Interesting small point lost from loan payoff

[dragontears]

I have an interesting data point for paying off an installment loan that is contrary to popular wisdom here on the forums. 

Profile information:

2 open mortgages, one is only 5 months old 

2-3 personal loans 

1 auto loan 

1 HELOC 

12 credit cards, aggregated utilization 6%

AAOA 6y4m to 7y1m depending on CRA 

AoYRA >2 years

So I opened a new personal loan (credit union, SP approval) that reported last week and as expected there was no point loss on the FICO 8 models. 

I also paid off a personal loan on 12/1, yesterday the payoff hit EX and there was a 4 point loss.

There was no card balance changes this week so I am pretty sure the point change was due to the loan closing. My total loan utilization is still high as my most recent mortgage is 330k and swamps any changes in loan utilization for all of my other loans. 

@Anonymous @SouthJamaica 

[Anonymous]

The only things I would look toward are number of of accounts with a balance changing and your ratio of open loans to revolvers with that recent loan closure.

Also as an aside, your AAoA is right around known threshold points, 78 months for example.  Crossing that point could be "worth" 4 points... so opening a new account could have dropped you across it, then in a couple of months at the same time another profile change happened you could cross back over that threshold and regain the 4 points, assuming it came from whatever profile change was in question.  I would just keep an eye on that while you're looking at other factors.

[dragontears]

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@Anonymous wrote:

The only things I would look toward are number of of accounts with a balance changing and your ratio of open loans to revolvers with that recent loan closure.

Also as an aside, your AAoA is right around known threshold points, 78 months for example.  Crossing that point could be "worth" 4 points... so opening a new account could have dropped you across it, then in a couple of months at the same time another profile change happened you could cross back over that threshold and regain the 4 points, assuming it came from whatever profile change was in question.  I would just keep an eye on that while you're looking at other factors.

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The new loan reported last week and there was no score change at that time, I also had a card balance change report after the new loan so I do not think that the small point loss was due to the new loan. 

[Anonymous]

I guess it depends on how you're defining "due to the new loan." 

If you mean due to the Amounts Owed slice of the Fico pie related to installment loan utilization, you could be right.

But, an additional account with a balance or a change to loan:revolver ratio could also be a factor, two criteria that would change "due to the new loan."

[dragontears]

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@Anonymous wrote:

I guess it depends on how you're defining "due to the new loan." 

If you mean due to the Amounts Owed slice of the Fico pie related to installment loan utilization, you could be right.

But, an additional account with a balance or a change to loan:revolver ratio could also be a factor, two criteria that would change "due to the new loan."

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I was specifically referring to your implication that the point loss was due to ab AAOA change with the new loan 

[Anonymous]

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@dragontears wrote:

I have an interesting data point for paying off an installment loan that is contrary to popular wisdom here on the forums. 

Profile information:

2 open mortgages, one is only 5 months old 

2-3 personal loans 

1 auto loan 

1 HELOC 

12 credit cards, aggregated utilization 6%

AAOA 6y4m to 7y1m depending on CRA 

AoYRA >2 years

So I opened a new personal loan (credit union, SP approval) that reported last week and as expected there was no point loss on the FICO 8 models. 

I also paid off a personal loan on 12/1, yesterday the payoff hit EX and there was a 4 point loss.

There was no card balance changes this week so I am pretty sure the point change was due to the loan closing. My total loan utilization is still high as my most recent mortgage is 330k and swamps any changes in loan utilization for all of my other loans. 

@Anonymous @SouthJamaica 

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@dragontears When did you actually open the recent loan? Could it have been coded as a mortgage pull and the ding delayed 30 days? If not, then I agree it was likely due to the loan closure, as you say it was isolated, right?

I need to go check EX8, but some variants treat mortgage loans and other loans separately, causing me to ponder which direction your aggregate non-mortgage loan utilization and balances went?

I'm thinking... but changes that small are hard to nail down sometimes. 

accounts with balance would change, but should still go down and the revolver:loan ratio shouldn't be implicated since adding a loan caused no point change, so I would think removing one wouldn't cause a change. So if anything change in # of accounts would cause a gain, not a loss, imho. Good thoughts tho.

[dragontears]

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@Anonymous wrote:

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@dragontears wrote:

I have an interesting data point for paying off an installment loan that is contrary to popular wisdom here on the forums. 

Profile information:

2 open mortgages, one is only 5 months old 

2-3 personal loans 

1 auto loan 

1 HELOC 

12 credit cards, aggregated utilization 6%

AAOA 6y4m to 7y1m depending on CRA 

AoYRA >2 years

So I opened a new personal loan (credit union, SP approval) that reported last week and as expected there was no point loss on the FICO 8 models. 

I also paid off a personal loan on 12/1, yesterday the payoff hit EX and there was a 4 point loss.

There was no card balance changes this week so I am pretty sure the point change was due to the loan closing. My total loan utilization is still high as my most recent mortgage is 330k and swamps any changes in loan utilization for all of my other loans. 

@Anonymous @SouthJamaica 

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@dragontears When did you actually open the recent loan? Could it have been coded as a mortgage pull and the ding delayed 30 days? If not, then I agree it was likely due to the loan closure, as you say it was isolated, right?

I need to go check EX8, but some variants treat mortgage loans and other loans separately, causing me to ponder which direction your aggregate non-mortgage loan utilization and balances went?

I'm thinking... but changes that small are hard to nail down sometimes. 

accounts with balance would change, but should still go down and the revolver:loan ratio shouldn't be implicated since adding a loan caused no point change, so I would think removing one wouldn't cause a change. Good thoughts tho. 

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There was no HP for the new loan (yes I got a personal loan from a CU with just a SP as they sent me a preapproval) the loan was opened 11/9. I will have to calculate non-mortgage before and after later when I get off of work