Which AMEX card should I apply for? (Warning: myFICO noobie!)

[Anonymous]

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@09Lexie wrote:
OP, I understand that you want to work on personal credit before business. I think the concern stated by other posters was running business charges through the personal account ESP with Amex. It is expressly forbidden and could cause your new Amex accounts to be closed.

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Okay, now that I'm starting to see that I think i will go ahead and do a business AMEX and try to get the platinum after the house is done in the fall and everything is closed on. A business card application shows on my personal right? Does a business have a FICO score or something like that which I can check on regularly?

[Anonymous]

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@scenery_guy wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@scenery_guy wrote:

Orlando Profit,

I'm a bit confused with your situation. Can you tell me where you bank? Surely with gross sales in the neighborhood of 2.4MM (200K x 12) someone at the branch has tried to discuss business credit with you in the past. If you are running about 1.3MM per year on a debit card (25K x 52 weeks) you should have the branch manager calling you to discuss moving you into a level of service that represents your level of deposits with the branch and the bank.  I know when I tried to make a $10,000 business debit card purchase BofA shut me down and called my cell phone for confirmation. Your banker has failed you.

Also your accountant has failed you too (by lack of advice on business credit services) but that's an entirely different conversation. 

How can you not qualify for an auto loan for a 2012 e350 yet qualify for a <5% down mortgage on a $410,000 house with a 647-667 FICO? Who is financing the house? 

Sorry in advance, I am not trying to be disrespectful to you at all. I just ran those numbers and kept scratching my head. In reality you need to be talking to your banker as they should be able to take care of your business credit needs. If they can't find a new bank. I would suggest Chase if you are in an area with offices. 

Amex is a ways away for you, and once you do start with them that will certainly not accommodate that level of spending for quite some time (business or personal), even with weekly payments (which is ridiculous in the first place). 

If you want more advice on business credit post a thread in the business credit area. Love to see you there.

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When I was buying the Mercedes April of 2012 my median credit was 505. Now my Experian shows as 680. The other two show as 660 and 650. My FICO shows as 647. So my credit went up a lot since the whole car thing.

Also, my business account is at Bank of America. They call me about every two days trying to get me to sign up for different stuff and business credit cards, but I don't really want to because I want to work on personal credit more than business credit.

As for my CPA, she's done very well for me. She has not failed me in any regard. She offers me advice, but I am stubborn and as I said above I do not want to work on business credit stuff, but instead personal credit. Perhaps I should add business credit related things into the mix.

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All I can give you is my opinion based on my experiences as a business owner. I'll keep it somewhat brief. If you want more advice or info please ask.

I think you are going at this backwards. Your greatest asset is your business. You need to leverage that to benifit you personally. How is your company structured (S corp, C corp, LLC, sole properties, partnership etc.)? I ask as it will matter a little as LLC and sole proprietor have direct impact on you personally. No matter what you will be giving a PG (personal guarantee) for business cards but more on that later. The path to good card personally is thru relationships you can build with your business. 

BofA is a fine institution, was my only bank for about 20 years. I have since left them for Chase as I am getting a lot better service from them (both personal and business). Actually I kept one account open with BofA as I have an investment with Merrill Lynch and I was not ready to move it until I filed my 2012 return last week. BofA refused to give me a personal card for years. Same with a business card. For reference my gross sales are about half of what you listed and have been solid for years. The main reason I decided to leave them is I was denied for an auto loan with a 765 FICO and a combined $250,000 in personal accounts and investments. At the time I thought my credit sucked (that's before I found MyFico site) and I almost gave up trying to finance my auto loan - was ready to pay cash for a Range Rover. When I visited the dealer to finalize the deal they asked to try to secure financing even though I had a check in hand for the vehicle. Chase approved me right away for full amount. In the end I only financed 50% of vehicle as I wanted to spend some cash for tax purposes. 

I visited a local Chase branch and started developing a relationship. I keep the majority of my money tied to the business as that's where I need it the most. As a sole proprietor I am paying taxes on all of the business profit each year no matter what. Chase stepped right up and offered me an Ink Cash card. Even with great sales and deposits I was granted a low starting limit ($2K) but after quite heavy usage my limit was increased in 45 days by 5X with a quick stop at the branch. I am sure I could get that increased again if needed but I use that account for employee card and it's sufficient (don't be greedy with Chase cards as they have a maximum internal credit limit that is split across all of your cards both personal and business). Eventually I added an Ink Bold (charge product with adjusting internal limit that grows with you). I also added a couple of personal cards as they offered in the branch. I got the CSP and recently added the Priority Club card. The CSP is important as it allows me to move the points earned on both Ink cards to my UR account tied to my CSP. So I am earning points on all purchases on the Ink business cards and the CSP and can benefit from them personally - that is what you want to do. 

Do yourself a favor and take an hour to meet with a Chase banker. Lay all of your info out and see what they offer. I think you will be surprised, they will shame BofA and honestly they are much easier to work with then AMEX. They can also do much more for you personally and for your business than AMEX ever will. I am still happy to get calls from my personal banker. Also you should consider developing a relationship with Chase as they are the stepping stone to having a private banker to handle your investments and the only path to the valued JP Morgan Palladium card. Honestly it's an OK card as the only bonus is 35K UR points at 100,000 spend. It does have nice benefits similar to some upper tier AMEX products. 

Speaking of AMEX products I have some experiences that will help you. First AMEX has a maximum exposure level for each customer (max credit across all cards) just like Chase. You will never know this limit but it will effect your path with them. Also even though the AMEX business cards require a different application and have different contact numbers it's essentially a personal card that reports to your boniness report and never your personal report (same with Chase Ink cards BTW). That's good as it will keep your UTL low on your personal report. That's also the main reason to not just get a personal card and run it up with business charges as why smash your good credit with a heavy use of a personal card for business use? Don't sweat the business use for personal card stuff, I do it all the time and have never had an issue, but I do it to earn points and I am always very careful to pay in full before the statement closes. That keeps my UTL low. I also have employees as AU on personal AMEX cards and again no issues as all their spend is clearly for business. 

If you get a business AMEX product and use it hard, PIF as needed you are a shoe in for a personal card (or two or three or four). That's what I did and it worked like a charm. Start with a charge card (Gold or Platinum if you want the perks associated with the Platinum for travel). Both earn MR points but the Business Gold Rewards card offers some 2X and 3X point categories that the Platinum just pays 1X. You might eventually want to add a few AMEX credit cards but be aware that the credit increase path rules apply to your personal and business cards. The rewards earned on business cards are yours personally and considering your major spend will be business you need to start earning them right away. 

I'm split on AMEX vs. Chase cards. Chase Ink cards offer 5x spend categories that are hard to beat. AMEX has my airline tied up and well as the bast travel card out there in the Platinum. In reality you want some cards from both banks. Finding the right mix is the tough part. Do it slowly with one card per bank per 91 days. Don't deviate from one card per bank per 91 days for any reason and it will be simple. 

I have to get back to work, I will add more later or respond to your reply. 

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Wow. That is awesome information. I've been thinking about Chase lately because various people suggest them to me. Many people complain to me about Bank of America, but they treat me like a king. They call me regularly to check on everything. Online wire requests before 5pm send same day (Chase cuts off at 4pm). I'll setup a meeting with Chase soon and explore options with them. I also like the fact that in the industry I'm in clients can transfer me money on Saturday's while other banks might leave me waiting for a wire on Monday.

So in summary your recommendation is Chase Ink for business and AMEX business card?

[Anonymous]

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@Creditaddict wrote:

I will post but if this thread continues at pages and pages I will have to remove... it stresses me out on my iphone!

The last few posts have been the most useful, the first 3 pages were a waste to me!

I agree that you are being short sided/narrow minded to say you won't do anything business because you want to build your personal... If BofA is your primary and you want to stay with them, just because they call you to give you business credit doesn't mean if you have a $50k business credit line that you can't apply for a personal and you will get denied... most likely the experience with the bank is going to win.... Have you tried for a personal card with them anytime recently?

Who is the mortgage going through?

Also, Bank of America has now com out with a charge card product just like the American Express... but I don't think you would have ANY issue getting both Amex Platinum Business Charge Card and Amex Platinum Personal Charge Card right now... the question would be what would your internal limit be and would you get FR... if the numbers are true and you don't use future income for today's applications (update next year) you should be no problem going through an FE (people get really worked up about it but if all checks out, I think all have reported no issue)

and I add, you have no reason to push expenses for business through personal if you get the amex charge... I'm sure with car, house, etc. you have thousands that would naturally go through personal just fine and then put the big regular charging up to "internal limit" on the business charge card... that internal limit on both cards will grow so fast your head will spin... just because most of it is going on business doesn't mean your personal will sit back at $5k limit "internally"

You would be a real canidate for a Black card in a year or two too!

Whens the signing of this house... I would move forward ASAP on 1 personal amex charge, 1 business Amex Charge, and 1 BofA business Charge.

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Great information. I've never really heard much hoo-ha over BOFA business cards, but everyone tells me about the Chase cards. So I think I'll take your advice and go for Business Platinum (rewards?), AMEX Platinum for personal, and a Chase Ink business perhaps.

The signing is in August/September. I have to wait until it's done being built.

Also, what is FR and what is FE?

[Creditaddict]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@ezdoesit wrote:

I have read all the posts but if you don't mind me asking what kind of business are you in?  Like someone wrote before that is a lot of money to be putting through your business debit card. 

You wrote that you are stubborn which I understand because I am also.  Why don't you then try and get both a business amex and a personal amex put a most of your charges onto the business Amex and maybe 2-3k a week on the personal amex I think that would be more that enough to show a lender next year that you can afford a Gallardo. That way you don't have activity on your personal CR.  I don't know how your accountant is not telling you that if you try and do all of this on your personal credit that forget about what Amex might do but your also inviting the IRS to red flag you for an audit. 

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I work in marketing. As far as an audit goes, I'm not worried about that. I pay my taxes (boy, do they pack a punch) and do everything legit.

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Sorry if audit came from my post, I mean Amex wanting to verify your taxes and income to those... no biggie outside proving that income.

I would think you could hit BofA for busienss, personal, and mortgage all at once if you use them for all right now! They shouldn't even blink if all holds true.

[scenery_guy]

I'm not sure about Chase wire restrictions. Almost all my clients ACH me funds with an occasional wire. I'm never in need of the funds right away so it's no big deal. That should be your #1 topic of conversation with Chase. 

Yes, business cards will show a HP on your personal credit report so expect a 5 point drop that should recover quickly. After that zero effect on your personal reports. Yes you can monitor your business credit file in a couple of places. Not nearly as much info as on your personal and not really worth paying for the view that often. I have used Experian services just to check mine. 

My advice would be to decide on a Chase business Ink card or an AMEX business card and apply now (soon, not this instant). Do the Chase if you go in the office and like what you hear. To me the advantage of a Chase Ink card is the ability to go into my branch and talk to a person, or pick up the phone and call my banker. Never get service like that from AMEX. If you decide to bank with them it becomes better. Once they see your business funds coming in and going out they are the most likely option you have to get a realistic working limit so you can put everything on the card. Don't underestimate that ability. With AMEX they assign you a limit and then it grows (charge card) but if you need more you will have to do the FR path (not bad but a pain and they do not look at current year or sometimes the prior year). Chase has access to all the info and has no need to FR ever. 

I poo poo BofA but you can try them. I never realized they had a business charge card. I looked at it, kind of meh to be honest. No transfer partners, no 2X - 5X spend bonuses. The two main players in rewards are Chase UR and AMEX MR. They are fighting to be king of the hill, both have great transfer partners and offer great bonuses. Don't fight it, ride it. I can't decide so I split my spend between them and have great transfer options.

Some here will tell you to wait. I think you can app soon and explain the single HP to the bank for the mortgage as it really is for business. Are you looking at 6 months until you can close on the house? Six months = 24 weeks or more x $25K spend = 600,000 base points lost during the wait. Wow. I could justify one application and one HP for those points. 

[LS2982]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Creditaddict wrote:

I will post but if this thread continues at pages and pages I will have to remove... it stresses me out on my iphone!

The last few posts have been the most useful, the first 3 pages were a waste to me!

I agree that you are being short sided/narrow minded to say you won't do anything business because you want to build your personal... If BofA is your primary and you want to stay with them, just because they call you to give you business credit doesn't mean if you have a $50k business credit line that you can't apply for a personal and you will get denied... most likely the experience with the bank is going to win.... Have you tried for a personal card with them anytime recently?

Who is the mortgage going through?

Also, Bank of America has now com out with a charge card product just like the American Express... but I don't think you would have ANY issue getting both Amex Platinum Business Charge Card and Amex Platinum Personal Charge Card right now... the question would be what would your internal limit be and would you get FR... if the numbers are true and you don't use future income for today's applications (update next year) you should be no problem going through an FE (people get really worked up about it but if all checks out, I think all have reported no issue)

and I add, you have no reason to push expenses for business through personal if you get the amex charge... I'm sure with car, house, etc. you have thousands that would naturally go through personal just fine and then put the big regular charging up to "internal limit" on the business charge card... that internal limit on both cards will grow so fast your head will spin... just because most of it is going on business doesn't mean your personal will sit back at $5k limit "internally"

You would be a real canidate for a Black card in a year or two too!

Whens the signing of this house... I would move forward ASAP on 1 personal amex charge, 1 business Amex Charge, and 1 BofA business Charge.

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Great information. I've never really heard much hoo-ha over BOFA business cards, but everyone tells me about the Chase cards. So I think I'll take your advice and go for Business Platinum (rewards?), AMEX Platinum for personal, and a Chase Ink business perhaps.

The signing is in August/September. I have to wait until it's done being built.

Also, what is FR and what is FE?

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An FR is AMEX slang for Financial Review. This can occur when your spending pattern goes way off track or AMEX feels like you've overstated your income on an application. Basically if something you did sends up a red flag, you'll hear from this dept.

[09Lexie]

OP, based in what your mortgage loan officer said - I would heed their suggestion to wait until closing.

Ultimately, it's your choice.

Good luck!

[Creditaddict]

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@scenery_guy wrote:

I'm not sure about Chase wire restrictions. Almost all my clients ACH me funds with an occasional wire. I'm never in need of the funds right away so it's no big deal. That should be your #1 topic of conversation with Chase. 

Yes, business cards will show a HP on your personal credit report so expect a 5 point drop that should recover quickly. After that zero effect on your personal reports. Yes you can monitor your business credit file in a couple of places. Not nearly as much info as on your personal and not really worth paying for the view that often. I have used Experian services just to check mine. 

My advice would be to decide on a Chase business Ink card or an AMEX business card and apply now (soon, not this instant). Do the Chase if you go in the office and like what you hear. To me the advantage of a Chase Ink card is the ability to go into my branch and talk to a person, or pick up the phone and call my banker. Never get service like that from AMEX. If you decide to bank with them it becomes better. Once they see your business funds coming in and going out they are the most likely option you have to get a realistic working limit so you can put everything on the card. Don't underestimate that ability. With AMEX they assign you a limit and then it grows (charge card) but if you need more you will have to do the FR path (not bad but a pain and they do not look at current year or sometimes the prior year). Chase has access to all the info and has no need to FR ever. 

I poo poo BofA but you can try them. I never realized they had a business charge card. I looked at it, kind of meh to be honest. No transfer partners, no 2X - 5X spend bonuses. The two main players in rewards are Chase UR and AMEX MR. They are fighting to be king of the hill, both have great transfer partners and offer great bonuses. Don't fight it, ride it. I can't decide so I split my spend between them and have great transfer options.

Some here will tell you to wait. I think you can app soon and explain the single HP to the bank for the mortgage as it really is for business. Are you looking at 6 months until you can close on the house? Six months = 24 weeks or more x $25K spend = 600,000 base points lost during the wait. Wow. I could justify one application and one HP for those points. 

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I agree... if you are not closing in the next 60 days, I'd be in Chase tomorrow getting the ink BOLD if Chase is the route your going.

[webhopper]

The benefits on personal and business platinum are the same. No point in having both. Go with premier rewards gold for personal.