or VISA/MC for that matter) merchant agreement? I geuss any store can refuse to sell anything to anyone (as long as it isn't discrimminatory) but is this a valid law??? I am un aware of it and fairly certain it is against the merchant agreement with the major CC issuers. Anybody have a similar experience?

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You are wrong, the card is not valid unless signed. Also it's hilarious to me that you would offer to show your ID when you know you are yourself. What is the point in that? Sign your cards.

Also what is wrong with you that you would get pissed off because the employee followed policy.

[tsquad131]

they frown upon merchants asking for ID and discourage from doing that

[john398]

I know this was reguarding american express but visa spefically tells the merchant have the customer sign the card

Dealing with unsigned cards

If the signature panel is left blank.

1. Request a signature. Ask the cardholder to sign the card and provide current government identification, such as a driver's license or passport (if local law permits).
2. Check the signature. Be sure that the cardholder signature on the transaction receipt matches the one on the card and the additional identification.
3. Complete the transaction. If the signatures appear reasonably the same and the authorization request is approved, continue the transaction. If the cardholder refuses to sign the card, do not accept the card.

http://usa.visa.com/merchants/risk_management/card_present.html