@HiLine wrote:
@Ubuntu wrote:Intellectually I understand that this is just a different model and nothing has really changed but my score dropped from 802 to 732.
Emotionally that is seriously depressing...
Think about it this way.
You step on an European scale and see 73 (kilos)
Then you step on an American scale and see 170 (lbs)
Hope that isn't seriously depressing ...
I love your scale analogy except it's in reverse for me. If my scale, which I've been using for years suddenly gave me my weight in kgs one day instead of lbs I would be pleasantly shocked until I figured it out instead of momentarily thinking years of credit rebuilding had gone down the drain.
Now that you've mentioned kilos do you think they make scales that use stone? Then I'd only weigh about 12... I'd never care if I gained a stone or two 
@Ubuntu wrote:
@ficonightmare wrote:
@Ubuntu wrote:Intellectually I understand that this is just a different model and nothing has really changed but my score dropped from 802 to 732.
Emotionally that is seriously depressing...
I have a clean but sparse history. For a long time the only accounts I had listed were both perfectly maintained AU accounts. In July of 2013 I applied for a card in my name and then another in October. I can see from the free EQ report that MyFICO gave me today that my AAoA dropped from 6 years to 9 months. It looks like AU accounts are of no use in FICO 08. Good thing I started when I did or the drop would've been evern bigger.
I'm trying to find something positive in this and I guess I get to enjoy watching my score start creeping up again instead of always being about the same.
I've been planning to app for an Amex in July when one of my new accounts reaches a year old and two of my three inquiries also age over one year. Now I'm afraid to apply but in desparate need of an approval so I can get a sweet backdate to 1994 and hopefully my score jumps back up near 800. One can dream...
I understand what you're saying, but two things I'd like to point out.
Everytime you "think" your scored dropped, remind yourself it did not. When you app'd for your cards in July and October, if they pulled EQ they most likely already saw the 08 score. You're just seeing it now for the first time, that's all.
It's not a "new" score, nor did it "drop". It was there since Eq 08 went into effect. You just need to keep reminding yourself of that.
Also, I'm not sure you're correct about the AU account.
I read that it's supposed to (somehow) decipher the fake AU's- and those are the ones that won't get counted. But it should still count legitimate AU's such as spouses/children.
On my report, it is counting them. I ran my report on 5/27 (old version) and then again on 5/28 (new version, free report) and my AAofA is exactly the same.
Regarding the first part of your reply I get it (I do, I really do), no change, no drop, just different scoring model. That's what I tried to say in the first sentence of my post, you just said it much better that I did. The 70 point "drop" did cause some momentary anxiety though. When I glanced at the email today I didn't register that it was different than the standard ones so my reaction on seeing the FICO 08 score was identity theft but I quickly realized what had really happened.
Regarding AAoA there's pretty conclusive evidence that this scoring model is no longer considering my AU cards in two or possibly three areas.
The most recent full EQ report I have is from June 2013. It lists only my two AU accounts with an AAoA of 12 years, shows my "Length of credit history" as "Very Good", my UTIL as 4%, and my "Amount of debt" as "Great".
Since then I've added two cards of my own, one in July 2013 which has reported for 10 months and one in October 2013 which has reported for 8 months. My current TU report (from myFICO) shows an AAoA of 6 years and a UTIL of 4% which is accurate for all 4 accounts and shows my "Length of credit history" as "Very Good".
The EQ report they gave me today shows an AAoA of 9 months which is the exact average for my two new cards (10+8=18/2=9 for those who hate numbers), lists my "Length of credit history" as "Bad", and shows my UTIL as 0% which is accurate for my two new cards but would be 2% if it included my two AU cards. It also shows my "Amount of debt" as "Very Good" when it's been "Great" in all previous reports which doesn't make much sense. The only justification for that to change would be if it's factoring out the CLs of my new cards but sill factoring in the amount owed on the one AU card with a balance which is the only debt I have.
My AU accounts are being listed along with their limits, payment histories, and the amount owed on the one with a balance. My "Credit History" does show as 18 years which is the age of the oldest AU account so they're not completely ignored but they're definitely missing from my AAoA and UTIL.
As you mention it would make sense if they attempt to weed out fraudulent / piggybacked AU accounts. Logically that doesn't seem like it would be part of a scoring formula thought. From a business logic perspective such a test would appropriately be a separate process that occurred prior to any scoring model being applied. The primary on the accounts is my fiancee so we have different last names but we've had the same address for the last 8 years which they should be able to detect but I don't know what kind of analysis they do in that regard.
At any rate my AU cards are not used in most of the metrics on today's report. While it's puzzling I'm very glad to hear that that hasn't happened in your case.
Accoding to this link: http://www.myfico.com/crediteducation/questions/fico8.aspx
the new scoring formula does attempt to identify piggybacked AU's. Or at least what it deems to be piggbacking.
So who knows if the different names was enough for it to flag and exclude those accounts.
Starting Score: 600s
Interesting; when the names change, you might get the AU's back but it's still smart to have your own tradelines anyway.
I imagine it's probably something along the lines of both last name and address matching for an AU to be effective, or in this case apparently last name appears to be moderately confirmed anecdotally. I do appreciate your posting your findings Ubuntu! We've been wondering about that.
@Revelate wrote:Interesting; when the names change, you might get the AU's back but it's still smart to have your own tradelines anyway.
I imagine it's probably something along the lines of both last name and address matching for an AU to be effective, or in this case apparently last name appears to be moderately confirmed anecdotally. I do appreciate your posting your findings Ubuntu! We've been wondering about that.
I don't think it will always exclude if the name and address are different either.
For instance, I've been an AU on a bunch of my mom's card since I was a teenager. All of them are old, closed accounts but one. This one card (Chase), she apparently kept me on as an AU.
My address has been different for over 15 years, and my name- I had it hyphenated when I got married about 10 years ago.
Yet, that card is still on my reports and factoring into my overall AAofA and CL's.
I think FICO looks at the history of AU's. So in my case, under "Personal Information", where it lists "Previous Address", the oldest address listed happens to be my parents.
So it definitely takes other things into consideration when it decides to include. or exclude AU's. Like I'm a guessing a history.
It could also just automatically just exclude none family members in this version.. who knows..
@ficonightmare wrote:
@Revelate wrote:Interesting; when the names change, you might get the AU's back but it's still smart to have your own tradelines anyway.
I imagine it's probably something along the lines of both last name and address matching for an AU to be effective, or in this case apparently last name appears to be moderately confirmed anecdotally. I do appreciate your posting your findings Ubuntu! We've been wondering about that.
I don't think it will always exclude if the name and address are different either.
For instance, I've been an AU on a bunch of my mom's card since I was a teenager. All of them are old, closed accounts but one. This one card (Chase), she apparently kept me on as an AU.
My address has been different for over 15 years, and my name- I had it hyphenated when I got married about 10 years ago.
Yet, that card is still on my reports and factoring into my overall AAofA and CL's.
I think FICO looks at the history of AU's. So in my case, under "Personal Information", where it lists "Previous Address", the oldest address listed happens to be my parents.
So it definitely takes other things into consideration when it decides to include. or exclude AU's. Like I'm a guessing a history.
It could also just automatically just exclude none family members in this version.. who knows..
True, it's likely more sophisticated than we believe and the databases do have tons of information which doesn't get reported to us potentially. Hard to theorize more except to state that when looked at from a historical data perspective, both marriages and births are pretty well tracked, so it wouldn't be that hard if the data has been collected (no doubt it has been, question is who) to do something like that in addition to the prior addresses as you likely correctly suggest.
@Anonymous wrote:
@tallamy wrote:I know that 743 isn't a bad score, but when it was 748 it was better. I believe I lost five points 1/20/14 because I attempted to take advantage of a "pre-approved" credit card offer. Apparently "pre-approved" doesn't really mean "approved." I was denied and I'm sure that's why my score went down.
I've been working to re-establish a higher score and now have zero balance on three (soon to be four) of my eight accounts.
I was rewarded by a high score of 757 on 5/30/14 but now have a score of 742 as of 5/31/14 which is an "upgraded Fico score." Nothing has changed expect paying down on my accounts. Other accounts, although high, have not increased.
Why? Why? Why? is my score now LOWER than the 743 that I was working so hard to increase? Why am I being penalized with a lower score due to an "upgrade?" Doesn't upgrade mean "better?"
Any ideas? Has something been miscalculated? Do I need to close my zero balance accounts?
Thank you in advance for any information that I can use to feel better about the 757 score that was lowered to 742 in a 24-hour period.
Here's a description of what has changed in the 08 model. One item that may apply is the greater hit for high utilization.
There's not a single "right" score, and if you switch scoring models, your score may go up or down.
http://www.myfico.com/crediteducation/questions/fico8.aspx
What is not right about the FICO 04?
