cancel
Showing results for 
Search instead for 
Did you mean: 

6% overall utilization --> 7 point bump

Valued Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@SouthJamaica wrote:


The reason I was able to get clean data -- which is a challenge in my profile -- is that I just subscribed to a new Experian product which gives me daily updates of the report including updates of 4 scores: FICO 8, FICO 2, and an Auto and Bankcard score.  So it's clean data, but only applicable to EX. Several days later on my MyFICO dashboard there was a 6 point increase in TU FICO 8.  So it's possible that it was related, but impossible for me to have any degree of certainty about that one.

 

It didn't occur during the changeover of the month; it occurred earlier.


Please report before/after on all scores received. It is more insightful as various models behave differently. I find it useful to look at Shifts in Classic score compared to Auto and Bankcard. If all three shift the same way more than 5 points, that's a tell sign that some factor fundamental to the algorithm has crossed a threshold.

 

Because # cards with balances, aggregate utilization and individual card utilization (typically highest card UT%) all affect score, it is helpful to mention # cards reporting (say 6 of 20 for example) and highest card UT%. SJ, is all that information available to you on these reports?

 

Fico 8: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 9: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 4 .....:. EQ 809 TU 823 EX 830 EX Fico 98: 842
VS 3.0:...... EQ 835 TU 835 EX 835
Fico 8 BC:. EQ 892 TU 900 EX 900
CBIS: ........EQ LN Auto 940 EQ LN Home 870 TU Auto 902 TU Home 950
Message 11 of 72
Community Leader
Senior Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.

SJ wouldn't be the first to report being dinged at a point that's less than 8.9% overall. About a year and a half ago, I was dinged on all three bureaus. My utilization went from 4% to 5% to somewhere back under 5%. Before and after scores were identical.

 

This suggests a possible 4.9% threshold on my profile. However, some have suggested that flat dollar amounts may come into play.

Message 12 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@NRB525 wrote:

 

Since we are early into December, when aging thresholds become a hidden driver of score changes, what was your sequence of tracking scores from late November to the change you think of as 6% Overall Utilization as the December 1 threshold was crossed?


SJ stated at the end of Post 7 that the score change happened toward the end of November, thus ruling out a December 1st age of accounts change being a factor.  I too thought earlier in this thread that it could have been the cause here, but it seems it wasn't.

Message 13 of 72
Valued Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@SouthJamaica wrote:

 


The reason I was able to get clean data -- which is a challenge in my profile -- is that I just subscribed to a new Experian product which gives me daily updates of the report including updates of 4 scores: FICO 8, FICO 2, and an Auto and Bankcard score.  So it's clean data, but only applicable to EX. Several days later on my MyFICO dashboard there was a 6 point increase in TU FICO 8.  So it's possible that it was related, but impossible for me to have any degree of certainty about that one.

 

It didn't occur during the changeover of the month; it occurred earlier.


SJ, I wonder if you are using the same one I am with Experian.  I think the one I am using is Experian Creditworks or something similar.  The different scores you mentioned that they give sounds similar.  There may even be a couple more.  Just curious that's all. 

                                 

Total Credit: $218,900Credit Utilization: 1%AAoA: 5 years, 5 monthsInstallments: Car Lease, Marcus LoanNegatives: 0


                                                                                              
                      DSC-27.1K | NFC-25K | ALI-25k | WAL-10k | BoA-22k | BB-12k | NFL-15k | LOW-35k | AMX-19.3k | CHA-10k | PF-8.8k | C-DC-9.7k
Message 14 of 72
Community Leader
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.

It's worth pointing out that SouthJ has a gigantic total credit limit.  This means that we are talking about a huge dollar value compared to what many people might be thinking.  It's possible that the particular FICO model considers that in addition to the utilization percentage -- it's conceivable that by reducing his debt by several thousand dollars he crossed some scoring rubicon (one that looks purely at dollar value as a separate consideration).

 

If a few people with small credit limits could duplicate his finding that would of course rule that out.

 

PS.  I have myself received negative reason statements claiming that my revolving debt is too high when my total utilization is quite low as a percentage.  It's one of the many reasons I am open to the possibility that dollar value could be considered by some FICO models.

Message 15 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.

That's a great point above regarding raw dollar value aside from just percentage.  SJ, for S&Gs can you quantify your before/after reported dollar amounts at the different percentages of utilization?  Perhaps there's an unknown dollar threshold that may somewhat reveal itself if you do this.

 

I actually think considering dollars here is actually a smart direction to think in.  I feel like this test likely already has been replicated many times by those with considerably smaller credit limits and it's not often you hear about a possible threshold around the point SJ is referencing. 

Message 16 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@BrutalBodyShots wrote:

@NRB525 wrote:

 

Since we are early into December, when aging thresholds become a hidden driver of score changes, what was your sequence of tracking scores from late November to the change you think of as 6% Overall Utilization as the December 1 threshold was crossed?


SJ stated at the end of Post 7 that the score change happened toward the end of November, thus ruling out a December 1st age of accounts change being a factor.  I too thought earlier in this thread that it could have been the cause here, but it seems it wasn't.


The details about what happened the last two weeks are not provided. The timing has no date sequence provided. 

Even the statement “Recently started getting this EX ‘daily’ score data” is vague. How reliable has this scoring been for the last few months? Has SJ score been predictably moving on this reporting service?

 

Without clear data and time sequence there is no “6% threshold”. 

 

I agree the total dollars involved are likely likely a factor, but I was asking for individual card data on page 1.  

High Bal Jan 2009 $116k on $146k limits 80% Util.
Oct 2014 $46k on $127k 36% util EQ 722 TU 727 EX 727
April 2018 $18k on $344k 5% util EQ 806 TU 810 EX 812

Delta Reserve and CSP Jan 2018, no more 5/24 worries... unless new Chase Marriott/SPG replacement is enticing...meh, turns out not. [unless a 100k points SPG Luxury Upgrade appears... well lookie here...]
Message 17 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@Thomas_Thumb wrote:

@SouthJamaica wrote:


The reason I was able to get clean data -- which is a challenge in my profile -- is that I just subscribed to a new Experian product which gives me daily updates of the report including updates of 4 scores: FICO 8, FICO 2, and an Auto and Bankcard score.  So it's clean data, but only applicable to EX. Several days later on my MyFICO dashboard there was a 6 point increase in TU FICO 8.  So it's possible that it was related, but impossible for me to have any degree of certainty about that one.

 

It didn't occur during the changeover of the month; it occurred earlier.


Please report before/after on all scores received. It is more insightful as various models behave differently. I find it useful to look at Shifts in Classic score compared to Auto and Bankcard. If all three shift the same way more than 5 points, that's a tell sign that some factor fundamental to the algorithm has crossed a threshold.

 

Because # cards with balances, aggregate utilization and individual card utilization (typically highest card UT%) all affect score, it is helpful to mention # cards reporting (say 6 of 20 for example) and highest card UT%. SJ, is all that information available to you on these reports?

 


Great questions @Thomas_Thumb I always learn from you.

 

1. Yes all that information is available to me from these reports.

 

2. There was no change in number of accounts with balances (stayed the same at 12 of 30).

 

3.  There was no instance of a >30% account dropping to <9%.

 

4.  It did not occur on a change of month, it occurred between the 23rd and the 24th, and there was no change to age of anything. 

 

5. The only change was that one account reporting a 25% balance dropped to a 1% balance. There were a total of 8 accounts reporting >9% balances on the 23rd; there were a total of 7 accounts reporting >9% balances on the 24th.

 

6. The changes in the Classic, Auto, and Bankcard scores seem to support your hypothesis that some factor fundamental to the algorithm may have crossed a threshold:

 

Classic 8 +7

FICO 2  +-0

Auto 8 +9

Bankcard 8 +8

 

 

 

 

 

 


FICO8 EQ 755 TU 776 EX 746 Total revolving limits 643900 (533900 reporting)
Message 18 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@BrutalBodyShots wrote:

@NRB525 wrote:

 

Since we are early into December, when aging thresholds become a hidden driver of score changes, what was your sequence of tracking scores from late November to the change you think of as 6% Overall Utilization as the December 1 threshold was crossed?


SJ stated at the end of Post 7 that the score change happened toward the end of November, thus ruling out a December 1st age of accounts change being a factor.  I too thought earlier in this thread that it could have been the cause here, but it seems it wasn't.


Right. It happened between the 23rd of the month and the 24th.

 

 


FICO8 EQ 755 TU 776 EX 746 Total revolving limits 643900 (533900 reporting)
Message 19 of 72
Super Contributor

Re: 6% overall utilization.


@RonM21 wrote:

@SouthJamaica wrote:

 


The reason I was able to get clean data -- which is a challenge in my profile -- is that I just subscribed to a new Experian product which gives me daily updates of the report including updates of 4 scores: FICO 8, FICO 2, and an Auto and Bankcard score.  So it's clean data, but only applicable to EX. Several days later on my MyFICO dashboard there was a 6 point increase in TU FICO 8.  So it's possible that it was related, but impossible for me to have any degree of certainty about that one.

 

It didn't occur during the changeover of the month; it occurred earlier.


SJ, I wonder if you are using the same one I am with Experian.  I think the one I am using is Experian Creditworks or something similar.  The different scores you mentioned that they give sounds similar.  There may even be a couple more.  Just curious that's all. 


I don't even know the name of it, but possibly it's Experian CreditWorks Premium.


FICO8 EQ 755 TU 776 EX 746 Total revolving limits 643900 (533900 reporting)
Message 20 of 72