The Futility of Trying to Improve FICO

[Anonymous]

Wow.  The US Government sure has singled you out for persecution.  You're like Job.  Godspeed, man.

[Anonymous]

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twnkltoz wrote:

Wow.  The US Government sure has singled you out for persecution.  You're like Job.  Godspeed, man.

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"Persecution" is a bit strong of a word, but I do believe that, given the relatively small dollar amounts of my charge-offs, my credit rating has been hit unduly hard.  There are people who had bankruptcies involving tens of thousands in debt about the time I had my charge-offs, and they are already back up to 650 or so and climbing, whereas I, with my ~$900 in charge-offs, am permanently languishing around 575.

So yes, I do believe the FICO scoring system is inherently flawed and unfair.  And rather than spit into the wind trying to change it, I am choosing to relocate to a place where it is irrelevant.  But I am still participating in these forums because I feel I have quite a bit of knowledge about the system to share.  I know what I should have done differently, but it's too late for me to ever raise my score.  It might not be too late for others I can advise.

And I also do hope the architects of FICO read these forums.  Perhaps they will understand the perspective of those of us who have been victimized by FICO, and will realize that if they do not provide a path to recovery for people like me, we will turn our backs on the whole credit and banking system.

[SoulSmilen]

Ugh.. I read this thread and my fingers just won't stay off the keyboard...

New World, what a crock - plain and simple. There isn't much in this world that is uncontrollable, and believe me, I'm not preaching without knowing what it's like and where you've been. The bottom line is, you COULD have controlled the bad debt to begin with by being prepared for hard times. You're not in that boat alone; almost all of us here have a story and reasons why we have bad marks on our credit. You are not unique, and you are not a victim. Did you have a savings account or 401K you could fall back on when you faced your hard times? Obviously not. Is that your fault? You're dern right it is - no ifs, ands, or buts.

It's also MY fault that I didn't have anything to fall back on when I was in a freak accident that left me partially paralyzed and needing several surgeries and years of rehab to get back on my feet, financially and physically. It's not FICO's fault, it's not my creditors' fault, and it is CERTAINLY not because I am a victim of anything (except for my OWN stupidity and poor planning).

I get back on my feet, go to work and start over, then boom, I'm hit with a deadly disease that almost gets the best of me - my fault? Most assuredly my fault, because I didn't take better care of my health to prevent it, didn't have medical insurance, so I didn't go to the doctor soon enough. I survived, took control of things, started over and I'm building again... 3 years ago I get hit with a chronic disease that is crippling and could leave me severely disabled in a few years. I lost my job of almost a year because I was a couple weeks short of working there long enough to be eligible for the disability insurance. My fault? Maybe not the disease itself, but the extremity of its affects on me and once again not planning for hard times are.. you got it.. MY fault.

I am a single parent (for 15 years), make less than 40K/year, have paid off as many of my collections as I could over the last few years, have managed my money wisely in the last 2 years, and my credit score has raised almost 100 points in only a year. So don't tell me it can't be done, and don't sit there and blame society or corporate America for mistakes you've made.

You could have paid off some of those collections instead of putting the money aside for the secured card, so the 'poor me' thing just isn't going to cut it. The bad debt is still yours, and if you're just waiting for it to disappear, that is YOUR choice - a completely 'controllable' choice, by the way.

BR's aren't necessarily a 'get out of debt' free card, so don't cry spilt milk over that one, either. Be thankful you didn't have 10-100K of debt you needed to get out from under instead of griping that others had it easier by choosing BR. By the way, the keyword in that sentence is 'CHOSE.'  Pay close attention -- that translates into reactive credit rebuilding by choice, not ignoring debts we know dern good and well we have incurred in our lives. Albeit reactive is not as good or effective as proactive building by staying on top of things to begin with, but it is a choice people make and it shows more responsibility than thinking debts can just be ignored or that we don't have a responsibility to pay them.

I'm not telling you a sob story, I'm telling you facts... not opinions, not blame, not anything but facts. Each of us put ourselves where we are, even considering extenuating circumstances.

Get a grip, buck up, and face your responsibilities with a plan rather than sitting there in the corner through your time out and then coming out with a temper tantrum when the teacher didn't give you a lollipop for 10 minutes of good behavior.

Sorry to the mods and the rest of you if my post is a little harsh, but it's not my fault... he made me do it!!!

: )

Carry on...

Message Edited by SoulSmilen on 03-28-2007 12:23 AM

[Anonymous]

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@SoulSmilen wrote:

Ugh.. I read this thread and my fingers just won't stay off the keyboard...

New World, what a crock - plain and simple. There isn't much in this world that is uncontrollable, and believe me, I'm not preaching without knowing what it's like and where you've been. The bottom line is, you COULD have controlled the bad debt to begin with by being prepared for hard times. You're not in that boat alone; almost all of us here have a story and reasons why we have bad marks on our credit. You are not unique, and you are not a victim. Did you have a savings account or 401K you could fall back on when you faced your hard times? Obviously not. Is that your fault? You're dern right it is - no ifs, and's, or buts.

All I can say is the corporate elite must love people like you. Do they pay you to write that stuff?

I don't consider myself to be God, thus I don't hold myself responsible for everything that happens to me. The Universe does not operate at my beck and call, but hey, if you think it operates at yours, you just go right on ahead blaming yourself for everything that happens. And while you're at it, what with this global warming and the high price of gasoline--must be YOUR fault too, go do something about it already! Ladies and gents, we've found the person who is responsible for EVERYTHING that goes on in the world! Someone phone CNN and Faux News! Can I be your publicist?

You really think that most working-class people in this country can afford to have a savings account big enough to cover every conceivable catastrophic event that comes along in life. I don't know about you, buddy, but a good third of the American working class are just trying to stay afloat. That's reality on the streets of America. Were you raised on the golf course and then "broadened" by occasional trips to the yacht club? This is how the rest of us live.

No offense, but I think you're so far out of touch with reality that it's useless having a discussion with you.

(And I, too, apologize if that was harsh, but after the quoted post, I do believe I was entitled to a riposte...)

[Anonymous]

SoulSmilen,

  I am not offended by your post at all. Someone needed to say something. Ever since New World has been posting he has been nothing but a CANCER, to everyone on here looking to correct their mistakes.

New World,

  You are pretty much preaching to the choir, stop it. Haven't you ever heard the expression if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say it. You are spreading negativity thru these posts like a wildfire.

Ok, OK, Ok.... we got it already FICO is out to get you. Go to Africa and be on the beach with your beautiful wife already, why wait for another 3 years, go now? Since you seem to have everything else figured out. See ya later SirRobin.

Stop giving your negative advice to people (obviously you can not help them) who are actually trying to change their situations and not blaming someone else.

If you have not noticed in all of years there are to be rules and regulations to everything you do, if you chose to bend or break them you have to suffer the consequences. Hence, that is what is happening to you.

 I bet anything, if you are calling those collection agencies (that keep re-reporting) with the negative attitude you have been spreading on here this is exactly why they are re-reporting because your attitude STINKS.

Now my question is, shouldn't you be mad at the collection agencies (not really) and not FICO? They are the ones re-reporting and causing your credit score to sit at a stand-still.

On top of all of that, if you have enough money to pay cash for a house in Africa, shouldn't you have $900 to stop them from doing the same thing over and over.

Oh yeah, I forgot you don't care about your credit. MISERY LOVES COMPANY!!!

BTW,  shouldn't you be on the phone with Mr. President (instead of wasting your time on this forum, with people like us who don't understand the system[yeah right]), telling him how FICO has black-balled you for not paying your bills <gasp>.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

SoulSmilen,

I am not offended by your post at all. Someone needed to say something. Ever since New World has been posting he has been nothing but a CANCER, to everyone on here looking to correct their mistakes.

Hey, I love you too man. :snickers:

New World,

You are pretty much preaching to the choir, stop it. Haven't you ever heard the expression if you don't have anything nice to say then don't say it. You are spreading negativity thru these posts like a wildfire.

Ok, OK, Ok.... we got it already FICO is out to get you.

I'm just telling it like it is. If you don't like the weather, don't blame the weatherman. The FACT is I have almost a year of on-time payments on my credit card accounts, and my FICO is five points LOWER today than it was a year ago. Figures don't lie.

Go to Africa and be on the beach with your beautiful wife already, why wait for another 3 years, go now? Since you seem to have everything else figured out. See ya later SirRobin.

Stop giving your negative advice to people (obviously you can not help them) who are actually trying to change their situations and not blaming someone else.

Hey pal, all I'm doing is counseling people not to waste their time and money spitting into the wind. If you've got some late pays and a credit score of 625, yeah, by all means go try and improve your credit. It might take four or five years, but hey, there's hope. But once you get charge-offs, forget about it. Your best approach is to not waste your time and money on annual fees for low-end credit cards and paying the charge-offs when FICO couldn't care less. Once you have charge-offs, the FICO system is designed to IGNORE any positive steps you take.

If you have not noticed in all of years there are to be rules and regulations to everything you do, if you chose to bend or break them you have to suffer the consequences. Hence, that is what is happening to you.

I bet anything, if you are calling those collection agencies (that keep re-reporting) with the negative attitude you have been spreading on here this is exactly why they are re-reporting because your attitude STINKS.

Okay, so I broke the rules by having bad luck happen to me. I had an illness and lost my job. Shame on me. You know, I'll really try harder next time not to get an inherited disease. I'll pick a different mother next time I come around. There, that make you happy now?

I called the collection agencies and offered to settle in full IF they removed the debt from my CR. I was polite. THEY were the ones who were rude to me, telling me that they couldn't help "deadbeats" (their words) like me clear their credit scores because then "everyone would have perfect credit." Well boohoo! Yeah, at that point, I did tell them to go perform carnal acts on themselves and I hung up. I treat people they way they treat me. The collection agencies could have worked with me to SOLVE THE BLEEPING PROBLEM in a way where we would have both come out ahead. But no--they would rather rub my nose in it for ten years than SOLVE THE PROBLEM. So it's THEIR attitude that needs adjusting, not mine.

Now my question is, shouldn't you be mad at the collection agencies (not really) and not FICO? They are the ones re-reporting and causing your credit score to sit at a stand-still.

On top of all of that, if you have enough money to pay cash for a house in Africa, shouldn't you have $900 to stop them from doing the same thing over and over.

Oh yeah, I forgot you don't care about your credit.

I'm mad at the whole system. And I do blame FICO in part, because their system LETS the collection agencies REPEATEDLY trash my credit. And yeah, I've got $900, but why in the heck should I GIVE my money away to people who ATTACK me and refuse to co-operate in any way, shape or form?

MISERY LOVES COMPANY!!!

BTW, shouldn't you be on the phone with Mr. President (instead of wasting your time on this forum, with people like us who don't understand the system[yeah right]), telling him how FICO has black-balled you for not paying your bills .

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Hey, I've got lots to say about the President and the lousy government of this soon-to-be EX superpower, but Barry probably wants to keep this a family forum, so I'll refrain from posting it out of respect for him.

[Anonymous]

New World,

I have to wonder about your credibility here...Initially, when you talked about multiple listing on same credit I hoped to learn something, since this applies to me also. Yes, it is aggravating, and frustrating, but this is not something that has EVER caused me to think of going elsewhere. I also find your reasons for moving to be VERY weak.

Your main gripe is the relisting of debt. So if the debt was not being relisted your scores would increase.

You have the ability to stop this from occurring by paying off the debt.

You could have done this, thus ending the cycle, but because you did not like the way that you were

treated, you decided against this. I actually question this whole story of yours as I go on here...

" called the collection agencies and offered to settle in full IF they removed the debt from my CR. I was polite. THEY were the ones who were rude to me, telling me that they couldn't help "deadbeats" (their words) like me clear their credit scores because then "everyone would have perfect credit." Well boohoo! Yeah, at that point, I did tell them to go perform carnal acts on themselves and I hung up. I treat people they way they treat me. The collection agencies could have worked with me to SOLVE THE BLEEPING PROBLEM in a way where we would have both come out ahead. But no--they would rather rub my nose in it for ten years than SOLVE THE PROBLEM. So it's THEIR attitude that needs adjusting, not mine."

First off. you have several debts, and unless they are all with the same CA, you are saying that they all responded this way??

I find it VERY hard to believe that they would refuse money and doubt that they care about the credit scores of people. This makes absolutely no sense at all!

The final straw for me really believing you are not at all a sensible, realistic person.

"I'm mad at the whole system. And I do blame FICO in part, because their system LETS the collection agencies REPEATEDLY trash my credit. And yeah, I've got $900, but why in the heck should I GIVE my money away to people who ATTACK me and refuse to co-operate in any way, shape or form?"

HELLOOOOOO!!!!

GIVE your money away????!!!

You OWE that money... it was GIVEN to you based on your agreement to pay it back.

when you violated this contract, and the ONLY attempt to fullfill your obligation was contingent on asking them to do you a favor. I can only shake my head over your reasoning... 

Your belief that you have a good grasp of this situation and that you are able to advise others in a beneficial way is whacked!! 

Credit Repair 101 says:

" ALWAYS and ONLY negotiate  in writing, NEVER on the phone. "

Of course, then you would need to make up a new excuse to use for not paying your debt.

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

New World,

I have to wonder about your credibility here...Initially, when you talked about multiple listing on same credit I hoped to learn something, since this applies to me also. Yes, it is aggravating, and frustrating, but this is not something that has EVER caused me to think of going elsewhere. I also find your reasons for moving to be VERY weak.

To each his or her own. I'm moving because I'm tired of my name being on a blacklist, and because my fiance can get a loan over there to build us a three-bedroom home overlooking the Indian Ocean for $40,000. Even assuming I live long enough to see a FICO score high enough to get a good interest rate on a mortgage--a rather dubious proposition--that's a deal that just doesn't exist here.

Your main gripe is the relisting of debt. So if the debt was not being relisted your scores would increase.

That's what they tell me, yes.

You have the ability to stop this from occurring by paying off the debt. You could have done this, thus ending the cycle, but because you did not like the way that you were treated, you decided against this.

Yeah, like paying it off would change anything. FICO doesn't care if you pay a charge-off. Then I get to hound the collection agency and credit bureau for months and months, only to (probably) have them sell the debt to another agency and start the whole game of Whack-a-Mole all over again.

I actually question this whole story of yours as I go on here... " called the collection agencies and offered to settle in full IF they removed the debt from my CR. I was polite. THEY were the ones who were rude to me, telling me that they couldn't help "deadbeats" (their words) like me clear their credit scores because then "everyone would have perfect credit." Well boohoo! Yeah, at that point, I did tell them to go perform carnal acts on themselves and I hung up. I treat people they way they treat me. The collection agencies could have worked with me to SOLVE THE BLEEPING PROBLEM in a way where we would have both come out ahead. But no--they would rather rub my nose in it for ten years than SOLVE THE PROBLEM. So it's THEIR attitude that needs adjusting, not mine."First off. you have several debts, and unless they are all with the same CA, you are saying that they all responded this way??

Okay, so only one used the actual word "deadbeat," but they all had the same attitude. One used a word I won't repeat here. And I stand by the rest of my story. I offered them ALL payment in exchange for removing the debt from my CR. All refused.

I find it VERY hard to believe that they would refuse money and doubt that they care about the credit scores of people. This makes absolutely no sense at all!

That was the very point I was making; thanks for noticing. It made no business sense at all for all these collection agencies to turn down my money just to be able to go on punishing me until the middle of the next decade, but that's exactly what they did.

HELLOOOOOO!!!! GIVE your money away????!!! You OWE that money... it was GIVEN to you based on your agreement to pay it back. when you violated this contract, and the ONLY attempt to fullfill your obligation was contingent on asking them to do you a favor. I can only shake my head over your reasoning...

Hey, the world violated me in ways I'm not even going to begin to go into here, and what did I get? Squat. So pardon me if I don't cry an ocean of tears for these poor multinational corporations.

Your belief that you have a good grasp of this situation and that you are able to advise others in a beneficial way is whacked!!

Why, because I don't toe the party line?

Credit Repair 101 says: " ALWAYS and ONLY negotiate in writing, NEVER on the phone.

Agreed, and I certainly wouldn't have given them one thin dime without the "pay for delete" arrangement being stipulated in writing. But I called them because that's how modern people communicate: telephones. Some companies who don't drag their corporate knuckles every other step have gone further to use this technology called the INTERNET. Not my fault that lawyers refuse to enter the 20th century (now that it's the 21st) and use modern communications technology.

Of course, then you would need to make up a new excuse to use for not paying your debt.

And I'll say it again: FICO doesn't care if you pay debt or not. And that $900 is going to go toward my airfare, not to people who dedicate themselves to making my life miserable.

[Anonymous]

"Hey, the world violated me in ways I'm not even going to begin to go into here..."

Oh please do!

[Anonymous]

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@Anonymous wrote:

"Hey, the world violated me in ways I'm not even going to begin to go into here..."

Oh please do!

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No thanks...and besides, this is a family forum.