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Reducing utilization and scoring impact

Regular Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

Your AAoA is much older than mine, # of accts is much more, and I have no real-estate history. So I would imagine as I went over the 700 mark, I would start falling farther and farther behind my chart without those key ingrediants. As I stated before, these are averages of the scores for peoples at those UTIL levels, so i think it would make sense that most people would have to have those key ingredients plus a low util to get there. I think that sort of makes my chart worthless in predicting a result over 700.

 

I think it worked for me in the 600 - 700 range because most people in that range are going to have the same kind of hairballs on their cr's as I have on mine, meaning the no real estate, AAoA, 5 baddies, high util, etc... I will continue to play with it and will update if I see something interesting.  My baddies will all be off in November, I have 5 cc's now with a tcl of 16k. I am going tomorrow to get a secured loan tomorrow (if its not an HP) so I can pay off the las of my cc balance ($1,100) which will make my util zero and add an installment loan to give me 3 types of accts ( I do have two auto loans too, perfect payments on everything for 6 years.)

 

I really appreciate you sharing your information, the sharing that goes on here really escalates the learning process for all of us. Thanks so much!

 

I think i would like to change my name, how would I go about doing that? I would like more anonymity...

EQ - 717 TU-724 EX -725>
Message 21 of 35
Valued Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

BBS -

 

My guess is you are near a "ceiling" on your assigned scorecard and may have accumulated some type of buffer which masks the impact of utilization. Open mortgages/real estate loans do appear to dampen score fluctuations. Your 7 AAoA could be adding some stability as well.

 

You mention only having 2 open revolving accounts. I wonder if aggregate utilization for files having 1 or 2 cards is assigned less weight than aggregate utilization for files having 5, 10 or 20 cards. Just  a thought.

Fico 8: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 9: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 4 .....:. EQ 809 TU 823 EX 830 EX Fico 98: 842
VS 3.0:...... EQ 835 TU 835 EX 835
Fico 8 BC:. EQ 892 TU 900 EX 900
CBIS: ........EQ LN Auto 940 EQ LN Home 870 TU Auto 902 TU Home 950
Message 22 of 35
Super Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

TT, I had 2 open revolvers, I now have 6.  At the time I took my utilization down significantly it was just before apping for my other 4 accounts several months back.  My intent was to lower my utilization to increase my scores prior to my mini app "spree" but I only gained about 3 points on each bureau.  I was approved for all 4 new accounts so mission accomplished in the end.  I've raised my overall credit limit by about $80k, so at this point I'm not really willing to report near 40% aggregate utilization again to see what type of score change I'd get as I'd plunge myself into debt, lol.

Message 23 of 35
Community Leader
Super Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact


terryj wrote:
I am going tomorrow to get a secured loan tomorrow (if its not an HP) so I can pay off the las of my cc balance ($1,100) which will make my util zero and add an installment loan to give me 3 types of accts ( I do have two auto loans too, perfect payments on everything for 6 years.)

..


A few quick thoughts and questions:

 

You don't want to have a utilization of 0%.  No reason not to pay all your cards to $0, but you should keep using one card after that for at least $10 worth of purchases.  That way FICO will give you a util of 1%, which it likes much better than 0%.

 

You mention that the new loan you are considering will be a secured loan.  What are you using to secure the loan?  Perhaps one of your cars? 

 

Are your two auto loans both closed?  FICO likes you to have at least one open installment loan.  My guess is that closed auto loans with a long clean payment history likely help the "auto" flavor of FICO scores, but aside from that closed loans help you much less than you might expect with respect to Credit Mix.  Below is a link that describes how to use a Share Secure loan to raise your scores (if you have no open installment loans).  It will also give you some conceptual structure for understanding how installment loans and the amounts owed on them work in general with respect to FICO.  You only need to read the first two posts.

 

http://ficoforums.myfico.com/t5/Understanding-FICO-Scoring/Adding-an-installment-loan-the-Share-Secu...

Message 24 of 35
Valued Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact


sjt wrote:

Hi All,

 

Someone mentioned to me that when you reduce our utilization from 75% to less than10% you will get a score bump but not as high as one would think. The scores would gradually increase in the coming months providing you keep your utilization down.

 

Can anyone confirm this.

 

 


UPDATE:

 

After my friend reduced their utilization on his open revolving accounts to 8% from 70%. After the new balances reported scores are the following:

 

Experian:  612

Equifax: 621

Trans Union: 631

 

We simulated scores with the scenario of paying off two charged off debts that are still owned by the original creditor and reporting monthly. The simulated scores are the following:

 

Experian:  622

Equifax: 661

Trans Union: 651

 

The simulated score estimates seem fine for Equifax and Trans Union but seem too low for Experian.

 

Any thoughts on this?

 

 

Message 25 of 35
Highlighted
Super Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

Yes, my first thought is that simulators are garbage so don't believe a thing they say.  You aren't going to gain 10 points on one bureau and 40 on another. 

 

A large change in utilization will impact different profiles different ways.  A simulator can't possibly take enough pieces of data into consideration to make an accurate prediction.

 

Is the profile in question relatively thick or is it thin?  The thicker it is, the lesser the scoring change realized by a dramatic utilization change.

 

If it's a thin file, you may see 20-30 points.  If it's a thick file, you may see 5-10 per bureau.  Just my estimates. 

Message 26 of 35
Valued Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact


sjt wrote:

sjt wrote:

Hi All,

 

Someone mentioned to me that when you reduce our utilization from 75% to less than10% you will get a score bump but not as high as one would think. The scores would gradually increase in the coming months providing you keep your utilization down.

 

Can anyone confirm this.

 

 


UPDATE:

 

After my friend reduced their utilization on his open revolving accounts to 8% from 70%. After the new balances reported scores are the following:

 

Experian:  612

Equifax: 621

Trans Union: 631

 

We simulated scores with the scenario of paying off two charged off debts that are still owned by the original creditor and reporting monthly. The simulated scores are the following:

 

Experian:  622

Equifax: 661

Trans Union: 651

 

The simulated score estimates seem fine for Equifax and Trans Union but seem too low for Experian.

 

Any thoughts on this?

 

 


Hi All,

 

Update:

 

After my friend paid off the charged off debt (still owned by the original creditor and reported monthly) their scores are the following:

 

Experian:

612 to 638. A 26 point increase

 

Equifax:

621 to 659. A 38 point increase

 

Trans Union:

631 to 650. A 19 point increase

 

The Experian simulator was way off. The Equifax and Trans Union were within the margin of error.

 

 

Message 27 of 35
Regular Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

 


sjt wrote:

Thanks all for your responses. They are very insightful.

 

A little background on my friend's credit profile:

 

  • AAOA is 13 years.
  • Several charge-offs from 2011-12, all but two are paid.
  • Last charge-offs paid were in full to the original creditor in 2015, but those accounts were charged off in 2011-12.
  • Two unpaid charge-offs are still owned by the original creditor and reports monthly to all three CRA.
  • Current Experian Score is 606.
  • Utilization is around 70-75%
  • Three open credit cards. one was opened in 2008, the other two in 2015.
  • Action Plan:
    • Pay off the three credit cards.
    • Pay off the charge off in full. Will then show a zero balance, bring accounts to current, and stop monthly reporting. I think the monthly reporting of a charge off balance is suppressing his score.

When we went through the FICO simulator it showed a score bump to 621, a 15 point increase. I though the bump would be higher, considering he is paying off a couple of charge-offs that continue to report monthly.

 

 

 

 


UPDATE: I was concerned about my scores changing as a new car and 2 new cards, inq's and eveything else going on, it was going to be impossibe to relate anything to the chart I posted. All my scores did go up to the high 690's after I got down to 15%, but 2 derogs fell off leaving me 2

I have 6 years perfect payments...all derogs are open and from 2009....falling off now...

 

Then the new car hit. My installment util with both cars went from 15 bl, 30 car tcl for  50%, to 29k tcl and a util 73% 

10 yr oldest; AAoA 4.2yrs

 

5 inq's for car and 2 cc's all 3B

 

 

Which brought me back down to

9/10 15% revolving

EQ; 662 2 derog .....new car and 3 cards reporting, 2 inq

 

TU; 667 2 derog ....new car and 3 cards reporting, 6 inq

 

EX; 675 1 derog....new car and 3 cards reporting, 5 inq

 

10/27: 7% util

EQ; 652 2 derog....new car, 5 cards reporting; 2 inq

 

TU: 696 1 derog....new car, 4 cards reporting; 9 inq

 

EX; 739 0 derog...new car, 4 cards reporting; 6 inq

 

So I believe I am now in a different bucket on EX only, and at 7% util, my chart show s731.

 

IMO as long as you have open derogs, you arent going to get much over 700.

 

Below 700, with baddies seems to track pretty true unless your bads are fairly recent.

 

If you have no baddies, then the over 700 part of the chart seems to be better. Remember this chart is based on a large database of profiles..all that was considered was % of util and the AVERAGE score for the whole group. Obviuosly people with higher score are going to have less hairballs on their reports, and the ones with fair credit are there for a reason

 

My opinions is, jst's friend din't get as many gains as I did, because all my baddies were old and 6 yrs no lates...his are fairly recent. I think what held me back is mine were open. Even though they are falling off as I speak, I was turned down by SDFCU with 6 years no lates and a Fico 2 on EX of 671, they denied because of the one open derog. (it fell off 2 weeks later Smiley Frustrated )

 

YMMV really comes into play on this because everyone's profiles are different. I think my situation is unique, because of my 6 yrs no lates...that keeps that slate clear, so you only have to look at dreogs, util, inq's ect. I am letting my tl's age now..as the derogs all fall off, I am hoping to be in good shape. I was really stunned to see the 739 on EX, I thought I might get up to 720...my AAoA is 2.5yrs now....as a side note, my Fico 9 is 771, car= 780, and card is 781...my fico 9's before were all much less than fico 8

 

EQ - 717 TU-724 EX -725>
Message 28 of 35
Valued Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact


Stryder wrote:

 


 


UPDATE: I was concerned about my scores changing as a new car and 2 new cards, inq's and eveything else going on, it was going to be impossibe to relate anything to the chart I posted. All my scores did go up to the high 690's after I got down to 15%, but 2 derogs fell off leaving me 2

I have 6 years perfect payments...all derogs are open and from 2009....falling off now...

 

Then the new car hit. My installment util with both cars went from 15 bl, 30 car tcl for  50%, to 29k tcl and a util 73% 

10 yr oldest; AAoA 4.2yrs

 

5 inq's for car and 2 cc's all 3B

 

Which brought me back down to 9/10 15% revolving

 

EQ; 662 2 derog .....new car and 3 cards reporting, 2 inq

TU; 667 2 derog ....new car and 3 cards reporting, 6 inq

EX; 675 1 derog....new car and 3 cards reporting, 5 inq

 

10/27: 7% util

EQ; 652 2 derog....new car, 5 cards reporting; 2 inq

TU: 696 1 derog....new car, 4 cards reporting; 9 inq

EX; 739 0 derog...new car, 4 cards reporting; 6 inq

 

So I believe I am now in a different bucket on EX only, and at 7% util, my chart show s 731.

 

IMO as long as you have open derogs, you arent going to get much over 700.

 

Below 700, with baddies seems to track pretty true unless your bads are fairly recent.

 


You can get in the 740 to 760 score range with a derog on file but, it is much easier with no derogs on file [Note: generally, a 30 day late delinquency won't prevent proviles from a being a non derog scorecard]

Fico 8: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 9: .......EQ 850 TU 850 EX 850
Fico 4 .....:. EQ 809 TU 823 EX 830 EX Fico 98: 842
VS 3.0:...... EQ 835 TU 835 EX 835
Fico 8 BC:. EQ 892 TU 900 EX 900
CBIS: ........EQ LN Auto 940 EQ LN Home 870 TU Auto 902 TU Home 950
Message 29 of 35
Regular Contributor

Re: Reducing utilization and scoring impact

You can get in the 740 to 760 score range with a derog on file but, it is much easier with no derogs on file [Note: generally, a 30 day late delinquency won't prevent proviles from a being a non derog scorecard]  was the derog old and Paid? IMO.... my EX is now clean and 739 and with the 7 yr old, $2,400 open derog, its was 679 fico 8 2 days before the jump, as far as I could see...nohing else changed. I think they open derogs are killers...

 

thats good to know on the 30 day... I  guess even if it's a 90 days late it's still not a derog, but just a late?

 

As always, thanks TT!

EQ - 717 TU-724 EX -725>
Message 30 of 35