Experian refuses to remove account! UGHH!!!

[Anonymous]

I am having a monumental time trying to get Experian to delete an account which has already reached the 7 year mark since last payment.

Long story short, we had a short sale which the last payment made before defaulting was on SEPTEMBER 2013.

As such, it was supposed to be removed this past September.

TransUnion and Equifax both deleted it automatically but for some reason, Experian refuses to do so.

I had always noticed that both Equifax and TransUnion, were showing September 2013 as the date of last activity, while Experian is showing that field blank.

Equifax and TransUnion BOTH deleted the account as soon as September arrived.

It's already October and after several disputes with Experian, they refuse to do so. They claim that it is set to drop off on July 2021. When I look at my credit report, I notice that it says July 2014 as LAST UPDATED while Last Activity is blank.

I guess since Last Activity is blank, they are going off by the last updated date. As far as I know, that is illegal, right? The 7 years is 7 years since the last activity/payment before going into default/short sale.

I called the lender but since the account is so old now and closed, they can't even find my account by SS or Loan Number. Nothing shows up on their system.

If this is the case, then how is Experian "verifying" as correct their info on my report when I can't even get the lender to find my account yet Equifax and TransUnion had no problems dropping it off on time.

What else can I do? I have reached out to everyone and it seems like nothing can be done.

Any help will be greatly appreciated.

I currently have an open dispute with Experian again and I'm hoping you guys can help me with what I can upload to Experian's case file, be it a letter or something, that would help with my dispute and getting this **bleep** account removed.

Thanks in advance!

[OmarGB9]

Paging @RobertEG for help for you. He should have the answer.

[RobertEG]

When, specifically, did you miss your first mortgage payment, what delinquencies have been reported in payments that were due before the short sale, was completed, and when was the short sale approved by the lendor and actually executed?

Exclusion under the FCRA of creditor account information applies only to specific items of reported information that are adverse.  FCRA 605 provides four subsections that relate to very spefic adverse items of information, and set perods and conditions pertaining to those items (i.e., bankruptcies, civil judgments, tax liens, and collections or charge-offs) in subsections (a)(1) - (a)(4).  Any other adverse item of information not covered under any of subsextions (a)(1) - (a)(4) then are governed by the catch-all provisions of subsection (a)(5), such as monthly delinquencies, a repo, foreclosure, or a short sale.  

Accordingly, the entire account is not subject to credit report exclusion once the exclusion period has expired.

Only the specific individual items become excluded, each at 7 years from the date of the adverse item of information.

It is thus necessary to list each adverse item of reported information and know its occurence date before its credit report exclusion period/date can be determined.

Please provide the type and date of occurence of all reported adverse items of information.

[Anonymous]

@RobertEG 

Good morning sir,

The last payment made was on September 2013. After that we went default and it wasn't until July 2014 that the short sale was approved/executed and the home was sold.

Here are screenshots of all the details shown in the credit report for this account.

[RobertEG]

Thanks for the more detailed screen shot of the actual derogs reported on the account.

It helps to identify the issue in determining the credit report exclusion date and confusion.  It shows only the reporting of "CO/Other Derogatory" as of July 2014, and does not report any monthly delinquencies prior to that time, so no DOFD can be inferred.

Please bear with the lengthy discussion in this response, but the nature of how a short sale is reported has a bearing on how it is treated for exclusion by the CRA.  The interpretation being made by Exp is, in my opinion, clearly warranted, but by no means totally objective.

First and foremost, there are no specific codes used by the big-3 CRAs in theri common credit reporting manual, the "Credit Reporting Resource Guide,"  for explicitly reporting a short sale. It is common for creditors to broadly report a short sale as a "CO/Other Derogatory Item," rather than explicit reporting of a short sale.

Additionally, FCRA 605(a), which is the section of the FCRA that defines credit report exclusion requirements, does not provide an explicit subsection defining exclusion or reporting of a short sale, and as such, is covered broadly under the catch-all provisions of subsection 605(a)(5) as being 7 years from the date of occurence of the adverse item of information.

More specifically, if the short sale was executed in July 2014, then the exclusion date would properly be July 2021, as is being stated by Exp.

The official Experian policy regarding reporting of a short sale is set forth on their web page as follows in response to an inquiry made to them:

______________________
"Dear Experian,

How long is a short sale on your credit report? We did a short sale in December 2010, and it is still on our credit report.

- SPG

"Dear SPG,
The term "short sale" does not appear in a credit report. When you negotiate a short sale, the lender is agreeing to accept less than the full amount owed on the mortgage, and will likely report the account as settled for less than the full balance.

"If you were delinquent on payments leading up to the short sale, the account will remain on your report for seven years from the original delinquency date of the mortgage.

"If your payments were never late, the mortgage will remain on your credit report seven years from the date it was reported settled or paid.

"Failing to pay your mortgage debt in full will always have a very negative affect on your credit scores. With time, the negative impact on your credit scores will decrease. However, it will likely have at least some negative impact on your credit scores as long as it remains on your credit report.

"Thanks for asking.
The "Ask Experian" team "

___________________________________

As such, I see no clear error in the exclusion date being used by Experan.

As a possible alternative interpretaion of the exclusion of a short sale, I offer the following path.

It can be argued that a short sale, if reported as only a CO and not as some other type of derogatory item, would be covered, not under the broad provisions of FCRA 605(a)(5), but rther under the more detailed provisions of FCRA 605(a)(4), which pertains to reporting of a charge to profit and loss, or its equivalent.

If considered as being equivlent to a charge to profit and loss, then the exclusion date would become no laterthan 7 years plus 6 months from the DOFD (see FCRA 605(c)), and not 7 years from date of taking of the short sale itself.

You could attempt to make that argument in a dispute under the FCRA of the accuracy of using the short sale date as opposed to the DOFD, and see if they agree.  However, since the creditor has not reported any prior delinquencies before the reporting of the short sale as a CO/Other Derogatory, you would also have to include in your dispute an assertion that prior monthly delinquencies occured before the execution of the short sale, and thus that the debt was delinquent at the time of the short sale, thus requiring the use of DOFD rather than date of the short sale.

In summary, I dont see that the interpretation being made by Exp is clearly erroneous, but also would argue that it is not the only possible interpretation of when a short sale would become excluded,  It depends upon how it has been reported, which is not precise under the CRA reporting manual.

[Anonymous]

@RobertEG 

Wow, I am in awe for such a well put and informative response. You sure have helped me understand this much better.

So if I'm not mistaken, technically, EX doesn't even know this is a short sale, correct? The way the report is laid out, it seems like a run of the mill charge off account that was paid in full for less than balance owed?

With that being said, if I can find proof that the last payment before going delincuent was made on September 2013, then I can dispute it that way instead of them having to go by the date the short sale was completed?

Actually, on my last dispute, EX indicated that according to their investigation on the dispute filed, the account is set to fall off on APRIL 2021. This is what they told me was the result of the investigation.

If you noticed, there is a 90-day late due entry of JULY 2014.

Could it be that they are indeed treating it as a CO and by seeing that 90-day late due entry of July 2014, they simply assume the last payment was 3 months PRIOR which would fall on APRIL 2014.

Maybe this is why they told me the account will be removed on April 2021.

If that is the case, maybe I could call them and try for an EE?

[RobertEG]

If your last timely payment was in Sept 2013, then the first delinquency would be Oct 2013.

However, a creditor is only required to explicitly report a DOFD to the CRA is they have reported a charge-off or collection to the CRA.  See FCRA 623(a)(5).  To mandate reporting of and use of DOFD as basis for credit report exclusion, you would have to have a  clear reporting of a charge-off, and not alternate reporting of "CO/Other Delinquency."

The screen shot does not show that the account was delinquent at the time the debt was discharged in July 2014, and does not show that the debt discharge was a short sale.  It only shows as Paid/Settled for Less, and provides no payment history profile to support any assertion that it was, in fact, delinquent when discharged.

There is thus no current reporting to substantiate the assertion that it should be treated as a charge-off on a delinquent account, and thus use of DOFD as the begin date for the credit report exclusion period.

You can dispute the completeness of the reported payment history profile as lacking a showing of delinquencies from Oct 2013 until it was paid in July 2014.

You would also need to dispute the lack of reporting of a clear CO or its equivalent in order to mandate the reporting and use of DOFD.