Now that I got approved for the Freedom Rise, can someone answer a quick Chase question for me?

[Jnbmom]

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Jnbmom wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Aim_High wrote:

For full transparency in the discussion, @MikeyMagic, I'm going to ask a couple of pointed questions.  No accusations but just so we understand.  Do you prefer to take the cash versus check for some specific reason?  Are any income taxes being withheld at payout?  Are you paying your full taxes due to the IRS on your income?  I'm not familiar with income streams like this, but I do suspect it could raise many red flags.

• For most of the past century, large payments including most payroll deposits have been made by paper checks or electronic transfers.  More and more, even smaller transactions are handled electronically and without cash.  Large cash movements are exceedingly rare these days. 

• Transactions in all or mostly cash are suspicious.   Even before the modern advent of primarily electronic payments, cash-only has made tracing the source more difficult and has often been used in illegal or criminal activity.  Cash can be used in money laundering.  What you are doing may be perfectly legal, but using large cash payments or deposits automatically would lead an auditor to questions. 

• The >Bank Secrecy Act (officially called the Currency and Foreign Transactions Reporting Act of 1970)<  requires federal reporting of cash deposits over $10K.  Now, you may deposit less than that amount, but that could also give the appearance of trying to skirt the reporting rules of this law if cumulative deposits over the course of months or years are well in excess of $10K.
  

• After the terrorist attacks of 9/11, changes in US law required financial institutions to exercise greater due diligence and increasing federal reporting so-as to prevent terrorist activity.   >The USA Patriot Act of 2001, Title III< is specifically aimed at money laundering as it related to terrorist causes.  Combined with the growth of the internet and web-based financial transactions in that same time-frame, that's why lenders often seem highly skeptical about proof of identify when applying for new credit.  And that's another reason why they may be more suspicious and inquisitive about unusual transactions. 

• Even if you are being completely forthright about your income and paying taxes, be aware that the Internal Revenue Service has >vigorous oversight of suspicious activity< as a precursor to prosecution of tax fraud.  (Note the specific references to that Bank Secrecy Act and money laundering statutes in the link I provided.)  If I were you, I would keep extensive records of that income as the large cash deposits may greatly increase your odds of a tax audit. 

• The Chase account is just an aside to all of the above.   All of the above issues would/could apply to any financial institution where you're making large cash deposits.   If you're doing everything on the up-and-up, you might want to reconsider the cash payment / deposit route. 

---

I take the cash because I have read countless stories and know of people who deposit large amounts of money in a bank account through a check and the money gets frozen. Or when I want to withdrawl $15000 to gamble its gonna raise all sorts of red flags and lots of times these banks make it really difficult and annoying to take money out in that size. So I prefer having the cash, put it in a safety deposit box and can go and take money when I want to gamble.

In the gambling community people don't question cash at all. Everywhere else it just causes many more problems. 

Lastly speaking for myself, for years I was down and out and ruined my credit and got evicted and was homeless for long periods and had no bank account. I have been using cash almost exclusively for over 2 decades so I am very comfortable with it. And it just seems like all these financial institutions have taken fraud concerns to sky high levels and I don't want to be part of it. The fact that Cap1 restricted my account because I "paid my bill multiple times in a day" shows exactly what I am talking about. I can't even make 2 payments on my credit card bill in 1 day without having fraud depts needing to get involved. It's beyond ridiculous at this point.

---

Do you file  on all your winnings and pay taxes on it?

---

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Well if you don't file taxes and have proof of income , this can be an issue down the road when creditors may request POI .

[MikeyMagic]

---

@Jnbmom wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Jnbmom wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Aim_High wrote:

For full transparency in the discussion, @MikeyMagic, I'm going to ask a couple of pointed questions.  No accusations but just so we understand.  Do you prefer to take the cash versus check for some specific reason?  Are any income taxes being withheld at payout?  Are you paying your full taxes due to the IRS on your income?  I'm not familiar with income streams like this, but I do suspect it could raise many red flags.

• For most of the past century, large payments including most payroll deposits have been made by paper checks or electronic transfers.  More and more, even smaller transactions are handled electronically and without cash.  Large cash movements are exceedingly rare these days. 

• Transactions in all or mostly cash are suspicious.   Even before the modern advent of primarily electronic payments, cash-only has made tracing the source more difficult and has often been used in illegal or criminal activity.  Cash can be used in money laundering.  What you are doing may be perfectly legal, but using large cash payments or deposits automatically would lead an auditor to questions. 

• The >Bank Secrecy Act (officially called the Currency and Foreign Transactions Reporting Act of 1970)<  requires federal reporting of cash deposits over $10K.  Now, you may deposit less than that amount, but that could also give the appearance of trying to skirt the reporting rules of this law if cumulative deposits over the course of months or years are well in excess of $10K.
  

• After the terrorist attacks of 9/11, changes in US law required financial institutions to exercise greater due diligence and increasing federal reporting so-as to prevent terrorist activity.   >The USA Patriot Act of 2001, Title III< is specifically aimed at money laundering as it related to terrorist causes.  Combined with the growth of the internet and web-based financial transactions in that same time-frame, that's why lenders often seem highly skeptical about proof of identify when applying for new credit.  And that's another reason why they may be more suspicious and inquisitive about unusual transactions. 

• Even if you are being completely forthright about your income and paying taxes, be aware that the Internal Revenue Service has >vigorous oversight of suspicious activity< as a precursor to prosecution of tax fraud.  (Note the specific references to that Bank Secrecy Act and money laundering statutes in the link I provided.)  If I were you, I would keep extensive records of that income as the large cash deposits may greatly increase your odds of a tax audit. 

• The Chase account is just an aside to all of the above.   All of the above issues would/could apply to any financial institution where you're making large cash deposits.   If you're doing everything on the up-and-up, you might want to reconsider the cash payment / deposit route. 

---

I take the cash because I have read countless stories and know of people who deposit large amounts of money in a bank account through a check and the money gets frozen. Or when I want to withdrawl $15000 to gamble its gonna raise all sorts of red flags and lots of times these banks make it really difficult and annoying to take money out in that size. So I prefer having the cash, put it in a safety deposit box and can go and take money when I want to gamble.

In the gambling community people don't question cash at all. Everywhere else it just causes many more problems. 

Lastly speaking for myself, for years I was down and out and ruined my credit and got evicted and was homeless for long periods and had no bank account. I have been using cash almost exclusively for over 2 decades so I am very comfortable with it. And it just seems like all these financial institutions have taken fraud concerns to sky high levels and I don't want to be part of it. The fact that Cap1 restricted my account because I "paid my bill multiple times in a day" shows exactly what I am talking about. I can't even make 2 payments on my credit card bill in 1 day without having fraud depts needing to get involved. It's beyond ridiculous at this point.

---

Do you file  on all your winnings and pay taxes on it?

---

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Well if you don't file taxes and have proof of income , this can be an issue down the road when creditors may request POI .

---

Yeah definitely I have thought of that. I know Amex is known for POI requests and Discover has been doing the 4506-C form requests but that seems to be for identify verification more than income(supposedly).

Luckily for me it doesn't seem from what I've read that most other credit card companies and financial institutions are asking for POI a lot. But if it happens I'll probably be in a bad spot and my account would get closed.

I think I'll be okay as long as I don't keep asking for really big credit lines. I need to stay below the radar and honestly I don't need  $15000 or $25,000 CL's. Give me a few cards once my credit score is really good with $4000-$8000 limits and I'm content.

[Aim_High]

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Oh my, this is quite a pickle, @MikeyMagic.  This is much more serious than wondering if you should deposit cash or not in a Chase account.  I would strongly suggest you consult with a tax attorney.  If this does ever catch up to you, you'll be in a heap of trouble, not only financially with debt to the IRS but perhaps criminal charges given the extent of it.   Either misreporting facts of your income (or) failing to file and pay are felonies.  

The "no steady income" isn't going to be an excuse if you had income over the minimum.  In 2022, the minimum income to report was

• $12,950 (single filer),
• $19,400 (head of household),
• $25,900 (married filing jointly)

That's a pretty low threshold to meet of having to file a return.   Moreover, with your income much higher, you're well above that level.   The levels are adjusted annually so in 2003 or before, the minimums would have been much less.

Losing as well as winning in gambling doesn't negate the requirement to file.  The IRS allows you to offset wins with losses but still requires you to file a return and itemize.  See >IRS: Gambling Income and Losses.<  That $170K that the casino taxed and reported to the IRS may have put you on their radar to watch, even if you've managed to not file taxes for this long without detection.  Again, I would highly suggest you consult with a tax attorney to see how you might straighten out this predicament.  The consequences could be serious. 

[Jnbmom]

I agree with @Aim_High  your chase account is the least of your problems . The IRS usually always get to you just a matter of time . 

[MikeyMagic]

---

@Aim_High wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Oh my, this is quite a pickle, @MikeyMagic.  This is much more serious than wondering if you should deposit cash or not in a Chase account.  I would strongly suggest you consult with a tax attorney.  If this does ever catch up to you, you'll be in a heap of trouble, not only financially with debt to the IRS but perhaps criminal charges given the extent of it.   Either misreporting facts of your income (or) failing to file and pay are felonies.  

The "no steady income" isn't going to be an excuse if you had income over the minimum.  In 2022, the minimum income to report was

• $12,950 (single filer),
• $19,400 (head of household),
• $25,900 (married filing jointly)

That's a pretty low threshold to meet of having to file a return.   Moreover, with your income much higher, you're well above that level.   The levels are adjusted annually so in 2003 or before, the minimums would have been much less.

Losing as well as winning in gambling doesn't negate the requirement to file.  The IRS allows you to offset wins with losses but still requires you to file a return and itemize.  See >IRS: Gambling Income and Losses.<  That $170K that the casino taxed and reported to the IRS may have put you on their radar to watch, even if you've managed to not file taxes for this long without detection.  Again, I would highly suggest you consult with a tax attorney to see how you might straighten out this predicament.  The consequences could be serious. 

---

Okay thanks for the advice. Probably shared too much about my struggles and personal life here. 

[Aim_High]

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Aim_High wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Oh my, this is quite a pickle, @MikeyMagic.  This is much more serious than wondering if you should deposit cash or not in a Chase account.  I would strongly suggest you consult with a tax attorney.  If this does ever catch up to you, you'll be in a heap of trouble, not only financially with debt to the IRS but perhaps criminal charges given the extent of it.   Either misreporting facts of your income (or) failing to file and pay are felonies ...

---

Okay thanks for the advice. Probably shared too much about my struggles and personal life here. 

---

We aren't judging, so you didn't share too much.  It's an anonymous forum.  Sharing what you did may have allowed us to help you out better.  We do care and try to help those looking for advice.  Let us know what you find out. 

[MikeyMagic]

---

@Jnbmom wrote:

I agree with @Aim_High  your chase account is the least of your problems . The IRS usually always get to you just a matter of time . 

---

The IRS is not gonna "get to me" just stop. I've had a terrible last 23 years of my life and the $170,000 I won a bunch was taken out by the casinos for taxes and I lost a lot back. Believe me, you could disagree but the IRS has plenty of bigger fish to fry than someone who lost everything in 1999 and was living on the streets for 20 years and luckily won a good amount of money and lost most of it back. I was able to get a place to live with a portion of the money. 

So fine, if the IRS wants to come after me no problem. 

[Aim_High]

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

  ... the $170,000 I won a bunch was taken out by the casinos for taxes and I lost a lot back.

 ... Believe me, you could disagree but the IRS has plenty of bigger fish to fry

---

What year did you get the big $170K win?   As I mentioned, losing a lot back would still need to be documented.  

Please don't discount how "big of a fish" you have to be for IRS to take interest.  They will follow up on any leads, regardless of the size.  Sure, they like to catch the big fish but they won't throw a small one back if he's on the hook.  If you're proactive with working through a tax attorney, you might be able to minimize the damage.  You'll probably resolve this issue more leniently if they aren't the ones to find it through an audit or investigation.   Read >this link<  from H&R Block.  Most taxpayers don't go to prison over tax evasion; however, those who do more often haven't filed tax returns at all and have a pattern of willful evasion over years. 

Again, we aren't judging but we're trying to help you out.  

Congratulations on finally getting yourself off the street and turning things around.  We're just trying to help you further along the way.  Many of us have been through hard times or challenges of some type, and there are some in our forum who have been homeless like yourself. 

[Jnbmom]

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Jnbmom wrote:

I agree with @Aim_High  your chase account is the least of your problems . The IRS usually always get to you just a matter of time . 

---

The IRS is not gonna "get to me" just stop. I've had a terrible last 23 years of my life and the $170,000 I won a bunch was taken out by the casinos for taxes and I lost a lot back. Believe me, you could disagree but the IRS has plenty of bigger fish to fry than someone who lost everything in 1999 and was living on the streets for 20 years and luckily won a good amount of money and lost most of it back. I was able to get a place to live with a portion of the money. 

So fine, if the IRS wants to come after me no problem. 

---

Fine just giving advice. Take or leave it 

[MikeyMagic]

---

@Aim_High wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

---

@Aim_High wrote:

---

@MikeyMagic wrote:

I haven't paid taxes in 20+ years because I was homeless and had no steady income. I had people put me in poker tournaments and stake me in cash games and I would win a little and lose it back. When I won the $170,000 that was taxed by the casinos.

---

Oh my, this is quite a pickle, @MikeyMagic.  This is much more serious than wondering if you should deposit cash or not in a Chase account.  I would strongly suggest you consult with a tax attorney.  If this does ever catch up to you, you'll be in a heap of trouble, not only financially with debt to the IRS but perhaps criminal charges given the extent of it.   Either misreporting facts of your income (or) failing to file and pay are felonies ...

---

Okay thanks for the advice. Probably shared too much about my struggles and personal life here. 

---

We aren't judging, so you didn't share too much.  It's an anonymous forum.  Sharing what you did may have allowed us to help you out better.  We do care and try to help those looking for advice.  Let us know what you find out. 

---

Maybe you or someone else could answer this but the more I research Chase and "cash" the more I think this checking account I just opened with them might not be the best decision. Would closing a checking account soon after opening it hurt my credit? Also would Chase cancel my Rise credit card if I close the checking account? What I am now thinking of doing is opening a bank account at a smaller bank near me like Citizens. 

I just read an article that pretty much stated in no uncertain terms that Chase and CASH do not mix if you get what I'm saying. They don't want to see lots of cash deposits to their checking accounts because they'll be concerned it's money laundering. I guess I'm just scared if I close this checking account Chase will cancel my Rise card soon after. What do you think?

Here's a blurb from that article I read:

Chase is a bank that is not keen on cash. Large amounts of cash transactions are likely to get Chase’s attention. The main reason is suspicions of money laundering. One thing to note is that there is not a large difference between money orders (MOs) and cash to Chase. Depositing too much of either of these is likely to lead to some sort of investigation that could end poorly. We aren’t saying that your accounts will definitely be closed if you deposit cash to Chase, there are plenty of legitimate reasons that one might be doing this, but large amounts of cash deposits was one of the common threads to people who had their accounts closed.

In short, you’d better avoid Chase when you are making multiple transactions involving cash, that goes for quantity and amount. As long as Chase catches you with suspicion about money laundering, they can and often will close all your accounts.