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Recently received my invitation for X1 card and went out to the site to apply and review TOS. I thought the 'Default' section was very interesting. Basically they are saying that they can declare you are in default with "full balance due immediately" if they believe there has been ANY change in your creditworthiness. No explanation no appeal. I checked my other cards - CapOne, Discover, Comenity and their default language has nothing that grey. Basically their default is if you miss payments etc. To clarify default is not the same as just closing your account and letting you pay it out under the current terms. This is pretty broad language. I decided not to move forward because they could literally default you for little or no reason and send you to collection if you don't immediately pay the full balance, which may not always be possible. Seems kind of shady to me. Language is below by the way:
Subject to applicable law, we may consider your Account in default at any time if: (1) you fail to pay at least the Minimum Payment by the Payment Due Date; (2) you attempt to engage in a transaction that exceeds the Credit Limit; (3) you make a payment that is returned unpaid to us for any reason; (4) you breach any term under this Agreement; (5) we determine that any statement made by you to us in connection with this Agreement or your credit card application was false or misleading; (6) you breach any terms under any other agreement that you have with us, X1 or with any of their affiliates; (7) you file for bankruptcy or some other insolvency proceeding is filed by or against you; (8) you are declared incompetent or mentally incapacitated, or in the event of your death; or (9) we have any reason to believe you may not be creditworthy.
@dvond wrote:Recently received my invitation for X1 card and went out to the site to apply and review TOS. I thought the 'Default' section was very interesting. Basically they are saying that they can declare you are in default with "full balance due immediately" if they believe there has been ANY change in your creditworthiness. No explanation no appeal. I checked my other cards - CapOne, Discover, Comenity and their default language has nothing that grey. Basically their default is if you miss payments etc. To clarify default is not the same as just closing your account and letting you pay it out under the current terms. This is pretty broad language. I decided not to move forward because they could literally default you for little or no reason and send you to collection if you don't immediately pay the full balance, which may not always be possible. Seems kind of shady to me. Language is below by the way:
Events of Default
Subject to applicable law, we may consider your Account in default at any time if: (1) you fail to pay at least the Minimum Payment by the Payment Due Date; (2) you attempt to engage in a transaction that exceeds the Credit Limit; (3) you make a payment that is returned unpaid to us for any reason; (4) you breach any term under this Agreement; (5) we determine that any statement made by you to us in connection with this Agreement or your credit card application was false or misleading; (6) you breach any terms under any other agreement that you have with us, X1 or with any of their affiliates; (7) you file for bankruptcy or some other insolvency proceeding is filed by or against you; (8) you are declared incompetent or mentally incapacitated, or in the event of your death; or (9) we have any reason to believe you may not be creditworthy.
A variety of lenders have similar clauses in their CCA's. This isn't out of the ordinary or "shady". Their card, their funding, their rules.
Moreover, the bolded part of your statement is very misleading. At no point is a lender going to 'voluntarily' place you in default or collections arbitrarily. Obviously, if you don't fulfill the terms of the cardholder agreement, such as being late, failure to make a minimum payment, NSFs, engage in risky and/or questionable transactions, etc., then they have the right to demand the payment of the full balance. After all, at the end of the day, it is a loan on plastic (or metal for this particular one).
I see nothing in their terms that raises any red flags, with the exception of: "(9) we have any reason to believe you may not be creditworthy."
That's a pretty broad statement! ANY reason?
Looking at this from a personal standpoint, right now my balances are much higher than usual, as are my individual and overall utilization rates. Could they look at that and decide I'm no longer creditworthy? Assuming they could--and could then demand payment in full immediately--I think I'd use my card very, very sparingly...if I had one.
With all that said, though, it seems doubtful that a bank would gleefully and with little restraint shut down perfectly good accounts. I'd like to think their choice of words is simply a little over-the-top and that, in reality, there's no more chance of one of their cards being closed than anyone else's, as long as you play by the rules.
@dvond wrote:Recently received my invitation for X1 card and went out to the site to apply and review TOS. I thought the 'Default' section was very interesting. Basically they are saying that they can declare you are in default with "full balance due immediately" if they believe there has been ANY change in your creditworthiness. No explanation no appeal. I checked my other cards - CapOne, Discover, Comenity and their default language has nothing that grey. Basically their default is if you miss payments etc. To clarify default is not the same as just closing your account and letting you pay it out under the current terms. This is pretty broad language. I decided not to move forward because they could literally default you for little or no reason and send you to collection if you don't immediately pay the full balance, which may not always be possible. Seems kind of shady to me. Language is below by the way:
Events of Default
Subject to applicable law, we may consider your Account in default at any time if: (1) you fail to pay at least the Minimum Payment by the Payment Due Date; (2) you attempt to engage in a transaction that exceeds the Credit Limit; (3) you make a payment that is returned unpaid to us for any reason; (4) you breach any term under this Agreement; (5) we determine that any statement made by you to us in connection with this Agreement or your credit card application was false or misleading; (6) you breach any terms under any other agreement that you have with us, X1 or with any of their affiliates; (7) you file for bankruptcy or some other insolvency proceeding is filed by or against you; (8) you are declared incompetent or mentally incapacitated, or in the event of your death; or (9) we have any reason to believe you may not be creditworthy.
Ummm so where does it say that they can demand full balance payment?
Ways of default don't look unusual to me.
@dragontears wrote:Ummm so where does it say that they can demand full balance payment?
Ways of default don't look unusual to me.
Agreed on the ways of default, but I'm sure that somewhere in the TOS there is a clause for accelerating the debt which is in almost every lending contract in some form that I've worked on. One of my client banks had me issue a acceleration notice to a borrower on a performing mortgage and called the loan due immediately. I don't know why they suddenly decided to call the debt (that wasn't my department), but they considered them a risk and not creditworthy anymore.
To the OP, remember that if you miss a payment you are technically in default; however, that doesn't necessarily mean that the first step in the AA path is calling the loan due in full and shutting down your card. There are many ways to bring a loan out of default before you get there. I'm sure that X1 would not be arbitrary and capricious in their AA decisions and close people down for shallow reasons. That would be incurring a lot of reputational/legal/regulatory risk that could far outweigh monetary loss from a chargeoff.
In short, I wouldn't sweat the TOS on default and remedy because you are a responsible borrower.
@dragontears wrote:
@dvond wrote:Recently received my invitation for X1 card and went out to the site to apply and review TOS. I thought the 'Default' section was very interesting. Basically they are saying that they can declare you are in default with "full balance due immediately" if they believe there has been ANY change in your creditworthiness. No explanation no appeal. I checked my other cards - CapOne, Discover, Comenity and their default language has nothing that grey. Basically their default is if you miss payments etc. To clarify default is not the same as just closing your account and letting you pay it out under the current terms. This is pretty broad language. I decided not to move forward because they could literally default you for little or no reason and send you to collection if you don't immediately pay the full balance, which may not always be possible. Seems kind of shady to me. Language is below by the way:
Events of Default
Subject to applicable law, we may consider your Account in default at any time if: (1) you fail to pay at least the Minimum Payment by the Payment Due Date; (2) you attempt to engage in a transaction that exceeds the Credit Limit; (3) you make a payment that is returned unpaid to us for any reason; (4) you breach any term under this Agreement; (5) we determine that any statement made by you to us in connection with this Agreement or your credit card application was false or misleading; (6) you breach any terms under any other agreement that you have with us, X1 or with any of their affiliates; (7) you file for bankruptcy or some other insolvency proceeding is filed by or against you; (8) you are declared incompetent or mentally incapacitated, or in the event of your death; or (9) we have any reason to believe you may not be creditworthy.
Ummm so where does it say that they can demand full balance payment?
Ways of default don't look unusual to me.
The OP said this: "Basically they are saying that they can declare you are in default with "full balance due immediately" if they believe there has been ANY change in your creditworthiness"--I took the quoted part to be a direct quote from the TOS they read.
Asking for a family member what happens if he falls into default and can't pay the payments on the card will they take the payments from the bank account without asking or it it will just go to collection like any other card ?
Since this card works to get approved with linking the bank account
please reference the discussion upthread. Also, be sure your 'friend' is familiar with X1's T&C's in the event of any default.