@Anonymous wrote:HPs are the price of playing the game, don't fret over them, especially when starting out. Though, that doesn't mean wastefully burn them on unobtainable accounts like say major bank cards right now.
If you want to dip your hard pull many times over, IME, SECU MD will let you do that as many times as you want over in a 30 day period from the first pull. So you could technically get dozens of SSLs there with one pull, along with credit cards/loans if they allow. I dipped them with one pull for 3-4 CC/loans not too long ago, again last month for some SSLs. They may also let you provide POI in consideration for CCs, since you're new to credit...
If you're interested, I suggest trying to establish membership via donation: https://www.secumd.org/personal/banking/savings-cds/share-savings.aspx
If you read the other link about SSL trick, the aggregate utilization (combined/total utilization) is what matters with loans, so you can do multiple loans with different principal balances to extend the timeframe of your score boost if you go with SECU.
Example: SSLs for 300 and 3000, I'd pay off 99% of the 3000 loan and only part of the 300 loan, and then have an aggregate utilization under 9%. Since I can advance the payment dates by 6 months max, I just extended my score boost by that amount with the larger loan and when it expires I still have the small one I can pay down to maintain the boost.
I see your point about HP's at the beginning of the journey. I'm still reluctant to go there, but I'll use them sparingly if I must. The SSL trick is fascinating. I never knew about this technique before. It make a lot of sense, though. I was just reading up on the "The Quest for an alternative to Alliant" thread. There are SO many useful posts here. I'm grateful for this site and all of you who've been willing to share knowledge. Thank you!!
@Anonymous wrote:@HRZ780 I suggest that you read the Scoring Primer linked at the top of my signature.
yeah don't sweat the hard pull so much, the penalty goes away in a year; as stated don't waste them, but don't let them unnecessarily worry you.
As for continually getting SSLs, that would be OK for a new credit profile, so you can have some accounts to age, but you wouldn't want toperpetually to do that or it would keep your average ages low.
Go get another 2 secured cards and at least one SSL. Wait a year, make sure the loan is paid down 9% at that time to get a score boost, and then go get another 2 or 3 cards, maybe an American Express and Discover, or see if you prequalify for a Citibank or USB.
You'll find all kind of links in the Scoring Primer regarding the SSL, new credit files, and all sorts of good information, and you'll find a lot of exhaustive analysis of new credit files from @Anonymous .
I looked through the primer. Man, what a lot of information to sift through. Very useful information! I've added it to the growing list of bookmarked urls. :-) Agreed on the HP's - I get it. I'm still looking over all the options for secured cards and potential SSL's. I suppose at this point since my CR's are new and empty, I should add as much as I can as quickly as can (within reason).
@SouthJamaica wrote:I would tread slowly rather than rush into adding new accounts.
I say ok on adding to your deposit for the Redstone secured card.
Regardless of what you were told by a CSR at EX, I believe you will have credit scores with all 3 bureaus by January or February, even with just the one card. Once you have your scores you can reassess your game plan. I would recommend getting a 3 bureau report from MyFICO because that's the only way to get an up to date and comprehensive view of your credit picture.
I would hesitate to get involved with relatives, to load myself up with secured cards that will be useless within a year, or to take out installment loans that will also prove useless. Because you don't need them. IMHO the only loan that would be worth getting is to take out a share secured loan with Navy Federal for > $3k for 60 mos [and then pay it down to 9%], because that helps your FICO 8's for 5 years.
I'm definitely hesitant about the use of AU's, that's a given. Although, I do understand that they CAN be useful to get an automated approval for an unsecured card? The idea is to graduate and secured cards to unsecured cards anyway. Again, I am not opposed to secured cards as they seem to be well within my grasp and I know they do help. I'm all about slow and steady, but I also would not mind taking advantage of any leg-up's I can get along the way. Provided that help doesn't somehow hurt my CR's. I'm still trying to find a way into NFCU. Do you know offhand how closely related one would need to be to qualify as a family member? I assume it's strictly spouse/sibling and one generation above/below? Every male in my family before me as well as siblings were in the military. I chose the other path.
@Anonymous wrote:I started clean 2yrs 9mos ago with a 5 year plan to be credit-ready for a mortgage. I've only had credit cards for 1yr 9mos of that total history.
You don't need a loan or an AU account. In your case, I would get at least 1 more secured card that can be changed later to something decent.
Then you just wait and watch your scores rise to 760, which will happen within the first 2 years of revolving history - as it did for me.
With 2 cards, you can use a little trick to get a +19/+14 score jump on EQ/TU 8 scores by letting one report between 0 and 9%, and the other at $0. EX 8 won't move with that trick, but it doesn't matter - it will regularly increase a little at 3mo intervals.
Just after the Youngest Account 1yr 0mo mark, you can try applying for a decent unsecured card. Based on posts from the Card Approvals forum here, and my own experience, I'd try for one of the Citi cards. I've gotten $6500 in soft-pull credit limit increases (SP CLIs) from them in the last 1yr 3mos.
As for how the cards report month to month: You're trying to show positive payment history, so you want to use them and let it show. Just think of the cards as delayed debit cards. Don't worry about the score month-to-month and try to keep only 1 card reporting a balance - it just doesn't matter until you need a higher credit score for something.
[EDIT to Add: Here's a link to my 28 score 3-bureau reports during the first 13 months of having credit cards. You'll know what to expect month-to-month by looking at each monthly report.
The 'All at less than 9% Utilization' experiment
]
I just read the "All <9% utilization" thread earlier today. Lots of great info there, too! I think I understand the concept of using the CC's in general as well as AZEO. I think I have a grasp on when to pay, how to keep utilization within a small range, etc. I'm getting several different opinions on how many cards I should have, secured or otherwise. The opinions seem to range from 2 cards to 5 cards min? Then there's SSL's. LOL I get that I want to let things age. Aged accounts is good. I also understand from the CRA's that more accounts is better (thick file). It seems to me that if I were to have more accounts at the beginning, the average age of those accounts would have greater "weight" to them (since they'd all be aged similarly) when/if I add new accounts down the road. Having a mix of revolving accounts and installment acounts will help mix as well as show potential creditors down the road that I can effectively and responsibly handle each type of account. I am pretty sure my next step will be another secured card or two at this point. There seems to be some consensus on that idea, more or less.
@Anonymous wrote:@HRZ780 last night was pretty late and I didn't really get to address everything you said in your post that I wanted to comment on, so I'll elaborate more now.
First welcome to the forum. Second congratulations on your recovery and your success in your business.
I understand your reluctance to use credit and you should use it just like you do cash and not accumulate debt; simply use it to pass through your spending.
How does Equifax report 679? you have to have six months of history with an account in order to be scoreable. From my understanding your reports were totally clean of accounts meaning it's just like a brand new profile.
Yes you want one card to report at least a small balance so you avoid the all zero penalty.
5 accounts are not necessary to achieve a score and probably does not establish a thick file anyway. Disregard what the CSR told you.
Get your loans through a financial institution not a finance company, I believe Navy, Alliant, and maybe Ideal work and you can make additional payments without advancing the maturity date so you don't have to open up more loans.
Authorized user accounts are not bad, although a lot of people don't like the idea of them. They serve a purpose and you're right, they're more useful for automated approval for credit cards than for mortgages. But, they can help your score depending on the version and whether it is flagged by the anti-abuse portion of the algorithm in 8 and forward. You are already aware mortgage lenders may discount them. Nothing wrong with using them to increase your score and grab a few primary unsecured cards.
You present it as a choice whether to get the authorized user accounts and then unsecured cards or to get more secured cards. The former would be preferable so you didn't have to have secured cards, but what's important is that you get accounts in your name as soon as possible in my opinion, whether that entails going through authorized user accounts and then acquiring them or acquiring secured cards that will graduate, really doesn't matter.
The point is what you want to do will be able to do in the future with your credit. In my opinion the backbone to a strong credit file is a lot of old accounts. To get that you have to open those accounts. Now if you take time and slowly open them over the next 10 years, what will your average age of accounts look like in 10 years? On the other hand if you were to open them all in the first two years and then do nothing and let them age, how much higher will your average age of accounts be in 10 years?
There are metrics that measure your oldest revolving account, your oldest account, your oldest installment account, and your oldest open installment account, so it's great to get one of each started in the beginning. It's good to get several started in the beginning, so that they will be older in the future rather than sprinkled over time and have a lower average age in the future as a consequence.
Now you're can have a great scores with just a couple cards, but if in the future if you intend to be able to open several accounts without wrecking your average ages, you'll need several old ones to counterweight them, or your average ages will suffer.
if those two or three cards will serve you well and you don't intend to have much credit activity, then it matters less. But if you want to be able to have those options in the future without as much of a penalty, it's better to open some accounts in the beginning to serve as the base of your ages.
Just my humble opinion as always.
Thanks for the long response and thank you for the welcome!! I've been watching and lurking on this forum for a little while now, trying to soak it all in before asking questions. :-) I learned a lot in a relatively short amount of time, too.
I've been using the one secured card I have now as pass-through for regular/small purchases. I run it up to $200-ish, then pay it down to 8% before statement generates.
As for Equifax reporting 679, I have no idea "how"....only that they are. The moment the Redstone secured card hit, I went from a "0" to a "679". I won't pretend to understand how they scoring works.
What you're saying about opening up new accounts sooner rather than later makes a lot of sense to me. The weight of all those older accounts will help offset any new credit down the line. I'm looking for a more robust credit file in the future, so a nice thick spread of accounts now/ASAP tends to resonate with me. In the immediate, it seems that should care a little less about the drops due to too many new accounts and HP's and just focus on building. Now, I just read at least one response that suggested otherwise.
You mentioned something about AU's possibly triggering anti-abuse? I'm going to read up on that as I'm unfamiliar with it.
@Anonymous wrote:Most credit unions are going to require a hard pull to get a card, some even for a membership, but that's the cost of playing the game. As stated many credit unions allow you to get multiple products within 30 days from one pull.
read the SSL threads in the Primer and that will guide you to institutions besides the ones I named. A personal loan thats unsecured from US Bank works as well I believe, as well as some other institutions.
I've been finding this to be true after doing some more research into the subject. I just happened to luck out with Redstone being the first as they only did SP's for everything (membership AND secured card - Experian only). As I understand it, Redstone does not offer a SSL. I have a few banks/cu's in mind now, I'll hit them up on Monday and see what I can do.
@Anonymous wrote:@HRZ780 Forgive me if you already stated and I missed it, but where are you getting your scores from....are you getting true FICO scores or are they Vantage scores? If Vantage, this may be why you are receiving an EQ score.....true FICO scores will take the 6 months to generate.
For NFCU, immediate relatives with Military background should qualify you to join....a parent, grandparent, sibling, child, spouse? If any of these apply whether the relative is active duty or not you should be able to join. Give them a call, they have great reps and will help you determine eligibility. Good luck! 🛳💙
You are correct, it's the Equifax VantageScore 3.0 - I'm sure that makes more sense now. I've been holding off on sigining up for the full fico access suite until I have something a little more substantial going on with my credit.
Thanks for the info. I'll give NFCU a call this week and see where that leads me.