Alliant changes (they’re getting even worse)

[Anonymous]

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@DaveInAZ wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

Figured that this belonged in this thread. I haven't gotten a letter as of yet but with how the mail is right now, could be coming. They didn't just go after people who abused the account looking through the comments so who knows what Alliant is doing these expulsions for this round. Plenty of people not doing MOs. 

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/alliant-closing-down-some-accounts-mo-deposits/

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Yeah, I saw that on DoC. Strange letter, claiming they had a "member meeting" to vote for "expelling" the members they claim violated the CU rules. Commenters on DoC point out they've never been notified of any "member meeting", and I've never heard of such a thing, if they think you've been naughty they usually just close your account and call it a day.

I've never had any interest in account with Alliant, alot of folks like them for a "hub" account but I have other accounts that do that for me. And I sure won't go near them now.

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Yeah they're pretty shady honestly. I wouldn't be mad if they closed me out. I got them to eventually get their 2% card but then they devalued the points and even though they reinstated the previous value, there's nothing stopping them from doing it again. I have heard of them reporting to Chex when you close your accounts with them so I opted to just keep them rather than risk it so they would honestly be doing me a favor if they closed me out. 

[BearsCubsOtters]

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@DaveInAZ wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

Figured that this belonged in this thread. I haven't gotten a letter as of yet but with how the mail is right now, could be coming. They didn't just go after people who abused the account looking through the comments so who knows what Alliant is doing these expulsions for this round. Plenty of people not doing MOs. 

https://www.doctorofcredit.com/alliant-closing-down-some-accounts-mo-deposits/

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Yeah, I saw that on DoC. Strange letter, claiming they had a "member meeting" to vote for "expelling" the members they claim violated the CU rules. Commenters on DoC point out they've never been notified of any "member meeting", and I've never heard of such a thing, if they think you've been naughty they usually just close your account and call it a day.

I've never had any interest in account with Alliant, alot of folks like them for a "hub" account but I have other accounts that do that for me. And I sure won't go near them now.

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That letter was from the last round of closures. I do not know if anybody has yet posted the new letter (if any changes).

People are saying this time it is not just the money orders but also for using them as a way to pull money from one institution, and once posted to Alliant, are moved to other institutions. It can be an effective way to avoid fees from banks like US Bank that charge to ACH money out. 

Essentially, they are looking for money laundering (placement and layering) and are taking steps to close down accounts that may cause concern for an auditor or regulator when they go through their exam. I personally do not blame them having come from a compliance background myself.

I love the up-in-arms comments from people saying that they can't expell them and that they are going to complain to the BBB, CFPB and State of Illinois. The credit union, just like Chase and Synch etc can close accounts whenever they want and part of Bank Secrecy Act is that they do not have to tell you why they closed the account for compliance reasons. 

Overall, Alliant is nothing to write home about so its not a huge loss. Hard to not take it personally when you are "expelled" from a CU but at the same time, it's only Alliant. 

[coldfusion]

I'm going to withhold judgement until someone actually posts a copy of this latest letter purportedly sent out.   I saw a lot of speculative commentary there in the related thread but not very much in the way of related facts.

[Anonymous]

OMG they report people to Chex? I'm about to close my accounts there and my Chex is a graveyard of credit union apps already. 

[RootDet]

I can see your point, but with a CU comes a big difference. A CU is a member-owned FI, so having a membership and funding your share means you hold a share of ownership. 

A bank has no such concept, so they can simply turn you off, bang bang done. A CU has a formal process for terminating your ownership, or expulsion as it is called. NOw under both Federal law, and IL state law (applicable to Alliant as they are state-chartered), a CU member has certain rights when it comes to expulsion. These are :

1) The expulsion be voted on by the members present at a CU meeting

2) The member being expelled be given the opportunity to be heard and essentially refute the reason for expulsion.

Members in the DOC are saying they were never informed of alliants intent to expel, therefore they were never afforded right #2 above. In that case, if it is found to be true, Aliant violated IL law about expulsions and its own by-laws.  One could argue the Expulsion is Null and void, but i am sure Alliant will never come to that determination until forced by a regulator.

So yes, everyone should make complaints that Alliant skirted the rules of expulsion. Now frankly all this means is if Aliant wants you gone, they will just have to circle back and hold a special meeting to do this again, this time notifying the expelees of the meeting and their intention to expel them. At this point, the member has the knowledge that they should consider attending, and the opportunity to attend and defend themselves if they so wish. 

Alliant just does not get to sidestep the rules for convenience. I respect their right to look out for members and seek to limit liability onto others, I respect that. I will never respect bypassing due process afforded by law or by-laws for expediency.

The CU has rights and so don't members. I would also like to think members at large would like to know that the CU leadership and board have questionable judgement and ethics. Sometimes those elected to serve forget who the boss really is. 

[coldfusion]

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@RootDet wrote:

So yes, everyone should make complaints that Alliant skirted the rules of expulsion.

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Everyone might want to confirm that Alliant really did skirt rules of expulsion before complaining about Alliant skirting rules of expulsion.

There is still no letter posted.

[Anonymous]

Well I have a letter coming from Alliant today according to Informed Delivery but it says "car insurance program notice" so I can't help with the expulsion letter. 

First correspondence I have gotten from them since they sent me my debit card when I opened my account. 

[lovelife2]

Dumb question, and go ahead and laugh at me, but i read the DOC and all comments.  What is a hub account.   I read it on the Internet but wasnt really clear and i didnt get it.   So issue is that MO (money order) were deposited (ATM) and seems suspicious and Alliant wants to avoid Auditors and questions regarding "susptect" laundering of money.    In reading thru the comments, many use MO for chasing (churning) bank bonuses.   Open and close account and move on to next bonus.   Trying to understand if i got it right.   Another stupid question do they go to stores and get MO how does that play into it.   It seems in reading it most of them do it using MO.   Comments kept noting i need to find a new hub account.  

I have churned 3 accounts in 2020, but didnt use MO and did a straight ACH from bank to bank or a DD from work.   

I have an account with Alliant CU and i think they are great.   Customer Service is wonderful. 

[Anonymous]

A hub account is an account that you use to push money to other accounts free of charge basically. 

[coldfusion]

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@lovelife2 wrote:

Dumb question, and go ahead and laugh at me, but i read the DOC and all comments.  What is a hub account.   I read it on the Internet but wasnt really clear and i didnt get it.   So issue is that MO (money order) were deposited (ATM) and seems suspicious and Alliant wants to avoid Auditors and questions regarding "susptect" laundering of money.    In reading thru the comments, many use MO for chasing (churning) bank bonuses.   Open and close account and move on to next bonus.   Trying to understand if i got it right.   Another stupid question do they go to stores and get MO how does that play into it.   It seems in reading it most of them do it using MO.   Comments kept noting i need to find a new hub account.  

I have churned 3 accounts in 2020, but didnt use MO and did a straight ACH from bank to bank or a DD from work.   

I have an account with Alliant CU and i think they are great.   Customer Service is wonderful. 

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What IMO is really relevant here is that DoC posted a very poorly update to the original blog entry without providing any kind of corroborating evidence validating the update beyond a "I read something written on the wall of the bathroom stall" level of credibility.   

The original action taken 2 years ago was to drop from membership members that were depositing money orders.  Money orders were useful when it came to laundering dirty money and also (more so even then than now) as a means of manufactured spend, and they obviously didn't want to risk dealing with heightened scrutiny and risk of being sanctioned.   Even the USPS within the last 2 years imposed additional restrictions on how purchases of money orders can be paid for, and many banks have restrictions on how they can be deposited.  

What the update alludes to but does not say is that there are now claims, which DoC for whatever reason hasn't shared any validating evidence,  that members who regularly leveraged Alliant's fee-free outbound ACH transfer policy are now having their accounts closed.