myFICO vs. Equifax Complete

[Anonymous]

I apologize, my text editing went haywire. I'll work on another response.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Very well written and totally credable if I accept your premise that the credit scoring makes sense, is fair and balanced, and accurate.

I dont accept that premise which is the reason I posted in the first place.

Allow me to repeat myself a little.

Equifax says my score with Equifax is 704 Who cares?  No lender uses this score.

MyFico, our host here, says my Equifax score is 676/678 or so.

Why is it I question why MyFico has a better understanding of my Equifax score than Equifax does or so they would appear to think? Because lenders actually use the scores that are based on the FICO models.

I think I have a reasonable question, No? It was a reasonable question the first time you asked it.  To keep asking it with Equifax themselves and several members telling you that no lender uses the Equifax Credit Score makes it a little unreasonable.

I maintain there exists way too much disparity reporting agency to reporting agency.

In a perfect world I certainly agree with everything you've said.

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Again quoting Equifax "The Equifax Credit Score is intended for your own educational use. It is also commercially available to third parties along with numerous other credit scores and models in the marketplace. Please keep in mind third parties are likely to use a different score when evaluating your creditworthiness."

If someone has a 640 credit score, there is a reason.

If your FICO 8 scores from here are "676/678 or so" based upon what you have told us "No bad stuff reported", you are missing something in the reports. The reports here all tell your "ingredients" and "factors." If I had to hazard a guess, its likely you have utilization issues from a scoring perspective as you have only two cards.

If you want to debate the difference between a score no lender uses and scores lender's use, you probably won't find too much help.

If you'd care to talk about your personal situation and how to get your FICO scores (the ones lenders use) up into the 700s, you will get excellent advice here from knowledgeable individuals.

After reading here, from nothing more than cleaning up my reports for scoring reasons, I have gone from 716/732/718 to 740/744/745.  And I do have bad stuff reported.  Learn from this place and help your clients.

Text is a terrible form of open communication for conveying emotion.  When I read this, it does not sound compassionate or understanding.  Please know that I am sincere and trying to be helpful and not good at conveying that in text.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Very well written and totally credable if I accept your premise that the credit scoring makes sense, is fair and balanced, and accurate.

I dont accept that premise which is the reason I posted in the first place.

Allow me to repeat myself a little.

Equifax says my score with Equifax is 704

I will echo what everyone else has said once again. Equifax is selling you a bogus score. The fine print even tells you that it is NOT the model used by credit grantors. It's noted as proprietary because nobody else on the face of the earth uses it. I know it seems like Equifax should give you its Equifax FICO score, but that's not what you're getting from them, and you need to just accept that fact.

MyFico, our host here, says my Equifax score is 676/678 or so.

Why is it I question why MyFico has a better understanding of my Equifax score than Equifax does or so they would appear to think?

MyFICO is selling you a true FICO8 score. FICO scores are used by lenders, not whatever Equifax sold you. I don't know that MyFICO necessarily has a better understanding, but since they are run by the same people who sell FICO scores to credit grantors, it's in their best interest to sell you a true FICO score. As pointed out earlier, it is NOT in Equifax's interest to sell you a FICO score, as they see a greater profit by selling you their proprietary model (again, it's proprietary because nobody else uses it).

I think I have a reasonable question, No?

I maintain there exists way too much disparity reporting agency to reporting agency.

There is no disparity really. Creditors pull FICO scores. When they pull your Equifax FICO, they will get the score that MyFICO shows (assuming they pull FICO8), and they will never pull the score based on Equifax's proprietary scoring model (and almost never the Vantage model used by Credit Karma). These services are used as educational tools to give you a general idea of your credit situation. However, if you want to know what lenders will see, then you should only be looking at the FICO models.

In a perfect world I certainly agree with everything you've said.

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Use MyFICO (or CCT) as the source of truth for FICO scores. Everything else is background noise. You will be clearer (and happier) if you simply eliminate the noise then go from there.

[Anonymous]

For someone who works in the mortgage industry, I would have thought you would have a better understanding of what we have tried to convey.  (Not trying to be hard or harsh). 

Equifax, Experian and Transunion house or store the credit data, they DO NOT interpret the data. The intrepretation or credit score is determined by whatever algorithm is used to intreprete what the EQ, EX and TU data says. The prevailing algorithm score model is FICO, which is used by around 90% of lenders. There is also the Vantage algorithm model which is used by 10%. There are other variations used, but if the market uses the Fico 8 score 90% of the time, all the others including your Equifax Complete are meaningless, irrelevant and unimportant. You can continue to use that score, but only you, Equifax and those who have also subscribed to that Equifax Complete subscription will care, no one else. Sorry but you're paying for something that's not relevant. Being on myfico.com, it should be clear that FICO is the 800 or 850 pound gorilla. It is what it is. 

You are not comparing apples to apples when comparing myFICO vs. Equifax Complete score. So the comparison is not fully accurate or spot on. That is why I have repeatedly encouraged you to sign up and get your Fico scores. You can do it on myfico.com or CCT. 

You should be able to understand that the three credit bureau compile the data. But they leave it to a computer algorithm to calcuate the credit score using a standard mathematical formula. The main formula used is Fico. I don't see how it could be explained any clearer. 

Even Credit Check Total is operated by Experian, but the scores that are offered are Fico 8 scores and not the Experian Complete score, or Experian Special score, or Experian Plus score or whatever. They are Fico 8 scores. Thus Experian uses its data on you, and pulls your data from EQ and TU and then runs that data through Fico's math algorithm. Voila your Fico score, a score any lender or you can understand, use and compare. The same cannot be said about the Equifax Complete score. 

It's pretyy simple. 

[elim]

FICO is a software company founded by Bill Fair and Earl Isaac in 1956. Its FICO score, a measure of consumer credit risk, is used by about 90% of the Lenders in the US.  In 2013, lenders purchased more than 10 billion FICO scores. The problem lately? Every idiot around is selling their own useless version of credit scores to consumers who don't know the difference. Greed being the motive of course.

Equifax is a Credit Reporting Agency, They aren't really in the Credit Score business, So they buy/sell their scores from FICO (and also sell their own useless version, you know, for the money).

[Thomas_Thumb]

Neither credit card issuers nor mortgage lenders look at propriatary credit scores from a CRA (such as Equifax) when evaluating credit worthiness. They look at the Fico scores - Why? Quite simply because Fico scores are the bulk of available historical data. That information provides a comprehensive data set for comparing you against everyone else.

Therefore, if you need new credit, focus on your Fico scores. If your scores are below a target level, look at the details in your credit report to determine what's hurting your score. Then identify ways you can address the areas of concern. People on the forum can help but only after you come to terms accepting the Fico score standard.

FYI - I purchased both my Equifax score and my mortgage Fico 4 (Beacon 5)  from Equifax in August 2014 and again in April 2015. Again the scores were purchased from Equifax and sent to me by Equifax. Here are the results:

1) August 2014:. Equifax score = 825, Fico 4 (Beacon 5) score = 777 (48 point difference)

2) April 2015:..... Equifax score = 826, Fico 4 (Beacon 5) score = 796 (30 point difference)

As you can see the Equifax model scored my profile higher than did the Fico 4 model. As a side note, I also purchased my EQ Fico 4 score directly from MyFICO at the end of March 2015 and it was 796 - exact match with what Equifax reported.

Other, non Fico credit scoring models, can be very good predictors of credit worthiness. For example, VantageScore 3.0 is very robust and is an excellent predictor of credit worthiness. These scores and tracking are available free through Credit Karma. Unfortunately, even though the model is sound, it is not widely used by lenders - so if someone wants new credit or a loan, it is best to check their Fico score.

[Anonymous]

Thanks to all for taking the time and trouble to answer my question and try to help clear the fog for me.

I truly do appreciate your efforts and I do mean that with all sincerity.

Although I do understand what all of you are saying in that I have somewhere around a 4th grade understanding of the language, I still do not understand it at all.

I'm told that lenders do not use Equifax (for example) but lenders tell me they do.

Some use Equifax score

Some use Experian score

Some use Trans Union score

That is told to me by individual lenders.

So, if a lender tells me that they use Equifax score in making their decision and my Equifax score is 704 then I would imagine that the lender will pull a 704 from Equifax re me.

My arguement is that the scoring system is not easy to understand.

My arguement is that there is disparity in reporting scores.

My arguement is that a persons credit worth is determined by which reporting agency the lender uses and when (time of the month) the question is asked of the reporting agency.

An example of the third arguement is if a credit card reports to the reporting agencies on the 27th of the month then it's only an issue of knowing how much is owed on the card on the 26th of the month and determining to pay all/part, whatever to determine if your credit score will go up or down.

Then run it back up again if you so wish on the 28th.

Everything will remain the same until the 27th comes around again.

I think it's all a matter of manipulation of the system but first you must understand how the system works.

I think understanding how the system works is doable.

Then, manipulating the sstem also becomes quite doable as well and I think people do that all the time.

Thanks guys for the imput however my narrow minded perhaps closed minded viewpoint hasn't changed at all.

[Anonymous]

Lenders use the data drawn from EQ/EX/TU, but the score is derived from or based on or comes from a version of the FICO algorithm. 

EQ Data + Fico Formula = EQ Fico Score (Standard used by 90% of lenders)

EQ Data + EQ Complete Formula = EQ Complete Score (Used by no one)

The two equations above are totally different and thus the scores are different. 

Your issue is not so much you can't understand what's been said over the past couple of days, it is that you don't want to understand that's how the system works and 90% of lenders use this system. All the other stuff from moralizing about if it is or isn't fair, and manipulating the system is all background noise that has no effect on how the current scoring system actually works and the difference between data and math formulations that are used to interprete or calculate a score based on the data. 

Data + Formula = Score

Same Data + Different Formula = Different Score

[Thomas_Thumb]

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@Anonymous wrote:

Thanks to all for taking the time and trouble to answer my question and try to help clear the fog for me.

I truly do appreciate your efforts and I do mean that with all sincerity.

Although I do understand what all of you are saying in that I have somewhere around a 4th grade understanding of the language, I still do not understand it at all.

I'm told that lenders do not use Equifax (for example) but lenders tell me they do.

Some use Equifax score - Incorrect understanding of statement from lender.

* The lender is telling you they use data from your Equifax credit report and that data is used to generate a Fico score.

Some use Experian score - Incorrect understanding of statement from lender

* The lender is telling you they use data from your Experian credit report and that data is used to generate a Fico score.

Some use Trans Union score - Incorrect understanding of statement from lender

* The lender is telling you they use data from your TransUnion credit report and that data is used to generate a Fico score

That is told to me by individual lenders.

So, if a lender tells me that they use Equifax score in making their decision and my Equifax score is 704 then I would imagine that the lender will pull a 704 from Equifax re me.(This is an incorrect conclusion- the lender is saying they will use a Fico score that is generated from your Equifax credit report... the lender is NOT saying they are using an educational Equifax model score)

Thanks guys for the imput however my narrow minded perhaps closed minded viewpoint hasn't changed at all.

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As I illustrated to you previously, Equifax has a credit report with your credit history. The information in the Equifax credit report is used to generate credit scores. Equifax sells credit reports to you or lenders and the report they sell is used to generate Fico credit scores. Lenders then look at the Fico score to determine if you are a good credit risk.

Equifax does offer consumers credit scores based on your Equifax credit score information. The scores Equifax offers include:

1) Equifax model credit score based on Equifax credit report information (not used by lenders)

2) Fico model credit score based on Equifax credit report information (used by lenders)

[Anonymous]

I'm not explaining myself well at all and for that I apologize.

I'm the same person with all three reporting agencies.

BUT...........Depending on which agency I'm "Good" to "Fair"

Now, there's no disparity in reporting agencies happening?

Of course there's disparity and very unequal reporting and scoring.

Between Equifax, Trans, Experian I vary about thirty points.

There is disparity in reporting and scoring.

And yes, I can go to each and drive a C47 thru the varying scores from each depending on which FICO what we're looking at.

FICO 8, 5, 3. whichever

Scores varying from which FICO number and which reporting agaency.

THERE IS NO UNIFORM SYSTEM REPORTING AGENCY TO REPORTING AGENCY, SCORE TO SCORE ONE VS THE OTHER

THERE IS ONE HELL OF ALOT OF DISPARITY ONE VS THE OTHER

I'm a "good" risk or a "fair" risk depending on who you ask.

The system is flawed