Are the five factors the same on all scorecards?

[Anonymous]

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@Revelate wrote:

Another easy difference is the lack of AOYA (falls under the new credit bucket of metrics) in the derogatory scorecards.

In broad strokes through much of the algorithms there's a lot of consistency in the reason for changes if not the magnitude, but there are some things like the above which are scorecard dependent.

That said AAOA and inquiries both fall under that new credit bucket and they're in every scorecard AFAIK.

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I came across that in the comments I've been reading.  It's consistent with what the fico score estimator does.  When I answer "yes" to having a collection, the result doesn't change based on the most recent open account being 3, 6, or 12 months ago.

[Anonymous]

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@NRB525 wrote:

When the discussion tries to get too specific about these percentages, disappointing answers are the result. 

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Actually, its the opposite for me.  I've had nagging questions about why scoring doesn't seem to always fit the 35/30/15/10/10 percentages, and it's satisfying to have my thoughts confirmed.  I know that level of detail doesn't matter for most people, but it does for me.  People who learned to program computers "for fun" will know what I mean.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

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So are you saying that credit mix is a factor in all (or most) scorecards?  I'm think I've seen people get 850 scores without open or closed installment loans.

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I would think it is a factor in all scorecards.  How much it matters in terms of signal strength may vary among them though, I don't know.  I think there have been people that have reported an 850 score without an installment loan on this forum due to the top end buffer that has been spoken about previously in this thread.  If all other things are optimized, someone can at times "get away with" not having a factor in place that secures (say) 10-15 points, as those points are made up elsewhere.

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So credit mix is likely a factor in clean scorecards.  But am I correct to also assume it's not always 10% (85 points) of the score?

I also wonder if it is a factor in dirty scorecards at all. For example on the simulator, having 1 vs 5 or more credit cards makes no difference with a collection record (dirty scorecard).  When I say I've never had a loan, it makes no difference either vs having a loan.

[Revelate]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@Anonymous wrote:

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So are you saying that credit mix is a factor in all (or most) scorecards?  I'm think I've seen people get 850 scores without open or closed installment loans.

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I would think it is a factor in all scorecards.  How much it matters in terms of signal strength may vary among them though, I don't know.  I think there have been people that have reported an 850 score without an installment loan on this forum due to the top end buffer that has been spoken about previously in this thread.  If all other things are optimized, someone can at times "get away with" not having a factor in place that secures (say) 10-15 points, as those points are made up elsewhere.

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So credit mix is likely a factor in clean scorecards.  But am I correct to also assume it's not always 10% (85 points) of the score?

I also wonder if it is a factor in dirty scorecards at all. For example on the simulator, having 1 vs 5 or more credit cards makes no difference with a collection record (dirty scorecard).  When I say I've never had a loan, it makes no difference either vs having a loan.

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You would actually be right to assume that it is NEVER 85 points.  FICO scoring doesn't work that way: scorecard segmentation dominates and there's much tighter scoring ranges than the minimum and maximum of the overall algorithm.

Credit mix matters to dirty scorecards too.  Installment utilization for that matter does too on the algorithms that it effects.

Most things I would suggest are applicable to all scorecards, there's just a few things that are flatly different.  BBS is right to suggest the signal strength changes: clean / new files get a much larger swing on revolving utilization changes than older files do (regardless of dirt), and clean files move more for nearly anything than dirty ones do.  Compared to other pretty people any blemish makes you stand out I guess would be the right analogy but it's somewhat tied to wider scoring ranges too and I suspect individual scorecards have some buffering too but that's nearly impossible to prove.

End of the day put as much lipstick on the pig as possible and that means having a diverse set of tradelines between revolving and installment... it's not lost on me that my 60D late Transunion mortgage score is literally gold plated even with that late which occurred less than 2 years ago.  I'm seriously going to be rolling north of 760 on a mortgage pull, 60D may not be the score killer that a BK is but it's still a surprising result albeit a pleasant one too.

[Anonymous]

for a clean thin-file scorecard, if you have nothing on your file but 2 bankcards your creditmix is already "very good" in fluff terms. i know because that's what i'm on.

if you have 3 bankcards your creditmix is doing even better. doing 4+ bankcards actually can drop the creditmix back to what you'd get for 2 bankcards. i know this because it's in those books i posted where fico shows how scorecards work.

so everyone has a creditmix even without doing different types of credit, and it's always a factor in every scorecard.

to get the max points for creditmix you do need more than just one type of credit. but even with bankcards alone you can get close to the max points.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

if you have 3 bankcards your creditmix is doing even better. doing 4+ bankcards actually can drop the creditmix back to what you'd get for 2 bankcards. i know this because it's in those books i posted where fico shows how scorecards work.

so everyone has a creditmix even without doing different types of credit, and it's always a factor in every scorecard.

The drop from 3-4 bankcards would be due to a scorecard change (think->thick), right?

As for creditmix being a factor in every scorecard, have you seen any data points indicating it is a factor in dirty cards?

In particular, is the common suggestion of adding an installment loan (without an open or closed one already on your file) of any benefit on a dirty card?

[Anonymous]

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@Revelate wrote:

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Credit mix matters to dirty scorecards too.  Installment utilization for that matter does too on the algorithms that it effects.

So does an installment loan (open or closed) still help a dirty score when none existed previously?

And keeping with the factors impacting a dirty score, a post you made last year indicates age of revolving accounts doesn't matter on dirty scores.

https://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Understanding-FICO-Scoring/Top-score-on-a-dirty-scorecard/m-p/53100...

Do you still believe this to be the case?

[Anonymous]

i don't know what their criteria is for each scorecard, nobody does, but i believe each scorecard is going to be set up in a fairly similar way. so n+ bankcards takes away creditmix points in all the scorecards. on the fico scorecards i saw it was 4+. the same thing might happen with loans, if you had 4+ loans they could take away points. or retailcards, etc.

in a recent thread bbs said a loan benefits you the most via payment history, and seeing as that's the biggest part of the pie yeah a loan will help every scorecard.

here is what they're looking at in a dirty card. most important to least:

severity of worst delinquincy ever

months since last 30+ days past due

# of inqs in last 12mo

length of credit history

for a dirty file, they punish your payment history, which is the most important part of your score.

here's an example of how they do that.

# of months since most recent derog?

no derog = 75

0-5mo = 10

6-11mo = 15

12-23mo = 25

24+mo = 55

(these aren't the final fico points, they're temp points for adding up your scorecard)

[Anonymous]

everyone on the forum here keeps saying that there are 4 scorecards for dirty files, but that is not true. there's 8 for clean files, 2 for dirty files (probably it's one for late pays, and one for BK) and all of this looks identical to the previous fico versions that used 10 scorecards.

in fico8 they have added 2 new scorecards that only come into play if you are an authorized user on a card. these act as adjustments that tweak your final score. any person with AU card is first run through their own scorecard, then get run through the 2 adjustment scorecards, before their final adjusted score is spit out. so every person with an AU has 3 scorecards.

fico wanted to ban AU's to prevent AU piggybacking, but the govt wouldn't allow them to do it. so instead they came up with this idea of using scorecards to ruin your score if they think you're misusing the AU system.

so that is the 12 scorecards for fico8. 8 clean, 2 dirty, 2 au adjustment cards.

[Remedios]

Creds, would you mind listing the source for your claims, especially the one about government making FI do anything?