@toothgrind3r wrote:
@victor7 wrote:At a restaurant (for example), the waiter brings a small handheld terminal to the table, inserts my card, and hands it to me to enter my PIN. It's great, as I can directly verify that the amount being charged (including tip) is the amount I intended, and there's no way for someone to clone my card, since they never really had access to it.
I love that aspect of the chip&pin more then anything. If I recall, the terminals even have a "10%, 15%, 20% tip" option on it, right?
That depends upon the culture / country.
In France, tipping is actually considered a bit insulting, so there is no option to tip at all. (Which I love, by the way. Pay people well, so they don't have to live off tips!)
In the UK, tipping is common, though not required. A "good" tip is about 10%. Sometimes there are choices like you suggest (though not as high), but you can always override and put any amount you want, or none at all.
And yes, it's incredibly convenient and easy.
The worst part is when I accidentally use one of my US cards (all of which require signatures), and someone has to find a pen, wait for the machine to spit out a slip, and then I sign it. In Europe (unlike the US), they almost always study the signature against the card, since they know that US cards with signatures are their source of greatest fraud.
@nyancat wrote:
@core wrote:
@Anonymous wrote:
Are we in that much of a hurry that typing in a PIN number is a big deal?No, not a "big" deal. But it is a small deal, and the fact that it inconveniences me even in the slightest just to protect the fat cat big banks doesn't sit too well with me. And since I don't exactly shop at Tiffany's, I'd rather not linger around the stores taking in the sights. Usually anyway. I wouldn't mind so much if you could just insert your card quickly and then put it away, and _then_ wait for all the communication and pin entry or whatever. That would be much better, if it didn't need the chip contact the entire time. It also wouldn't be so bad if you just had one lonely card in your jeans pocket. In a 5% cash back for everything world that one-card plan doesn't work out so well though.
It just takes a bit longer and it seems a lot longer because it's awkward waiting for the darn thing so you can have your card back. Besides, the faster I can get out of the store and back to my car, the sooner I can start sniffing the glue I just purchased.
Chip transactions take about two seconds longer to process than magnetic stripe transactions on a high-speed connection with modern equipment (there are more messages, and thus will take longer with complex, slow, or dial-up systems). The transaction time FEELS a bit longer than this because you are waiting with your card inserted the entire time instead of putting your card away while you wait for the slip to print.
PIN can EASILY save at least two seconds. A signature takes me at least 10 seconds, personally (grabbing the pen, getting a grip on the slip, handing the slip back to the cashier). Thus, the idea that chip and PIN causes slowdowns is bizarre.
And that's before you add in all the merchants (even in the US, tho worse in other countries) that demand ID for signature transactions, despite being against network rules. Then you're adding another 15-20 seconds (plus a good 30-45 second lecture on how it's against network rules, sometimes a request to talk to a manager in my case, and the time to file reports with Visa and Mastercard plus a complaint email to the business and on their Facebook and Twitter... in my case) that PIN eliminates.
I had a chip and PIN Visa back when I lived in Japan and I never found the transaction time to be -that- much longer. Although I don't have kids nor am I usually in any huge rush when I shop.
The card I had allowed me to pick the PIN when I applied for it (not sure if this applies for all Japan-issued cards though).
Most places I go to nowadays I don't even have to sign (Publix, Wal-Mart, Target if the transaction is under $50) and if I do, it's often on the electronic reader and not a printed slip. Either way, I think the transaction time is the same when you put in signing (I agree with you that the big difference is that you can put the swipe card away right away versus the card reader holding it for the PIN transaction).
I believe you aren't supposed to ask for ID unless the card is not signed (in that case, you are supposed to check ID, and make the person sign it right there before accepting it. I worked in many retails store and I have never made anyone do that and refusing a card at Target would be an instant write-up even if it was blatantly stolen or fraud. Yes, it's obvious when they try buying 5+ Visa prepaid cards). I think that's for Visa/MC? I'm not sure of the rules with Discover and Amex. However I do not blame stores/merchants for asking for ID as if it is a stolen card they will be out the cost of the item, inventory and a chargeback fee. I'm not sure what the online rules are. At the online business I work for, we have asked for copies of the card (front and back) and a copy of government issued ID (if they don't provide it, we just cancel and refund the transaction as legit people will most likely comply or at least respond to complain).
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Man, if there's this much resistance, I almost think we should just mandate NFC support in card readers and leave it at that. Apple seems to be doing a pretty good job at getting people to use Apple Pay at least. 